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General Election 2017

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hedgehog50 Flag Croydon 20 Apr 17 11.55am

Originally posted by CambridgeEagle

I'm not sure how you've come to that conclusion. I certainly don't want the Tories in control that much is true.

The impact of EU laws on the UK was massively blown out of all proportion by the Leave Campaign. I'm largely ambivalent about the points made about control over the law. The more important points for me are around the economy and basic rights enjoyed as EU citizens, both of which will suffer post Brexit.

Who do you want in control?

 


We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

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CambridgeEagle Flag Sydenham 20 Apr 17 11.59am Send a Private Message to CambridgeEagle Add CambridgeEagle as a friend

Originally posted by matt_himself

Housing affects 100% of the population. Gay rights circa 5%.

In this instance, equality is a minority pursuit.


Just because someone isn't gay doesn't mean equality is irrelevant. That's such a myopic view, the like of which lead to poorer outcomes for society as a whole. More equal and cohesive societies are more productive and happier places for everyone not just those who would be worse off under a less equal system.

And before anyone thinks it I'm in no way promoting communism!

For anyone who's interested I'd recommend reading anything by Stiglitz or Paul Krugman. It's good to see that there is interest in politics and economics and lively discussion among the Palace faithful!

 

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CambridgeEagle Flag Sydenham 20 Apr 17 12.05pm Send a Private Message to CambridgeEagle Add CambridgeEagle as a friend

Originally posted by hedgehog50

Who do you want in control?


Good question. None of the current party leaders! Probably someone along the lines of Kier Starmer, Heidi Alexander or David Milliband. Macron has lead a great campaign in France and I like his policies so if there was a UK version of him I'd certainly vote for him. I've even got his name on my Palace shirt!

 

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hedgehog50 Flag Croydon 20 Apr 17 12.14pm

Originally posted by CambridgeEagle

Good question. None of the current party leaders! Probably someone along the lines of Kier Starmer, Heidi Alexander or David Milliband. Macron has lead a great campaign in France and I like his policies so if there was a UK version of him I'd certainly vote for him. I've even got his name on my Palace shirt!

They are reasonable people I think. But the only realistic choice at the moment is May, having Corbyn or Farron in charge would be like having Neil from the Young Ones.

 


We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

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hedgehog50 Flag Croydon 20 Apr 17 12.14pm

Originally posted by CambridgeEagle

Just because someone isn't gay doesn't mean equality is irrelevant. That's such a myopic view, the like of which lead to poorer outcomes for society as a whole. More equal and cohesive societies are more productive and happier places for everyone not just those who would be worse off under a less equal system.

And before anyone thinks it I'm in no way promoting communism!

For anyone who's interested I'd recommend reading anything by Stiglitz or Paul Krugman. It's good to see that there is interest in politics and economics and lively discussion among the Palace faithful!

_____________________________________________

Probably true, but it is what we mean by equality and cohesion that is problematic. If equality is taking money from people and giving it to those with less or blowing it on grandiose state schemes that mostly fail and are a waste of money, then that would created more problems than it solves - particularly with 'cohesion'. If cohesion means different ethnic and nationalities getting on famously together, then that ignores human nature - witness the Scottish and Welsh nationalist parties for a start.

Edited by hedgehog50 (20 Apr 2017 12.22pm)

 


We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

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leifandersonshair Flag Newport 20 Apr 17 12.17pm Send a Private Message to leifandersonshair Add leifandersonshair as a friend

Originally posted by hedgehog50

They are reasonable people I think. But the only realistic choice at the moment is May, having Corbyn or Farron in charge would be like having Neil from the Young Ones.

As opposed to Theresa May, who is more like Vyvyan Basterd!

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 20 Apr 17 12.21pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by CambridgeEagle


Just because someone isn't gay doesn't mean equality is irrelevant. That's such a myopic view, the like of which lead to poorer outcomes for society as a whole. More equal and cohesive societies are more productive and happier places for everyone not just those who would be worse off under a less equal system.

And before anyone thinks it I'm in no way promoting communism!

For anyone who's interested I'd recommend reading anything by Stiglitz or Paul Krugman. It's good to see that there is interest in politics and economics and lively discussion among the Palace faithful!

