Coronavirus and the impact of Lockdown policy

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Coronavirus and the impact of Lockdown policy

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 03 Dec 22 10.56pm
Originally posted by Teddy Eagle The official total is meaningless since anyone who died of literally anything was recorded as a Covid death. The issue is that pretty much the whole world locked down in the expectation that a vaccine would be become available even though one had never been developed before. It's not meaningless. From memory it includes anyone who died within 4 weeks of receiving a positive Covid diagnosis. Not just anything! For sure some would have died anyway, especially the very elderly and infirm, whilst others will have died without Covid being diagnosed. It's imperfect, but as a standard it enabled trends to be measured. It's also untrue that no vaccine had been developed. For this virus, no, but the technology, whilst new, had been under development for some years and there was a great deal of confidence that it could be used for this, provided sufficient resource was devoted to it. So it proved. There were no guarantees, but there was a great deal more than just blind hope. With so many research projects being funded, and developed at speed, this was the global economy showing itself at it's best. Not that that won't stop people blaming the "elites", the "New World Order", globalism and/or the WEF for forcing the lockdowns. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 03 Dec 22 10.56pm

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle

The official total is meaningless since anyone who died of literally anything was recorded as a Covid death.
The issue is that pretty much the whole world locked down in the expectation that a vaccine would be become available even though one had never been developed before.

It's not meaningless. From memory it includes anyone who died within 4 weeks of receiving a positive Covid diagnosis. Not just anything! For sure some would have died anyway, especially the very elderly and infirm, whilst others will have died without Covid being diagnosed. It's imperfect, but as a standard it enabled trends to be measured.

It's also untrue that no vaccine had been developed. For this virus, no, but the technology, whilst new, had been under development for some years and there was a great deal of confidence that it could be used for this, provided sufficient resource was devoted to it. So it proved.

There were no guarantees, but there was a great deal more than just blind hope. With so many research projects being funded, and developed at speed, this was the global economy showing itself at it's best.

Not that that won't stop people blaming the "elites", the "New World Order", globalism and/or the WEF for forcing the lockdowns.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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HKOwen Hong Kong 03 Dec 22 11.10pm
Covid tests were carried out post-mortem, the four week thing is incorrect. Remember the average male life expectancy increased for those who had covid. Numbers can be made to do anything depending on the spin. Thousands who died with covid would have died anyway so covid was not the cause of death etc etc. Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.
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HKOwen

Hong Kong 03 Dec 22 11.10pm

Covid tests were carried out post-mortem, the four week thing is incorrect.

Remember the average male life expectancy increased for those who had covid.

Numbers can be made to do anything depending on the spin.

Thousands who died with covid would have died anyway so covid was not the cause of death etc etc.

Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.

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Teddy Eagle 04 Dec 22 4.28am
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle It's not meaningless. From memory it includes anyone who died within 4 weeks of receiving a positive Covid diagnosis. Not just anything! For sure some would have died anyway, especially the very elderly and infirm, whilst others will have died without Covid being diagnosed. It's imperfect, but as a standard it enabled trends to be measured. It's also untrue that no vaccine had been developed. For this virus, no, but the technology, whilst new, had been under development for some years and there was a great deal of confidence that it could be used for this, provided sufficient resource was devoted to it. So it proved. There were no guarantees, but there was a great deal more than just blind hope. With so many research projects being funded, and developed at speed, this was the global economy showing itself at it's best. Not that that won't stop people blaming the "elites", the "New World Order", globalism and/or the WEF for forcing the lockdowns. Since the total included people who died in traffic accidents or of anything else after a Covid diagnosis it is meaningless. Developed at speed? The fastest a vaccine had ever been produced previously was four years. How would the global economy have looked if this one had taken that long?
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Teddy Eagle

04 Dec 22 4.28am

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Not that that won't stop people blaming the "elites", the "New World Order", globalism and/or the WEF for forcing the lockdowns.

Since the total included people who died in traffic accidents or of anything else after a Covid diagnosis it is meaningless.
Developed at speed? The fastest a vaccine had ever been produced previously was four years. How would the global economy have looked if this one had taken that long?

