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HKOwen Hong Kong 09 Nov 23 7.38pm | |
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Originally posted by beak
Yawn,bedtime reading good for my insomnia. Much ado about nowt. For those who are ok with slander and libel as long as it supports their view.
Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance. |
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 09 Nov 23 8.43pm | |
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Originally posted by Badger11
""and a hearing took place on 23 October 2020. It was shortly after that hearing that the defendant notified The point being she had no evidence to back her claim up. If evidence does exist then she should have obtained it before libelling him. Poor journalism. I have known several journalists in my lifetime and have had lengthy conversations with them about how they work. In their experience, which was considerable, no journalist would ever make up a story. Many know things for absolute certain that they cannot publish because to do so would either mean revealing a source who has not given them permission or getting themselves, or their employer, sued for defamation. Which the lawyers won’t allow. So there is a lot which is known, but cannot be published. This results in slow burning investigations looking for any way in to publish their story. It’s also true that people who know things that ought to be known about, but are unable to openly reveal, due to their position or contractual restrictions, leak them to a journalist. Especially when they believe them important and in the national interest. This is particularly true of the intelligence services. The journalist will then have to decide how to handle the story. Drop hints and innuendo, publish and be damned, or publish and subsequently withdraw. This is what I suspect has happened here. Cadwalladr was given a story by a trusted source, who could not be revealed. She knew it to be true and so important it must be made public. So she did, knowing it would be denied and she would have to withdraw. She found an outlet prepared to run the story and out it went. That’s supposition on my part but it fits the known facts. One of my journalist friends told me many years ago that the newspaper he worked for held some damning information on Enoch Powell but which it was impossible to publish and, so far as I know, never has been.
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georgenorman 09 Nov 23 8.47pm | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
I have known several journalists in my lifetime and have had lengthy conversations with them about how they work. In their experience, which was considerable, no journalist would ever make up a story. Many know things for absolute certain that they cannot publish because to do so would either mean revealing a source who has not given them permission or getting themselves, or their employer, sued for defamation. Which the lawyers won’t allow. So there is a lot which is known, but cannot be published. This results in slow burning investigations looking for any way in to publish their story. It’s also true that people who know things that ought to be known about, but are unable to openly reveal, due to their position or contractual restrictions, leak them to a journalist. Especially when they believe them important and in the national interest. This is particularly true of the intelligence services. The journalist will then have to decide how to handle the story. Drop hints and innuendo, publish and be damned, or publish and subsequently withdraw. This is what I suspect has happened here. Cadwalladr was given a story by a trusted source, who could not be revealed. She knew it to be true and so important it must be made public. So she did, knowing it would be denied and she would have to withdraw. She found an outlet prepared to run the story and out it went. That’s supposition on my part but it fits the known facts. One of my journalist friends told me many years ago that the newspaper he worked for held some damning information on Enoch Powell but which it was impossible to publish and, so far as I know, never has been. What, didn't he have his gas appliances serviced?
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Badger11 Beckenham 09 Nov 23 9.05pm | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
I have known several journalists in my lifetime and have had lengthy conversations with them about how they work. In their experience, which was considerable, no journalist would ever make up a story. Many know things for absolute certain that they cannot publish because to do so would either mean revealing a source who has not given them permission or getting themselves, or their employer, sued for defamation. Which the lawyers won’t allow. So there is a lot which is known, but cannot be published. This results in slow burning investigations looking for any way in to publish their story. It’s also true that people who know things that ought to be known about, but are unable to openly reveal, due to their position or contractual restrictions, leak them to a journalist. Especially when they believe them important and in the national interest. This is particularly true of the intelligence services. The journalist will then have to decide how to handle the story. Drop hints and innuendo, publish and be damned, or publish and subsequently withdraw. This is what I suspect has happened here. Cadwalladr was given a story by a trusted source, who could not be revealed. She knew it to be true and so important it must be made public. So she did, knowing it would be denied and she would have to withdraw. She found an outlet prepared to run the story and out it went. That’s supposition on my part but it fits the known facts. One of my journalist friends told me many years ago that the newspaper he worked for held some damning information on Enoch Powell but which it was impossible to publish and, so far as I know, never has been. So basically journalists should be allowed to say what they like because even though they have no evidence it apparently exists somewhere so that makes it alright. Unless you can back a statement up with facts you should not name and shame just because you don't like that person or you heard whispers. They were serious allegations and she chose to withdraw her truth defence because she had nothing to back it up.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 09 Nov 23 11.33pm | |
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Originally posted by Badger11
So basically journalists should be allowed to say what they like because even though they have no evidence it apparently exists somewhere so that makes it alright. Unless you can back a statement up with facts you should not name and shame just because you don't like that person or you heard whispers. They were serious allegations and she chose to withdraw her truth defence because she had nothing to back it up. Did you miss what I wrote? They have often have the evidence but cannot use it. That means in most cases nothing gets published but sometimes something is regarded as too important just to remain hidden from view. So ways are found to get the issue out, even at the risk of being sued or having to make a tactical withdrawal. That’s not easy for a journalist to undertake, as they then risk a lot. It’s even more difficult to persuade the editors, owners and lawyers to allow the story to run. So if it does you can be pretty sure there’s something to it. When someone has established a complex structure which provides a protective barrier of plausible deniability and possesses the capacity and willingness to sue if challenged you don’t take them on lightly and for no reason.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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Teddy Eagle 09 Nov 23 11.44pm | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
Did you miss what I wrote? They have often have the evidence but cannot use it. That means in most cases nothing gets published but sometimes something is regarded as too important just to remain hidden from view. So ways are found to get the issue out, even at the risk of being sued or having to make a tactical withdrawal. That’s not easy for a journalist to undertake, as they then risk a lot. It’s even more difficult to persuade the editors, owners and lawyers to allow the story to run. So if it does you can be pretty sure there’s something to it. When someone has established a complex structure which provides a protective barrier of plausible deniability and possesses the capacity and willingness to sue if challenged you don’t take them on lightly and for no reason. Except if it's in the Daily Mail of course.
