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silvertop Portishead 24 Sep 19 1.27pm
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger I have been watching the BBC News for the last hour and they have not interviewed a single Brexit supporter. It's just a succession of Remainers. I suspect it is more down to availability as team brexit licks their wounds and decides on a united reply.
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silvertop

Portishead 24 Sep 19 1.27pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

I have been watching the BBC News for the last hour and they have not interviewed a single Brexit supporter. It's just a succession of Remainers.

I suspect it is more down to availability as team brexit licks their wounds and decides on a united reply.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 24 Sep 19 1.28pm
Originally posted by Matov Well yes. We are scheduled to be leaving on October 31st. Parliament decided to stop that happening. And now it will make that happen. They so decided because they weren't satisfied that the arrangements being made were satisfactory. As that is their responsibility it was their duty to act. This is not all about Brexit and never has been. Brexit is just the stage upon which the action is set. This is all about who really runs the country, the appointed government or the elected Parliament. Lets not all beat around the bush on this. Johnson prorogued Parliament because he wanted to honour his pledge to the 17.4 million people who voted Leave. That is, of course, true. Let's hope no-one now tries to defend why it was done. The vote in June 23rd was not predecated with a requirement that it could only happen if a deal was struck with the EU. Ditto with Article 50. It is only now, at a later date, that Parliament has decided to add that proviso. Untrue. Parliament never expressed an opinion until all the issues were identified. Them having been they reacted, as they must. We all learn things as time passes. Parliament is no different. We don't do things today in exactly the same way that we used to do 100 years because we now know more. Why do you want to tie Parliament's hands to all they knew in 2016? Johnson has offered Parliament a General Election. It has declined. Political ruses which produce undesirable results need to be identified and countered. Parliament wishes to stop Brexit from happening. I know that, you know that, we all know that. And these 11 judges have handed it the right to do that. Both untrue. Parliament as a whole wants to stop a "no deal" Brexit from happening. Despite there probably being a personal majority among MPs for remain there is a Parliamentary majority in favour of us leaving but with a "deal", because of the commitments they have made. The Judges have just done their job and allowed the law to speak. It is nice and clear cut. Their votes trump those of the 17.4 million. You should be celebrating that. That is how our system of Governance operates. It does NO such thing. Their unanimous vote follows the law. It expresses no opinion on who voted for leave or remain. You are attempting to conflate two totally separate matters. Me, I want to see it destroyed. Razed to the ground. Any institution that can seek to ignore the wishes of 17.4 million votes cast in the single biggest ever exercise in British democracy is only worthy of my utter contempt, especially since it will not submit itself to a General Election despite constant pleadings from its major parties for that to happen. Whatever you think of the validity of the referendum result, and it's importance versus Parliamentary sovereignty, this judgement has nothing whatsoever to do with it. Despite more Johnson blather to the contrary. Government's need to abide by the law, just as we all do. I despise it. I loathe those 11 judges. And I want it now consigned to the history books. Then choose a Parliament who agrees with you! That's how our democracy works. It is now going to submit us to a second referendum with the losing 'Remain' option still on the paper. It is going to be an utter farce but what do they care? No-one know yet what will happen. Maybe the government will actually agree a deal which Parliament can accept. Doesn't seem likely but who knows in these strange days? That they care is obvious. No-one submits themselves to this just for fun! You are getting your wish. Enjoy the moment. Dance for joy. This is your special day. Whilst there is certainly a feeling of relief that the rule of law has spoken and the correct procedures will now be followed I don't sense any triumphalism. Just a resolute determination to make sure that we get things moving so that Parliament can oversee, question and hold government to account. No-one wants people to be so angry because of their misunderstandings about how our system works. Which is what is the whole problem here. Edited by Matov (24 Sep 2019 12.25pm) Edited by Wisbech Eagle (24 Sep 2019 1.33pm) For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 24 Sep 19 1.28pm

Originally posted by Matov

Well yes. We are scheduled to be leaving on October 31st. Parliament decided to stop that happening. And now it will make that happen.

They so decided because they weren't satisfied that the arrangements being made were satisfactory. As that is their responsibility it was their duty to act. This is not all about Brexit and never has been. Brexit is just the stage upon which the action is set. This is all about who really runs the country, the appointed government or the elected Parliament.

Lets not all beat around the bush on this. Johnson prorogued Parliament because he wanted to honour his pledge to the 17.4 million people who voted Leave.

