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So what are our ambitions Steve?

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Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 18 Jul 18 5.11pm Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Palace in the blood,

You’ve made all of that up haven’t you?

If a club defaults then monies owed to clubs comes under money owed to ‘secured creditors’ so that’s how their money is guaranteed. To guarantee that money with the club going into financial trouble or administration the club in trouble has to keep selling players and assets and even possibly its ground and everything to pay back the secured creditors.

Edited by Rudi Hedman (18 Jul 2018 5.13pm)

 


COYP

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Rudi Hedman Flag Caterham 18 Jul 18 5.20pm Send a Private Message to Rudi Hedman Add Rudi Hedman as a friend

Originally posted by Forest Hillbilly

In businesses, and I would guess in football, you maybe have a couple of plans running simultaneously.

Long Term Plan : to become the most successful club in England/Europe
Short Term plan : make lots of money to bankroll LTP.
Then you always have conflicts between departments. Manager v accountants is the obvious one.

Just doing things better would be a good start for the backroom staff. Look at the ways other clubs operate and try to refine your own operations.

I am beginning to think SP is some kind of Superhero. No matter how many times he looks to have fallen in the 5hlt, he always comes up smelling of roses.

I think we all know that depends on the manager working near miracles a lot of the time, apart from Allardyce’s essential spending because of the damage done by Pardew.

 


COYP

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Midlands Eagle Flag 18 Jul 18 5.25pm Send a Private Message to Midlands Eagle Add Midlands Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Palace in the Blood


You missed out rest of post which explained only way it could happen. When you buy a house on a mortgage that you later sell the mortgage must be settled before transfer of deeds can take place. Similarly if you contract to buy a players contract and agree to pay over length of contract if that contract is terminated by a sale then balance is due. Otherwise if the club defaults on payment who owns players contract?

Thats why it would theoretically be possible for a sale contract to transfer periodic payments onto buying club. However unless original contract specified this the original club would have to agree and why would they? It may be difficult to enforce.

It is possible that any monies from a sell on clause may be paid for a while after a player is sold as the money receipt may well be structured.

Unless you are party to the contract or have seen all clauses then nothing is fact but is educated deduction from a legal point of view.

The bottom line is the Selling club want their money and the quicker they get that the better for them and cashflow. So where buying club agrees to purchase outright then price is often lower. A club like Villa need to sell to reach FFP requirements. They are reported to want £30 million for Grealish which may be a lump sum and then structured over 5 years of a contract. So if you assume that about £8 million is Lump remaining 22 in 4 12 monthly payments. Probably the size of that lump sum is all important as that may take them outside FFP and any possible transfer ban. How much would they reduce price if they got all up front? or over 24 months

So you were guessing

Using your analogy when you buy a house on mortgage the bank take a charge over the house as their security for the debt so that when the house is sold the debt must be cleared.

When you buy a player there is no such charge so no need to settle the outstanding debt if the player is sold

 

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Midlands Eagle Flag 18 Jul 18 5.28pm Send a Private Message to Midlands Eagle Add Midlands Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Forest Hillbilly

I am beginning to think SP is some kind of Superhero. No matter how many times he looks to have fallen in the 5hlt, he always comes up smelling of roses.

It's management by serendipity but as Napoleon once said he would rather have a general who was lucky than one who was good

 

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chateauferret Flag 18 Jul 18 5.56pm

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

It's management by serendipity but as Napoleon once said he would rather have a general who was lucky than one who was good

The problem with that is that his luck will evenually run out. Pardew's did. Thank God de Boer wasn't lucky; we'd still be stuck with the t*** to this day.

 


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braunstoneagle Flag the middle of bumf*** nowhere... 18 Jul 18 7.06pm Send a Private Message to braunstoneagle Add braunstoneagle as a friend

Originally posted by new_in_Wait

rough diamonds these days cost at least 10M each. Apparently we don't even have that.

i dont beleive rough diamonds should cost £10m each, with correct scouting you must be able to sign 4 teenagers for £10m from around the globe or the lower leagues.

im not digging sórloth out, just using him as an example, but what he has shown since january we could have blooded a kiddie & been no worse off, it seems to me roy took a “tip” from one of his scandinavian mates & it cost us £10m he may turn i to harry kane but i doubt it.

think long term, develop them for 2 years time...

i dont count the likes of sórloth or jairo rough diamonds, at 22 sórloth they should be 1st team ready in this day & age.

ive always been a advocate of giving kids the chance of being squad players & moving forward it has to be the sustainable way, otherwise there is f*** all point in having an academy!