Probably true and that is one of the reasons why I reject mass migration and rapid multi culturalism.
That only leads to a schism along cultural,religious and socioeconomic lines. It also creates criminal enterprise among the socially disadvantaged within different migrant communities. It always has. It also suppresses wages for all normal working people.
None of this produces the climate you describe and that is why most voted Brexit and why people should vote tactically for UKIP or Tory in particular seats. A vote for Labour, Green or Liberal can only mean more of the same. I don't trust a pro European Prime Minister to deliver on reducing immigration either unless she has a political motivation to do so. UKIP need to get their s*** together and remind people why most voted leave.

 

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serial thriller Flag The Promised Land 20 Apr 17 12.36pm Send a Private Message to serial thriller Add serial thriller as a friend

Originally posted by hedgehog50

_____________________________________________

Probably true, but it is what we mean by equality and cohesion that is problematic. If equality is taking money from people and giving it to those with less or blowing it on grandiose state schemes that mostly fail and are a waste of money, then that would created more problems than it solves - particularly with 'cohesion'. If cohesion means different ethnic and nationalities getting on famously together, then that ignores human nature - witness the Scottish and Welsh nationalist parties for a start.

Edited by hedgehog50 (20 Apr 2017 12.22pm)

Human nature? What, it's natural to hate people who are different to you?

I think there's a very good example of how money influences the way we feel about other people. If you look at the most diverse part of the UK, it's probably the megarich in the city (you have Arabs, Nigerian princes, Russian oligarchs, Chinese billionaires etc etc), who seem to be able to put their differences aside to collectively screw over everyone else. It's areas with very little money where we see huge social divisions along these lines - Northern Ireland I think is a classic example. Fact is, if you have enough money to live a comfortable life, you have less reason to feel hatred to someone. That seems evident, and that's why reducing inequality is far more important than simply reducing migration to create cohesion.

 


If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4

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We are goin up! Flag Coulsdon 20 Apr 17 12.38pm Send a Private Message to We are goin up! Add We are goin up! as a friend

Originally posted by nickgusset

John Bercow


Hahahahahahahaha

 


The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.

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serial thriller Flag The Promised Land 20 Apr 17 12.45pm Send a Private Message to serial thriller Add serial thriller as a friend

Originally posted by CambridgeEagle


Good question. None of the current party leaders! Probably someone along the lines of Kier Starmer, Heidi Alexander or David Milliband. Macron has lead a great campaign in France and I like his policies so if there was a UK version of him I'd certainly vote for him. I've even got his name on my Palace shirt!

But don't you consider him as - like Milliband - a version of the noblesse oblige who really have nothing to offer to society anymore? I mean, this is a man right from the heart of the French establishment - he went to their equivalent of Eton, before working for the Rothschilds, then in hedge funds. How are politicians like that meant to solve the vast social tensions which are coming to the surface around Europe?

In my opinion, it's no surprise that his campaign seems to be fading away. According to mates in France, most people don't seem to be able to name a single concrete policy the guy has.

 


If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4

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npn Flag Crowborough 20 Apr 17 12.52pm Send a Private Message to npn Add npn as a friend

Genuinely no idea who to vote for. Tories, I'm afraid (and I have voted for them many times in the past), just seem to be getting nastier. Labour are leaderless and clueless. LibDems are lead by a 'liberal' who doesn't like the gays, and seem a little rudderless. UKIP are done. Greens I could be persuaded but will have to look at their policies in detail first.

All slightly irrelevant as the Tories have a 23,000 majority in my seat and will be going nowhere, but I'd like to show willing.

 

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hedgehog50 Flag Croydon 20 Apr 17 12.53pm

Originally posted by serial thriller

Human nature? What, it's natural to hate people who are different to you?

I think there's a very good example of how money influences the way we feel about other people. If you look at the most diverse part of the UK, it's probably the megarich in the city (you have Arabs, Nigerian princes, Russian oligarchs, Chinese billionaires etc etc), who seem to be able to put their differences aside to collectively screw over everyone else. It's areas with very little money where we see huge social divisions along these lines - Northern Ireland I think is a classic example. Fact is, if you have enough money to live a comfortable life, you have less reason to feel hatred to someone. That seems evident, and that's why reducing inequality is far more important than simply reducing migration to create cohesion.

You can't 'create cohesion'. People get along or they don't. At best different groups club together and more or less ignore others. The megarich are just as likely to marry and mix with their own nationalities as everyone else. There are exceptions of course, but we are talking about general behaviour. Why do you think there are 'Little Italy' and 'Little China' and Harlem and Irish districts in New York.

 


We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

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