That is, of course, true. Let's hope no-one now tries to defend why it was done.

The vote in June 23rd was not predecated with a requirement that it could only happen if a deal was struck with the EU. Ditto with Article 50. It is only now, at a later date, that Parliament has decided to add that proviso.

Untrue. Parliament never expressed an opinion until all the issues were identified. Them having been they reacted, as they must. We all learn things as time passes. Parliament is no different. We don't do things today in exactly the same way that we used to do 100 years because we now know more. Why do you want to tie Parliament's hands to all they knew in 2016?

Johnson has offered Parliament a General Election. It has declined.

Political ruses which produce undesirable results need to be identified and countered.

Parliament wishes to stop Brexit from happening. I know that, you know that, we all know that. And these 11 judges have handed it the right to do that.

Both untrue. Parliament as a whole wants to stop a "no deal" Brexit from happening. Despite there probably being a personal majority among MPs for remain there is a Parliamentary majority in favour of us leaving but with a "deal", because of the commitments they have made. The Judges have just done their job and allowed the law to speak.

It is nice and clear cut. Their votes trump those of the 17.4 million. You should be celebrating that. That is how our system of Governance operates.

It does NO such thing. Their unanimous vote follows the law. It expresses no opinion on who voted for leave or remain. You are attempting to conflate two totally separate matters.

Me, I want to see it destroyed. Razed to the ground. Any institution that can seek to ignore the wishes of 17.4 million votes cast in the single biggest ever exercise in British democracy is only worthy of my utter contempt, especially since it will not submit itself to a General Election despite constant pleadings from its major parties for that to happen.

Whatever you think of the validity of the referendum result, and it's importance versus Parliamentary sovereignty, this judgement has nothing whatsoever to do with it. Despite more Johnson blather to the contrary. Government's need to abide by the law, just as we all do.

I despise it. I loathe those 11 judges. And I want it now consigned to the history books.

Then choose a Parliament who agrees with you! That's how our democracy works.

It is now going to submit us to a second referendum with the losing 'Remain' option still on the paper. It is going to be an utter farce but what do they care?

No-one know yet what will happen. Maybe the government will actually agree a deal which Parliament can accept. Doesn't seem likely but who knows in these strange days? That they care is obvious. No-one submits themselves to this just for fun!

You are getting your wish. Enjoy the moment. Dance for joy. This is your special day.

Whilst there is certainly a feeling of relief that the rule of law has spoken and the correct procedures will now be followed I don't sense any triumphalism. Just a resolute determination to make sure that we get things moving so that Parliament can oversee, question and hold government to account. No-one wants people to be so angry because of their misunderstandings about how our system works. Which is what is the whole problem here.

Edited by Matov (24 Sep 2019 12.25pm)

Edited by Wisbech Eagle (24 Sep 2019 1.33pm)

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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steeleye20 Croydon 24 Sep 19 1.35pm
'Asked if he would apologise, Mr Johnson said he did not think the ruling was "the right decision". What an utter t**t.........
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steeleye20

Croydon 24 Sep 19 1.35pm

'Asked if he would apologise, Mr Johnson said he did not think the ruling was "the right decision".

What an utter t**t.........

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the silurian The garden of England.(not really) 24 Sep 19 1.41pm
well at least Wisbech will be happy, now perhaps hes got his wish we can be spared any morelong winded self indulgent posts from Cornwall Brexit well on the way to being cancelled.....stand by for much civil unrest when that happens!!! Edited by the silurian (24 Sep 2019 1.46pm)
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the silurian

The garden of England.(not really) 24 Sep 19 1.41pm

well at least Wisbech will be happy, now perhaps hes got his wish we can be spared any morelong winded self indulgent posts from Cornwall

Brexit well on the way to being cancelled.....stand by for much civil unrest when that happens!!!

Edited by the silurian (24 Sep 2019 1.46pm)

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susmik PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 24 Sep 19 1.56pm
Originally posted by the silurian well at least Wisbech will be happy, now perhaps hes got his wish we can be spared any morelong winded self indulgent posts from Cornwall Brexit well on the way to being cancelled.....stand by for much civil unrest when that happens!!! Edited by the silurian (24 Sep 2019 1.46pm) We all wish !!! Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky.
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susmik

PLYMOUTH -But Made in Old Coulsdon... 24 Sep 19 1.56pm

Originally posted by the silurian

well at least Wisbech will be happy, now perhaps hes got his wish we can be spared any morelong winded self indulgent posts from Cornwall

Brexit well on the way to being cancelled.....stand by for much civil unrest when that happens!!!

