It was a general point. I wasn't calling any specific person a 'coward' just an appropriate description of those who want these people to be rendered unarmed from the comfort of their own home. While you apparently do believe that, I'm not sure that inferring that you'd hit someone if they said it in person would really help the Ukranian people a great deal. That's not the kind of arming I had in mind, though I'm sure the Kremlin would appreciate your continued service. For future reference, I'm not remotely concerned about being physical attacked for stating a basic opinion because it creates a very unambigeous situation where it is fair and required to reply in kind to the point where there is an understanding that a repeat isn't the best idea.

Allowing the Ukranian people to defend themselves is not an encouragement of nuclear war. It is an much a wake up call as to what is a realistic 'win' for Putin (as the yes men fall away) and may itself bring about a solution that would not have otherwise be found. Forcing Ukraine into an unarmed situation where they would have to roll over nationally (and the dangerous places that itself could lead for them and others) isn't much of a sure fire solution either. Maybe it is to armchair commanders but we have to have the humility to say that really don't know where either approach will lead or what comes next.

Drunk on his own delusional ideas of their military let us not forget that Putin initially attempted to sweep through the country to the Capital, and so any talk of this being limited or only 'liberating' Donbass etc was nonsense all along. I'm not sure that letting them endlessly push on completely unopposed with ease is the best idea. Time will tell. It's not like we're part of the decision making process. We watch.

Edited by BlueJay (06 May 2022 3.19pm)

Zelensky outlines possible peace deal concessions

The Ukrainian president says that he would accept a peace deal in which Russian troops returned to the positions they held the day before the fully-fledged invasion began in February.

When asked by the BBC's Frank Gardner what the "minimum" concession from Russia would be in return for peace, Zelensky responded: "A return of Russian forces to where they were on 23 Feb."

"But for this to happen there needs to be diplomatic dialogue," he added. "From our side, not all the diplomatic bridges have been burnt."

Zelensky did not specifically mention Crimea, which was annexed by Russia in 2014 - but his response signals a willingness to acknowledge Russian control of the peninsula as part of a peace settlement.

It's also not clear what this would mean for the areas of Donetsk and Luhansk in Ukraine's east which have been partly under the control of pro-Russian separatist since 2014 too.

Can't see Putin going for this, but clearly if you give an inch they will take a mile, so within negotiations its a position at least. It's hard to fully 'cave' in a situation where you're still fighting as territory is ripped away by force. I can see why giving too much might be seen as an encouragement of further future pushes. Perhaps there is a sweet spot of acceptance for both sides that falls short of that. Though again if there is, I can't help but think that us helping them stall Russias advances will have been what got us there.

Sweden says it received U.S. security assurances if it hands in NATO application - [Link]

Sweden has received assurances from the United States that it would receive support during the period a potential application to join NATO is processed by the 30 nations in the alliance, Foreign Minister Ann Linde said in Washington on Wednesday.

Sweden and neighbour Finland stayed out of NATO during the Cold War, but Russia's annexation of Crimea in 2014 and its invasion of Ukraine have led the countries to rethink their security policies, with NATO membership looking increasingly likely.

Both countries are concerned they would be vulnerable during an application process, which could take up to a year to be approved by all NATO's members.

"Naturally, I'm not going to go into any details, but I feel very sure that now we have an American assurance," Linde told Swedish TV from Washington after meeting U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken.

"However, not concrete security guarantees, those you can only get if you are a full member of NATO," she added.

Linde declined to say what assurances she had received from Blinken.

"They would mean that Russia can be clear that if they direct any kind of negative activities against Sweden, which they have threatened, it would not be something that the U.S. would just allow to happen ... without a response," she said.

Modern frigate, not area coverage AAW, BUT it should have been able to deal with a sub sonic missile.

I said early on in this conflict that I agreed with arming the Ukraine against Russia. I now think I was wrong. Now I agree with Orban that this worsens an already bad situation.

Initially the Ukraine did well against Russia's tactics....which were more geared towards overthrowing the Zelensky regime than they were knocking down cities. However that tactic failed and now its about the east and south of the country where most of the Russia support base is.

The threat of nuclear war has clearly been considerably increased. I think anyone denying that isn't dealing with the reality of the situation.

The Ukraine isn't in Nato but the argument has been made that Russia invading the Ukraine is worth an economic cold war, huge inflation increases, billions of pounds of military equipment into a corrupt country which could later be turned on us, significant nuclear threat increase and essentially keeping a war going instead of serious negotiations that provide realistic solutions.....not de facto unrealistic ones.

As long as those who support these responses remain consistent through the hardship over these months and years then while regarding their view as seriously damaging I will at least respect that this was the hill they were willing to sacrifice on....it just isn't mine.

Treating Putin like a hate figure is not dealing with realpolitik. Again, I have to refer to the Yemen for the huge double standards here. It's like whatever the media direct their attention there is a civilian army quite willing to nod along...even when many of them have openly acknowledged that the same media lies to them whenever it wants.

I'm no fan of Putin, however efforts to unseat him are likely to put us in more danger, not less.

Huge risks being taken on a bad hand in my view.....all or nothing merchants are not wise custodians of civilisation.

Edited by Stirlingsays (07 May 2022 5.16am)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

I am fully aware of the limited audience and, in your case, very grateful for that.

Nevertheless, the point is valid. Planting a seed anywhere can grow into a forest. Regrettably, you aren't alone, and small voices, when in chorus with others, can make a lot of noise.

When that noise is distracting and disturbing everyone who encounters it, even in small corners like this one, has the right, and I believe a duty, to put a damper on it and turn the volume down, and with luck, right off.

I don't restrict this kind of comment to here! I make it wherever I encounter it.

When people are ready to listen to your music then is the time to offer it to them.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.