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Eden Eagle Kent 04 Dec 22 6.55pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle Of course we were in uncharted waters! This virus was new but appeared virulent and very unlike SARS which had been successfully contained. No plan existed to deal with this. It had to be created "on the hoof". The "200,000" deaths was what was stated in the interview. So was from memory. I just looked it up. The official statistics say there have been 212,296. We all know, accept and regret, that the impact of lockdowns on our health services will mean deaths than would have been avoided without them. It's not though the issue. The issue is whether there would have been more deaths overall if we had not had lockdowns. Just as whether the overall financial costs would have been higher, or lower, with or without and, if lower, whether that cost saving was worth a higher number of deaths. These are almost impossible questions when they need to be answered at the start of a crisis, with no useful experience to guide you, and need to be made very quickly. When faced with lose, lose choices you have to choose the least worse. I criticise those who think they know better, on every subject under the sun, than experts and those who have access to expert advice, They truly are know it alls. I frequently find myself defending expert opinion on here, and then get accused of defending the establishment. I am not interested in the establishment. I do though prefer genuine knowledge to bs. Of course there was a pandemic plan in place - the Government model these scenarios - and it did not include lockdown. I know you like to think you are always right but on this point you are incorrect. If you think that over 200’000 people in the UK died specifically from Covid then there really is no point in discussing this matter with you.
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Eden Eagle

Kent 04 Dec 22 6.55pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Of course we were in uncharted waters! This virus was new but appeared virulent and very unlike SARS which had been successfully contained. No plan existed to deal with this. It had to be created "on the hoof". The "200,000" deaths was what was stated in the interview. So was from memory. I just looked it up. The official statistics say there have been 212,296.

We all know, accept and regret, that the impact of lockdowns on our health services will mean deaths than would have been avoided without them. It's not though the issue.

The issue is whether there would have been more deaths overall if we had not had lockdowns. Just as whether the overall financial costs would have been higher, or lower, with or without and, if lower, whether that cost saving was worth a higher number of deaths.

These are almost impossible questions when they need to be answered at the start of a crisis, with no useful experience to guide you, and need to be made very quickly.

When faced with lose, lose choices you have to choose the least worse.

I criticise those who think they know better, on every subject under the sun, than experts and those who have access to expert advice, They truly are know it alls. I frequently find myself defending expert opinion on here, and then get accused of defending the establishment. I am not interested in the establishment. I do though prefer genuine knowledge to bs.

Of course there was a pandemic plan in place - the Government model these scenarios - and it did not include lockdown.

I know you like to think you are always right but on this point you are incorrect.

If you think that over 200’000 people in the UK died specifically from Covid then there really is no point in discussing this matter with you.

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eaglesdare 04 Dec 22 9.13pm
I was not worried about the lockdowns but I was worried about the forced and coerced untested vaccines and side effects of those on people who did not want nor need them! The fallout from that is I fear greater on the health of people and especially the younger generation. And also the unnecessary wearing of masks! Especially by the virtue signallers.
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eaglesdare

04 Dec 22 9.13pm

I was not worried about the lockdowns but I was worried about the forced and coerced untested vaccines and side effects of those on people who did not want nor need them! The fallout from that is I fear greater on the health of people and especially the younger generation.

And also the unnecessary wearing of masks! Especially by the virtue signallers.

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Badger11 Beckenham 05 Dec 22 7.41am
Originally posted by eaglesdare I was not worried about the lockdowns but I was worried about the forced and coerced untested vaccines and side effects of those on people who did not want nor need them! The fallout from that is I fear greater on the health of people and especially the younger generation. And also the unnecessary wearing of masks! Especially by the virtue signallers. An odd thing to say. Why would you be concerned about others wearing a mask, at best they are preventing spreading their germs to you, at worse it's ineffective so, so what. One more point
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Badger11

Beckenham 05 Dec 22 7.41am

Originally posted by eaglesdare

And also the unnecessary wearing of masks! Especially by the virtue signallers.

An odd thing to say. Why would you be concerned about others wearing a mask, at best they are preventing spreading their germs to you, at worse it's ineffective so, so what.

One more point

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 05 Dec 22 8.47am
Originally posted by HKOwen Covid tests were carried out post-mortem, the four week thing is incorrect. Remember the average male life expectancy increased for those who had covid. Numbers can be made to do anything depending on the spin. Thousands who died with covid would have died anyway so covid was not the cause of death etc etc. Not according to the official statistics:- [Link] For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 05 Dec 22 8.47am

Originally posted by HKOwen

Covid tests were carried out post-mortem, the four week thing is incorrect.

Remember the average male life expectancy increased for those who had covid.