Edited by the silurian (24 Sep 2019 1.46pm)

We all wish !!!

Supported Palace for over 69 years since the age of 7 and have seen all the ups and downs and will probably see many more ups and downs before I go up to the big football club in the sky.

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steeleye20 Croydon 24 Sep 19 1.58pm
Originally posted by steeleye20 'Asked if he would apologise, Mr Johnson said he did not think the ruling was "the right decision". What an utter tt......... Johnson actually thinks, that 11 Supreme Court Judges unanimously came to the wrong conclusion!**
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steeleye20

Croydon 24 Sep 19 1.58pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

'Asked if he would apologise, Mr Johnson said he did not think the ruling was "the right decision".

What an utter t**t.........

Johnson actually thinks, that 11 Supreme Court Judges unanimously came to the wrong conclusion!

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 24 Sep 19 2.00pm
Originally posted by the silurian well at least Wisbech will be happy, now perhaps hes got his wish we can be spared any morelong winded self indulgent posts from Cornwall Brexit well on the way to being cancelled.....stand by for much civil unrest when that happens!!! Edited by the silurian (24 Sep 2019 1.46pm) I am happy that the law has spoken and my contention that Parliament is supreme has been supported, as it always was going to be. That my posts have been "long winded" and repetitive has only been necessary because so many have refused to acknowledge this. That some still do is really unfortunate but won't change anything. If you don't like the law, change the law. To do that you need to vote in a Parliament who agrees with you. That's the way it is done and not via "civil unrest". Peaceful protests and well put arguments will help Parliament change their mind. It's up to you to convince people. I am not convinced you will be able to do it. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 24 Sep 19 2.00pm

Originally posted by the silurian

well at least Wisbech will be happy, now perhaps hes got his wish we can be spared any morelong winded self indulgent posts from Cornwall

Brexit well on the way to being cancelled.....stand by for much civil unrest when that happens!!!

Edited by the silurian (24 Sep 2019 1.46pm)

I am happy that the law has spoken and my contention that Parliament is supreme has been supported, as it always was going to be. That my posts have been "long winded" and repetitive has only been necessary because so many have refused to acknowledge this. That some still do is really unfortunate but won't change anything.

If you don't like the law, change the law. To do that you need to vote in a Parliament who agrees with you. That's the way it is done and not via "civil unrest". Peaceful protests and well put arguments will help Parliament change their mind. It's up to you to convince people. I am not convinced you will be able to do it.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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W12 24 Sep 19 2.03pm
Originally posted by steeleye20 Johnson actually thinks, that 11 Supreme Court Judges unanimously came to the wrong conclusion! Re-moaners think 17.4m people came to the wrong conclusion. They just have less power than 11 judges.
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W12 24 Sep 19 2.03pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

Johnson actually thinks, that 11 Supreme Court Judges unanimously came to the wrong conclusion!

Re-moaners think 17.4m people came to the wrong conclusion. They just have less power than 11 judges.

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ASCPFC Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 24 Sep 19 2.05pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle I am happy that the law has spoken and my contention that Parliament is supreme has been supported, as it always was going to be. That my posts have been "long winded" and repetitive has only been necessary because so many have refused to acknowledge this. That some still do is really unfortunate but won't change anything. If you don't like the law, change the law. To do that you need to vote in a Parliament who agrees with you. That's the way it is done and not via "civil unrest". Peaceful protests and well put arguments will help Parliament change their mind. It's up to you to convince people. I am not convinced you will be able to do it. So just to clarify, Remain protests have been justified; up to and including throwing milkshakes on Brexit politicians. Brexit protests will not be justified. What will be funny is how many of the turncoat politicians are about to lose their jobs. Red and Blue Army!
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ASCPFC

Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 24 Sep 19 2.05pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

So just to clarify, Remain protests have been justified; up to and including throwing milkshakes on Brexit politicians. Brexit protests will not be justified.

What will be funny is how many of the turncoat politicians are about to lose their jobs.

Red and Blue Army!

