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CONservative government incompetence.

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silvertop Flag Portishead 10 Oct 22 10.01am Send a Private Message to silvertop Add silvertop as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

NEW: Westminster Voting Intention poll (6 Oct):

LAB: 52% (+2 from 29 Sep)
CON: 20% (=)
LDM: 8% (-1)
GRN: 7% (-1)
SNP: 5% (=)

I must admit that's some interesting stuff.

Edited by Stirlingsays (07 Oct 2022 11.06pm)

Ah the special magic that is 1st past the post. The SNP poll 4% but have nearly 8% of the seats. The LD poll double but enjoy almost 4 times less of the pie.

 

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silvertop Flag Portishead 10 Oct 22 10.13am Send a Private Message to silvertop Add silvertop as a friend

Originally posted by Henry of Peckham

I think your theory probably has legs but after the upcoming mayhem I don't believe the Tories will form another government for a generation. Parliament hasn't reconvened yet but watch out for Members crossing the floor to join Labour and Liberals and anyone else who is anti-Truss. We're in for a bleak winter. We may yet see the depth of ineptitude and inexperience of our 'non-elected leader'.

I have a lot of respect for May. She is hailed as this awful PM, but historic perspective is now making her look like Disraeli.

She knew she had not been "properly" elected and that her policies had no mandate. So, she took it to the country. It was a brave, honourable and correct thing to do within our constitution. It was also suicide from a realpolitik perspective.

Truss has seen this and will not make the same "mistake". She will thus cling to power with a shrinking (currently 69) working majority for 2 more years while this lame duck barely waddles to its inevitable demise; much to the cost of the country.

Question is, will the next Tory leaders also exist for their own position or that of the country? Will we ever see honour and integrity again?

 

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Nicholas91 Flag The Democratic Republic of Kent 10 Oct 22 10.40am Send a Private Message to Nicholas91 Add Nicholas91 as a friend

Originally posted by silvertop

I have a lot of respect for May. She is hailed as this awful PM, but historic perspective is now making her look like Disraeli.

She knew she had not been "properly" elected and that her policies had no mandate. So, she took it to the country. It was a brave, honourable and correct thing to do within our constitution. It was also suicide from a realpolitik perspective.

Truss has seen this and will not make the same "mistake". She will thus cling to power with a shrinking (currently 69) working majority for 2 more years while this lame duck barely waddles to its inevitable demise; much to the cost of the country.

Question is, will the next Tory leaders also exist for their own position or that of the country? Will we ever see honour and integrity again?

A damning and worryingly agreeable post for me. Theresa May is starting to not look too bad now is she? Make you right there ST.

A bit blunt however I feel it accurate to state this is a tough time for any PM and a pretty awful situation for the country as it is but most unfortunately we have a f**king idiot running it for now. I do understand the whole 'unelected' argument however it is hardly new and therefore shouldn't be the most egregious thing to base your hate upon, it's just the system as it has been for some time.

As for your question, I think 'realpolitik' replaced 'real politics' some time ago and that situation is worsening. Said it a few times already however, once more, Labour are too far left it throws too many off and the conservatives are suffering an identity crisis trying to keep up. It has left already weak politicians further scrambling to appeal to a social zeitgeist they do not fully understand. Furthermore, it has obfuscated the competency of politicians which should be the overwhelming primary parameter for assessing their ability to hold office. It seems to be an American-esque competition for whipping up popularity now as opposed to an assessment of individuals based on the beliefs and stances they espouse or, again, ability to run the country.

Repeating myself as I do frequently but it's been of course a very long time since I aligned ideologically to any party but also now far too long I have held any genuine belief let alone support for an individual.

 


Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!

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Willo Flag South coast - west of Brighton. 10 Oct 22 11.06am Send a Private Message to Willo Add Willo as a friend

Originally posted by Nicholas91

A damning and worryingly agreeable post for me. Theresa May is starting to not look too bad now is she? Make you right there ST.

A bit blunt however I feel it accurate to state this is a tough time for any PM and a pretty awful situation for the country as it is but most unfortunately we have a f**king idiot running it for now. I do understand the whole 'unelected' argument however it is hardly new and therefore shouldn't be the most egregious thing to base your hate upon, it's just the system as it has been for some time.

As for your question, I think 'realpolitik' replaced 'real politics' some time ago and that situation is worsening. Said it a few times already however, once more, Labour are too far left it throws too many off and the conservatives are suffering an identity crisis trying to keep up. It has left already weak politicians further scrambling to appeal to a social zeitgeist they do not fully understand. Furthermore, it has obfuscated the competency of politicians which should be the overwhelming primary parameter for assessing their ability to hold office. It seems to be an American-esque competition for whipping up popularity now as opposed to an assessment of individuals based on the beliefs and stances they espouse or, again, ability to run the country.

Repeating myself as I do frequently but it's been of course a very long time since I aligned ideologically to any party but also now far too long I have held any genuine belief let alone support for an individual.

Ms Truss has only been PM since 6 September, accordingly it might be better advised to wait for the 'Hour glass' to flow further before forming a judgement.

The passage of time might formulate a negative impression in my mind about her Premiership but at present I will allow events to unfold over a period of time before being judgemental.

Two years is a protracted time in politics and I for one do not believe that electoral defeat for my party is an inevitability.

Edited by Willo (10 Oct 2022 11.09am)

 

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Nicholas91 Flag The Democratic Republic of Kent 10 Oct 22 11.12am Send a Private Message to Nicholas91 Add Nicholas91 as a friend

Originally posted by Willo

Ms Truss has only been PM since 6 September, accordingly it might be better advised to wait for the 'Hour glass' to flow further before forming a judgement.

