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BudgiesBeak London 27 Dec 17 11.29pm | |
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OK - so can someone please explain why bitcoin is worth ANYTHING? The only reason that bitcoin is worth money is because other people think it's worth money. As far as I'm concerned, it's as wise an investment as tulips in the 17th century and the South Sea company in the 18th century. Sure, some people will get rich out of bitcoin, but many more will get their fingers burnt in a pretty big way.
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.TUX. 28 Dec 17 6.20am | |
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Originally posted by BudgiesBeak
OK - so can someone please explain why bitcoin is worth ANYTHING? The only reason that bitcoin is worth money is because other people think it's worth money. As far as I'm concerned, it's as wise an investment as tulips in the 17th century and the South Sea company in the 18th century. Sure, some people will get rich out of bitcoin, but many more will get their fingers burnt in a pretty big way. Millions upon millions more will get on board this year. Be one of them.
Edited by .TUX. (28 Dec 2017 6.21am)
Buy Litecoin. |
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Lyons550 Shirley 28 Dec 17 10.14am | |
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Originally posted by BudgiesBeak
OK - so can someone please explain why bitcoin is worth ANYTHING? The only reason that bitcoin is worth money is because other people think it's worth money. As far as I'm concerned, it's as wise an investment as tulips in the 17th century and the South Sea company in the 18th century. Sure, some people will get rich out of bitcoin, but many more will get their fingers burnt in a pretty big way. Isnt that the same with other currencies and commodities such as Gold? i.e. that its only worth what people are willing to value it at.
The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World |
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Badger11 Beckenham 28 Dec 17 10.57am | |
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Originally posted by Lyons550
Isnt that the same with other currencies and commodities such as Gold? i.e. that its only worth what people are willing to value it at. Correct. Currency does not have an intrinsic value but it is backed by the economy of that currency. Strong economy strong currency. Central banks have a vital role in defending their currency through interest rates and other economic measures. The other strength of a currency is its convertible to other currencies. Who will defend Bitcoins? If there is a run on Bitcoins how quickly could you sell up into GBP? I have no idea if Bitcoins will become a "proper" currency but until it does it is a gamble not an investment.
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ZIGnZAG Stoke 28 Dec 17 11.38am | |
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Had a quick look into all these "virtual currencies" the other day and it all seems a bit complicated (or maybe I'm just thick!)
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chris123 hove actually 28 Dec 17 11.48am | |
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Originally posted by ZIGnZAG
Had a quick look into all these "virtual currencies" the other day and it all seems a bit complicated (or maybe I'm just thick!) Never invest in something you don't understand - and I don't understand why a bitcoin isn't worth zero as it is backed by zero, has no intrinsic value and as the guy on Bloomberg said you can't buy a McDonalds coffee with a bitcoin.
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Ketteridge Brighton 28 Dec 17 12.25pm | |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
Answers - as best as I can give - are as follows:
A: Correct. Bitcoin is a currency like any other currency, except that the value of it is guaranteed by the block chain process that ensures the record-keeping of who (anonymously) owns what. Just like a fiver is proof that you own five quid, block chain allows you to prove that you own 0.0004411 Bitcoin (at current exchange rates).
A: Bitcoin has a floating value vs. other currencies just like other currencies have against each other. So when you convert Pounds to Euros to go on your hols, you get the current rate of exchange just the same as if you were converting Bitcoin to Euros.
Again this to me is important, it is essentially an alternative investment rather than a currency, if I have 100k to spare I might want to invest in bitcoin so I can buy a 200k house if my bitcoin rise in value. However my decision to buy bitcoins is as an investment rather than as the only place I could do the trade in dollars but as I hop to get more for my hard earned if I use bitcoin. A: Yes, you can buy Bitcoin as an investment, just like people buy currencies as an investment. And, just like currencies, or stocks or bonds, the value can fall as well as rise. As we have seen. Treat Bitcoin like Pounds, Euros, Yen, Rubles etc. etc. Invest as you deem appropriate for your risk appetites.