 


‘Football isn’t instant coffee. You have to work at it. You must grow the bean, grind it.’ Ian Holloway


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Brentmiester_General Flag Front line in the battle against t... 18 Jul 18 8.34pm

Originally posted by chateauferret

The problem with that is that his luck will evenually run out. Pardew's did. Thank God de Boer wasn't lucky; we'd still be stuck with the t*** to this day.

Fergie got lucky before he went on to have a stellar career without his luck running out.

 


"We love you Palace, we f@cking hate Man U, We love you Palace, we hate the brighton too, We love you Palace we play in red 'n' blue, so f@ck you, and you ...

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Brentmiester_General Flag Front line in the battle against t... 18 Jul 18 8.36pm

Originally posted by braunstoneagle

i dont beleive rough diamonds should cost £10m each, with correct scouting you must be able to sign 4 teenagers for £10m from around the globe or the lower leagues.

im not digging sórloth out, just using him as an example, but what he has shown since january we could have blooded a kiddie & been no worse off, it seems to me roy took a “tip” from one of his scandinavian mates & it cost us £10m he may turn i to harry kane but i doubt it.

think long term, develop them for 2 years time...

i dont count the likes of sórloth or jairo rough diamonds, at 22 sórloth they should be 1st team ready in this day & age.

ive always been a advocate of giving kids the chance of being squad players & moving forward it has to be the sustainable way, otherwise there is f*** all point in having an academy!


Kids like Sorloth don’t grow on trees in our academy unfortunately Brauny. The bloke is a specimen. And I think he will go on to be a very decent forward.

 


"We love you Palace, we f@cking hate Man U, We love you Palace, we hate the brighton too, We love you Palace we play in red 'n' blue, so f@ck you, and you ...

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braunstoneagle Flag the middle of bumf*** nowhere... 18 Jul 18 9.18pm Send a Private Message to braunstoneagle Add braunstoneagle as a friend

Originally posted by Brentmiester_General

Kids like Sorloth don’t grow on trees in our academy unfortunately Brauny. The bloke is a specimen. And I think he will go on to be a very decent forward.

you know what, i hope your right brent...tho i will ask, if these kids arnt given a chance how will we know?

 


‘Football isn’t instant coffee. You have to work at it. You must grow the bean, grind it.’ Ian Holloway


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Vaibow Flag vancouver/croydon 19 Jul 18 5.55am Send a Private Message to Vaibow Add Vaibow as a friend

This is down from memory, so i could have mistakes.
Halloway in the prem, scattergun approach too many to list, Gayle being the top signing, chamakh, hunt, kebe, etc but we also lost Zaha. Holoway - is style is attacking - on pitch it just wasn't working.

Pulis signed: Dann, Ledley, Puncheon and Hennessey, Hangeland, Kelly and Campbell. Paid out, but then got it back.

We can see where Pulis was going with this, sensible buys, just to get us over the line without busting the bank - They suited his style with punch and Dann being fan favs. Solid defense and counter attack.

Warnock comes in on a two year contract - brings in on loan Zaha.
Warnock let go early. Paid out.
Lost money on warnock, not really changed the squad too much. Nothing changed too much.

Pardew, 3 year contract and they also paid 3.5 million to newcastle. Cabaye, Mandanda, Benteke, Townsend, Adebayor, Mutch. We lost a couple of characters - Jedi, Yaniick, FFS.
Wanted to play expansive football, a couple of signings showed that intent. It never really worked out - pardew just wasn't up to it.

After that Steve Parish said Pardew's "expansive style of football hasn't worked", and, "Now we're going to wind the dial back the other way."

Big Sam - must have been a hefty wage, 3 years at 2.5?? Signs Schlupp, PVA, Sakho? Millivojevic.
He has come in, worked on the defense, sets signings to accommodate that - so the pardew era scratched off, all those signings, weren't really needed as didn't perform no better than what Pulis had.

FDB: Reidwald, loans RLC, TFM probably given a nice contract too. Sacked after a month.
Not much to say.

Roy. worked wonders with 3 managers worth of players, signs two players in january that didn't even feature, a keeper ditto and an expensive norwegian kid.

Pardew royally messed us up and the contingency plan was, in my mind to rectify things this summer - identify who stays, who goes, what.s needed to bolster.

That doesn't look like it. It looks like 'oh we need ya but can't afford ya, oh by then' and 'hmmm who is cheap and will wanna come to us'.