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Badger11 Beckenham 10 Nov 23 7.47am | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
Did you miss what I wrote? They have often have the evidence but cannot use it. That means in most cases nothing gets published but sometimes something is regarded as too important just to remain hidden from view. So ways are found to get the issue out, even at the risk of being sued or having to make a tactical withdrawal. That’s not easy for a journalist to undertake, as they then risk a lot. It’s even more difficult to persuade the editors, owners and lawyers to allow the story to run. So if it does you can be pretty sure there’s something to it. When someone has established a complex structure which provides a protective barrier of plausible deniability and possesses the capacity and willingness to sue if challenged you don’t take them on lightly and for no reason. Do you even understand what you are saying. This journalist lost a libel case whilst various celebs have rushed to her defence it is noticeable that the major media outlets including the BBC have not. You are making completely unsubstantiated allegations just like she did. Where is your proof? When Trump makes allegations without proof you call him a liar. Other the years there have been many rich and powerful people with a dodgy background. Responsible journalists wait until they have evidence they can use before making accusations. Even your beloved BBC would not have said these things without proof. Pointless arguing with you.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 10 Nov 23 8.10am | |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
Except if it's in the Daily Mail of course. My friend who told me this worked for the Mail, who are restricted just as everyone is. This isn’t about the way newspapers spin stories, decide not to publish some, publish only parts of others or cover issues thought inconsequential by others.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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BrentisBack Beckenham 10 Nov 23 8.13am | |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Indeed. If the left didn't have double standards they wouldn't have any at all. Oh do leave off! The amount of things never even mentioned on here by you lot that are done by right wing sh1t bags and white supremacists is flabbergasting. Bit rich to claim that the left have double standards.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 10 Nov 23 8.29am | |
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Originally posted by Badger11
Do you even understand what you are saying. This journalist lost a libel case whilst various celebs have rushed to her defence it is noticeable that the major media outlets including the BBC have not. You are making completely unsubstantiated allegations just like she did. Where is your proof? When Trump makes allegations without proof you call him a liar. Other the years there have been many rich and powerful people with a dodgy background. Responsible journalists wait until they have evidence they can use before making accusations. Even your beloved BBC would not have said these things without proof. Pointless arguing with you. I am not discussing any particular case. I am simply explaining what I have been told, that journalists don’t make up stories, that there is inevitably something behind them and what these tend to be. I am not making any allegations. You are free to reject this if you choose not to believe it. Other news operations will report what has been said, and the responses to it. Getting things discussed is the point. The BBC are generally super cautious to ensure their obligation to maintain objectivity and the Charter is met. People are free to challenge allegations and call them lies whoever makes them, whether their name is Trump or Cadwalladr. The debate can then continue and people can reach opinions. Many things that are known to journalists remain unpublished, especially those that are unimportant tittle tattle. Some things are regarded as more important though.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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Badger11 Beckenham 10 Nov 23 8.54am | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
I am not discussing any particular case. I am simply explaining what I have been told, that journalists don’t make up stories, that there is inevitably something behind them and what these tend to be. I am not making any allegations. You are free to reject this if you choose not to believe it. Other news operations will report what has been said, and the responses to it. Getting things discussed is the point. The BBC are generally super cautious to ensure their obligation to maintain objectivity and the Charter is met. People are free to challenge allegations and call them lies whoever makes them, whether their name is Trump or Cadwalladr. The debate can then continue and people can reach opinions. Many things that are known to journalists remain unpublished, especially those that are unimportant tittle tattle. Some things are regarded as more important though. Waffle. Trump loses in court = Justice. Remainer loses in court it's not fair.
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georgenorman 10 Nov 23 9.04am | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
Did you miss what I wrote? They have often have the evidence but cannot use it. That means in most cases nothing gets published but sometimes something is regarded as too important just to remain hidden from view. So ways are found to get the issue out, even at the risk of being sued or having to make a tactical withdrawal. That’s not easy for a journalist to undertake, as they then risk a lot. It’s even more difficult to persuade the editors, owners and lawyers to allow the story to run. So if it does you can be pretty sure there’s something to it. When someone has established a complex structure which provides a protective barrier of plausible deniability and possesses the capacity and willingness to sue if challenged you don’t take them on lightly and for no reason. Like landlords not servicing gas appliances you mean?
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