What do people use now to purchase illegal goods? Cash! Bitcoin is another form of currency, so it's not a flaw of Bitcoin that criminals use it to settle up after doing bad deeds.
A: Exactly! If you want to engage in trade where secure payments are required and you have high enough volume that the bank charges will kill your margins, then Bitcoin is a great tool. If you want to invest in it, that's great too - but it's just like any other investment, so caveat emptor! Just remember, think of Bitcoin as being like any currency, because that's all it is. The only difference being that it exists without the need for a central bank to guarantee the underlying value because the proof of your funds isn't a piece of paper redeemable at a bank, it's in a block chain that's constantly verified ("mined" on the web so that no one can access your stash without your authorization. Thanks Ray
One supporter of hacking argued that without it "you will do away with the courage and pluck of the game, and I will be bound to bring over a lot of Frenchmen who would beat you with a week's practice -Blackheath secretary at first meeting of the F.A |
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Ray in Houston Houston 28 Dec 17 3.24pm | |
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Originally posted by Ketteridge
Thanks Ray
For example, countries used to issue currency based on the value of its gold reserves - the gold standard - so that the piece of paper (cloth, actually) that you have was actually an IOU for that much gold from the central bank's reserve. That was abandoned years ago and, now, countries issue currency on the basis that "they're good for it". So how does this differ from Bitcoin? One notable difference is that Bitcoin has a limited supply: 21 million pieces. There will never be any more, so the worth of each coin will increase once that 21 million is entirely in circulation. Conversely, the Bank of England could mint a few hundred million more pound coins, devaluing what you've got in your wallet and bank in the process. Lastly, the Bitcoin ledger is maintained in multiple locations on the web and verified constantly by the miners who independently verify Bitcoin changing hands and then validate that with other miners so as to render Bitcoin fraud as impossible. Time will tell on that front, but 2008 taught us all that a bank can go bust and take your money with it which is something not possible with Bitcoin's system that bypasses banks and central governments who can devalue or destroy the value of your money. Of course, if the North Koreans take down the internet, then your Bitcoin is f***ed along with your actual coin! Edited by Ray in Houston (28 Dec 2017 3.34pm)
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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Ray in Houston Houston 28 Dec 17 3.30pm | |
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Originally posted by ZIGnZAG
Had a quick look into all these "virtual currencies" the other day and it all seems a bit complicated (or maybe I'm just thick!)
Meanwhile: - If you put your money in a bank, that bank could go under or someone could hack that bank and steal your money. - If you invest in stocks, bonds, currencies or horses, you can lose your shirt if those investments go south. - If you keep your money in cash under the mattress, someone could steal it or it could catch fire. Failing that, it's still devaluing every moment it's lying dormant.
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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Ray in Houston Houston 28 Dec 17 3.32pm | |
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Originally posted by chris123
Never invest in something you don't understand - and I don't understand why a bitcoin isn't worth zero as it is backed by zero, has no intrinsic value and as the guy on Bloomberg said you can't buy a McDonalds coffee with a bitcoin. You can buy a McDonald's coffee with a debit card linked to your Bitcoin account. Is that very different from how most people buy a coffee now?
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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chris123 hove actually 28 Dec 17 3.40pm | |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
You can buy a McDonald's coffee with a debit card linked to your Bitcoin account. Is that very different from how most people buy a coffee now? I was quoting Ira Epstein on Bloomers earlier today.
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Ray in Houston Houston 28 Dec 17 4.17pm | |
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Originally posted by chris123
I was quoting Ira Epstein on Bloomers earlier today.
But then actual coin is just chunks of metal that have less value than what's stamped on the face. It's just a way of recording the exchange of funds. Meanwhile, a swipe of your debit card is just one computer confirming the exchange of a sum of money to another computer in exchange for real-world goods...which is exactly like Bitcoin. Just trying to make the mysterious world of Bitcoin a little less mysterious.
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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