This summer was the summer to spend the money so we got to 40 points in a good manner, and then summer after, slight adjustments. Rather than every two years, massive over haul.

The bold players - expensive and Sakho was billed as a necessity and a must buy.

I think had Pulis stayed one more season - which he may well have done if things were different, we would be in a different spot now i am sure.

 


This was once a quality forum....

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards grumpymort Flag US/Thailand/UK 19 Jul 18 12.12pm Send a Private Message to grumpymort Add grumpymort as a friend

Originally posted by Vaibow

This is down from memory, so i could have mistakes.
Halloway in the prem, scattergun approach too many to list, Gayle being the top signing, chamakh, hunt, kebe, etc but we also lost Zaha. Holoway - is style is attacking - on pitch it just wasn't working.

Pulis signed: Dann, Ledley, Puncheon and Hennessey, Hangeland, Kelly and Campbell. Paid out, but then got it back.

We can see where Pulis was going with this, sensible buys, just to get us over the line without busting the bank - They suited his style with punch and Dann being fan favs. Solid defense and counter attack.

Warnock comes in on a two year contract - brings in on loan Zaha.
Warnock let go early. Paid out.
Lost money on warnock, not really changed the squad too much. Nothing changed too much.

Pardew, 3 year contract and they also paid 3.5 million to newcastle. Cabaye, Mandanda, Benteke, Townsend, Adebayor, Mutch. We lost a couple of characters - Jedi, Yaniick, FFS.
Wanted to play expansive football, a couple of signings showed that intent. It never really worked out - pardew just wasn't up to it.

After that Steve Parish said Pardew's "expansive style of football hasn't worked", and, "Now we're going to wind the dial back the other way."

Big Sam - must have been a hefty wage, 3 years at 2.5?? Signs Schlupp, PVA, Sakho? Millivojevic.
He has come in, worked on the defense, sets signings to accommodate that - so the pardew era scratched off, all those signings, weren't really needed as didn't perform no better than what Pulis had.

FDB: Reidwald, loans RLC, TFM probably given a nice contract too. Sacked after a month.
Not much to say.

Roy. worked wonders with 3 managers worth of players, signs two players in january that didn't even feature, a keeper ditto and an expensive norwegian kid.

Pardew royally messed us up and the contingency plan was, in my mind to rectify things this summer - identify who stays, who goes, what.s needed to bolster.

That doesn't look like it. It looks like 'oh we need ya but can't afford ya, oh by then' and 'hmmm who is cheap and will wanna come to us'.

This summer was the summer to spend the money so we got to 40 points in a good manner, and then summer after, slight adjustments. Rather than every two years, massive over haul.

The bold players - expensive and Sakho was billed as a necessity and a must buy.

I think had Pulis stayed one more season - which he may well have done if things were different, we would be in a different spot now i am sure.


You are wrong with regard to Big Sam we needed all those players and it showed last season.

Regarding Holloway to be fair to the man we had no scouts at all he had to by himself watch video tapes.

 


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new_in_Wait Flag Lewisham 19 Jul 18 12.46pm Send a Private Message to new_in_Wait Add new_in_Wait as a friend

Originally posted by braunstoneagle

i dont beleive rough diamonds should cost £10m each, with correct scouting you must be able to sign 4 teenagers for £10m from around the globe or the lower leagues.

im not digging sórloth out, just using him as an example, but what he has shown since january we could have blooded a kiddie & been no worse off, it seems to me roy took a “tip” from one of his scandinavian mates & it cost us £10m he may turn i to harry kane but i doubt it.

think long term, develop them for 2 years time...

i dont count the likes of sórloth or jairo rough diamonds, at 22 sórloth they should be 1st team ready in this day & age.

ive always been a advocate of giving kids the chance of being squad players & moving forward it has to be the sustainable way, otherwise there is f*** all point in having an academy!


I agree, but I'm not sure we can spend 10M on players who cannot (at least on paper) have an immediate impact. It's hard to see how we can spend 10M on people that we then send out to face Margate or Bromley.

The top clubs do spend a lot/year for young talents, but that money doesn't come out of the main transfer budget and they've got a better loan system to make sure those players gain experience (of course, Chelsea is a negative/extreme example of that).

If we have 10M to spend, I'd say spend it on senior players. But to get 2-3 good senior players for roughly 3-5M each takes good scouting and having good connections in second-tier European leagues (e.g. Belgium, Greece, Austria etc.). Fat Sam did a good job finding Luka, we should be doing more of that. But then again, Luka was 11-12M, so that standard of player seems out of reach at the moment.

 

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