The passage of time might formulate a negative impression in my mind about her Premiership but at present I will allow events to unfold over a period of time before being judgemental.

My opinions of Truss far exceed her time in office Willo. The statement was made from privately held, far longer term perceptions and commentary many former colleagues/associates had espoused or provided which unfortunately for me seem to ring true of late. I did not pay much attention to or care for such comments at the time, singularly as it didn't bear any relativity to my life. Unfortunately it does now and that has my anxiety piqued.

 


Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!

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Willo Flag South coast - west of Brighton. 10 Oct 22 11.26am Send a Private Message to Willo Add Willo as a friend

Originally posted by Nicholas91

My opinions of Truss far exceed her time in office Willo. The statement was made from privately held, far longer term perceptions and commentary many former colleagues/associates had espoused or provided which unfortunately for me seem to ring true of late. I did not pay much attention to or care for such comments at the time, singularly as it didn't bear any relativity to my life. Unfortunately it does now and that has my anxiety piqued.

Nicholas91, you have clarified your position in relation to the factors that have formulated your opinion of Ms Truss, accordingly I accept that you have not been judgemental based on her time as Prime Minister.

 

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Nicholas91 Flag The Democratic Republic of Kent 10 Oct 22 11.36am Send a Private Message to Nicholas91 Add Nicholas91 as a friend

Originally posted by Willo

Nicholas91, you have clarified your position in relation to the factors that have formulated your opinion of Ms Truss, accordingly I accept that you have not been judgemental based on her time as Prime Minister.

Grazi.

I do agree it is quick to judgement however I have had third party driven prejudices seemingly, for now, confirmed!

It is worth noting also that my of course highly subjective take on her is not one characterised by amour!

Edited by Nicholas91 (10 Oct 2022 11.37am)

 


Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!

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silvertop Flag Portishead 11 Oct 22 10.06am Send a Private Message to silvertop Add silvertop as a friend

Originally posted by Willo

Ms Truss has only been PM since 6 September, accordingly it might be better advised to wait for the 'Hour glass' to flow further before forming a judgement.

The passage of time might formulate a negative impression in my mind about her Premiership but at present I will allow events to unfold over a period of time before being judgemental.

Two years is a protracted time in politics and I for one do not believe that electoral defeat for my party is an inevitability.

Edited by Willo (10 Oct 2022 11.09am)

Given this is after all a footy site I am going to use our fantastic club as an analogy.

Holloway was a charismatic and popular manager. However, by his own admission (unlike the character I am likening him to) he readily accepted his shortcomings and amicably stepped aside.

Imagine if he was replaced, not by Pulis, but by Frank de Boer? We all know how long he lasted - and this with a club that has some patience with new managers.

Not being in power long is not enough when it is immediately and painfully obvious the incumbent is not up to the job.

 

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Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 11 Oct 22 10.47am Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Willo

Ms Truss has only been PM since 6 September, accordingly it might be better advised to wait for the 'Hour glass' to flow further before forming a judgement.

The passage of time might formulate a negative impression in my mind about her Premiership but at present I will allow events to unfold over a period of time before being judgemental.

Two years is a protracted time in politics and I for one do not believe that electoral defeat for my party is an inevitability.

Edited by Willo (10 Oct 2022 11.09am)

Were you the captain of the Titanic in a past life?

When you get warnings that your ship is going to sink unless you change direction immediately, you don't give the one holding the wheel more time.

The MPs need to act now. Your lot need to tell them to do it and that you have made a mistake.

 


For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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cryrst Flag The garden of England 11 Oct 22 12.47pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Were you the captain of the Titanic in a past life?

When you get warnings that your ship is going to sink unless you change direction immediately, you don't give the one holding the wheel more time.

The MPs need to act now. Your lot need to tell them to do it and that you have made a mistake.

So what exactly did liz truss do wrong which she hasn’t put right. The 45% tax reduction hasn’t happened. A 1 p tax reduction for everyone and 1.25% NI hike has been stopped for everyone. So all who pay tax and NI are better off. So again what has she done so wrong in 6 weeks?

 

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Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 11 Oct 22 1.13pm Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by cryrst

So what exactly did liz truss do wrong which she hasn’t put right. The 45% tax reduction hasn’t happened. A 1 p tax reduction for everyone and 1.25% NI hike has been stopped for everyone. So all who pay tax and NI are better off. So again what has she done so wrong in 6 weeks?

That's because all those who pay tax and NI will not be better off!

Tax cuts are no use at all if your costs exceed the benefit because of interest rates and inflation.

Announcing tax cuts without any kind of detail on how they will be funded was bad enough. Knowing that money doesn't grow on trees and the 2+2 always equals 4 was enough for the markets to react as they did.

This was a very, very stupid own goal. One that was not only completely avoidable but predicted. It's ideology dominating reason and common sense.

These measures will have to be reversed, preferably sooner rather than austerity forcing it later. The only way this government can survive is to accept that it has made a mistake. Nothing in it's behaviour so far suggests it will, so now it's down to our MPs. This is a big test for them.

 


For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Midlands Eagle Flag 11 Oct 22 2.21pm Send a Private Message to Midlands Eagle Add Midlands Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by cryrst


So what exactly did liz truss do wrong which she hasn’t put right.

So again what has she done so wrong in 6 weeks?

Junked the country's creditworthiness resulting in higher mortgage rates which will probably end up with thousands of people who can no longer afford their mortgage payments to be made homeless.

Completely misjudged the mood of the country and her own party.

Managed to find someone more right wing than Pritti Patel to be Home Secretary.

Excluded capable people from government if they hadn't backed her in the leadership election even going so far as to tell them that was the reason for them being replaced

 

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