Numbers can be made to do anything depending on the spin.

Thousands who died with covid would have died anyway so covid was not the cause of death etc etc.

Not according to the official statistics:-

[Link]

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Alert a moderator to this post

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 05 Dec 22 8.53am
Originally posted by Teddy Eagle Since the total included people who died in traffic accidents or of anything else after a Covid diagnosis it is meaningless. Developed at speed? The fastest a vaccine had ever been produced previously was four years. How would the global economy have looked if this one had taken that long? Untrue:- [Link] These vaccines were based on recently developed technology which then had a huge resource thrown at it. So whilst previous vaccines did take years to develop these were fast tracked at every stage. They still had to satisfy the regulatory authorities though, prior to release. Without this the global economy would have been in an even bigger mess than it is. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 05 Dec 22 8.53am

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle

Since the total included people who died in traffic accidents or of anything else after a Covid diagnosis it is meaningless.
Developed at speed? The fastest a vaccine had ever been produced previously was four years. How would the global economy have looked if this one had taken that long?

Untrue:-

[Link]

These vaccines were based on recently developed technology which then had a huge resource thrown at it. So whilst previous vaccines did take years to develop these were fast tracked at every stage. They still had to satisfy the regulatory authorities though, prior to release. Without this the global economy would have been in an even bigger mess than it is.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Alert a moderator to this post

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 05 Dec 22 8.57am
Originally posted by eaglesdare I was not worried about the lockdowns but I was worried about the forced and coerced untested vaccines and side effects of those on people who did not want nor need them! The fallout from that is I fear greater on the health of people and especially the younger generation. And also the unnecessary wearing of masks! Especially by the virtue signallers. There were no untested vaccines. The efficacy of the underlying principles was well tested and understood, and all the vaccines were trialled in various places across the world. Now we have real use data to back up the original data. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 05 Dec 22 8.57am

Originally posted by eaglesdare

And also the unnecessary wearing of masks! Especially by the virtue signallers.

There were no untested vaccines. The efficacy of the underlying principles was well tested and understood, and all the vaccines were trialled in various places across the world. Now we have real use data to back up the original data.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Alert a moderator to this post

Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 05 Dec 22 9.02am
Originally posted by Eden Eagle Of course there was a pandemic plan in place - the Government model these scenarios - and it did not include lockdown. I know you like to think you are always right but on this point you are incorrect. If you think that over 200’000 people in the UK died specifically from Covid then there really is no point in discussing this matter with you. I don't doubt there was a plan in place but one which took account of a variety of scenarios, with a variety of responses. Not every pandemic is the same. Sars was a minor event compared to Covid. So we needed to react to deal with the actual problem, and not with one on paper. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 05 Dec 22 9.02am

Originally posted by Eden Eagle

Of course there was a pandemic plan in place - the Government model these scenarios - and it did not include lockdown.

I know you like to think you are always right but on this point you are incorrect.

If you think that over 200’000 people in the UK died specifically from Covid then there really is no point in discussing this matter with you.

I don't doubt there was a plan in place but one which took account of a variety of scenarios, with a variety of responses. Not every pandemic is the same. Sars was a minor event compared to Covid. So we needed to react to deal with the actual problem, and not with one on paper.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Alert a moderator to this post

ASCPFC Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 19 Dec 22 10.40am
All I know is that I managed to catch Covid in mid November and frankly still not right. Very strangely up and down. Can be alright for a day or two - then back again. Red and Blue Army!
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ASCPFC

Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 19 Dec 22 10.40am

All I know is that I managed to catch Covid in mid November and frankly still not right. Very strangely up and down. Can be alright for a day or two - then back again.

Red and Blue Army!

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 19 Dec 22 11.02pm
Originally posted by ASCPFC All I know is that I managed to catch Covid in mid November and frankly still not right. Very strangely up and down. Can be alright for a day or two - then back again. . A couple of my friends are reporting similar things. One though has a cancer and is on chemotherapy so attributes that as the cause. This virus is providing to be a very stubborn beast. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 19 Dec 22 11.02pm

Originally posted by ASCPFC

All I know is that I managed to catch Covid in mid November and frankly still not right. Very strangely up and down. Can be alright for a day or two - then back again.

A couple of my friends are reporting similar things. One though has a cancer and is on chemotherapy so attributes that as the cause.

This virus is providing to be a very stubborn beast.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Alert a moderator to this post

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