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ASCPFC Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 24 Sep 19 2.07pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle I am happy that the law has spoken and my contention that Parliament is supreme has been supported, as it always was going to be. That my posts have been "long winded" and repetitive has only been necessary because so many have refused to acknowledge this. That some still do is really unfortunate but won't change anything. If you don't like the law, change the law. To do that you need to vote in a Parliament who agrees with you. That's the way it is done and not via "civil unrest". Peaceful protests and well put arguments will help Parliament change their mind. It's up to you to convince people. I am not convinced you will be able to do it. A political decision as has already been pointed out. Out of interest, take all eleven of the judges' names and see who is working in one of the European Courts in a few years time. Red and Blue Army!
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ASCPFC

Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 24 Sep 19 2.07pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

A political decision as has already been pointed out. Out of interest, take all eleven of the judges' names and see who is working in one of the European Courts in a few years time.

Red and Blue Army!

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Matov 24 Sep 19 2.12pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle Political ruses which produce undesirable results need to be identified and countered. Then this.... Then choose a Parliament who agrees with you! That's how our democracy works. Are you for the real? Seriously. How can you dismiss the offer of a General Election to settle this as a 'political ruse' and then tell me that all I need to do is choose a Parliament that agrees with me? I want to do that. Johnson wants to do that. Corbyn claims to want to that as does every other supposed 'leader'. So why aint it happening? Why is your precious Parilamentary democracy so scared of a GE? Lets have it as soon as possible and lets have all the main players make a pledge to actually HONOUR what they claim they will over Brexit. You want this to end without bloodshed and for us all to move on then this is the only course of action open. "The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.
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Matov

24 Sep 19 2.12pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Political ruses which produce undesirable results need to be identified and countered.

Then this....

Then choose a Parliament who agrees with you! That's how our democracy works.

Are you for the real? Seriously. How can you dismiss the offer of a General Election to settle this as a 'political ruse' and then tell me that all I need to do is choose a Parliament that agrees with me?

I want to do that. Johnson wants to do that. Corbyn claims to want to that as does every other supposed 'leader'.

So why aint it happening? Why is your precious Parilamentary democracy so scared of a GE?

Lets have it as soon as possible and lets have all the main players make a pledge to actually HONOUR what they claim they will over Brexit.

You want this to end without bloodshed and for us all to move on then this is the only course of action open.

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

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SW19 CPFC Addiscombe West 24 Sep 19 2.13pm
Originally posted by Matov Well yes. We are scheduled to be leaving on October 31st. Parliament decided to stop that happening. And now it will make that happen. Lets not all beat around the bush on this. Johnson prorogued Parliament because he wanted to honour his pledge to the 17.4 million people who voted Leave. The vote in June 23rd was not predecated with a requirement that it could only happen if a deal was struck with the EU. Ditto with Article 50. It is only now, at a later date, that Parliament has decided to add that proviso. Johnson has offered Parliament a General Election. It has declined. Parliament wishes to stop Brexit from happening. I know that, you know that, we all know that. And these 11 judges have handed it the right to do that. It is nice and clear cut. Their votes trump those of the 17.4 million. You should be celebrating that. That is how our system of Governance operates. Me, I want to see it destroyed. Razed to the ground. Any institution that can seek to ignore the wishes of 17.4 million votes cast in the single biggest ever exercise in British democracy is only worthy of my utter contempt, especially since it will not submit itself to a General Election despite constant pleadings from its major parties for that to happen. I despise it. I loathe those 11 judges. And I want it now consigned to the history books. It is now going to submit us to a second referendum with the losing 'Remain' option still on the paper. It is going to be an utter farce but what do they care? You are getting your wish. Enjoy the moment. Dance for joy. This is your special day. Edited by Matov (24 Sep 2019 12.25pm) Nah, you're being extremely pessimistic. I'm all for leaving with a deal. Just because I agree with the decision does not make me a remainer. I'm still convinced we will leave with a deal. Parliament wishes to stop a no-deal Brexit from happening, not brexit entirely. Again though, the 11 judges have voted against what you were calling the establishment, and now they are the establishment? Surely everyone in politics and in any position of power is the establishment. Powerful pro-leavers are the establishment. Powerful remainers are the establishment. By all means burn it down but what ends up in its place will simply be more of the same. What you pine for is unattainable. I respect the belief though, even though it is fantasy. Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.
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SW19 CPFC

Addiscombe West 24 Sep 19 2.13pm