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Is London losing it's creativity and 'cool'

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Steptoe Flag 07 Jun 15 6.29pm

Quote Jamesrichards8 at 07 Jun 2015 6.24pm

Quote Steptoe at 07 Jun 2015 4.05pm

Quote derben at 07 Jun 2015 4.01pm

Quote Steptoe at 07 Jun 2015 3.10pm

Quote derben at 07 Jun 2015 3.02pm

Quote nickgusset at 07 Jun 2015 2.57pm

[Link]

According to this article it is.

Why anyone wants to go near London these days is beyond me.

Not enough whites for your liking?

I certainly prefer being among people of my own race, language, culture and religion. What's wrong with that? Don't you?

While you're free to have a bee in your bonnet over race, no funnily enough race doesn't dictate who I want to be around.


Wow steptoe, you must be a really great person. Personally, i prefer to fraternize with those who contribute to and understand the english culture, not those simply trying to benefit from it. London's 'creativity and cool' is diminsihing at the same time as the white briton population is dwindling. Coincidence?

I said "funnily enough race doesn't dictate who I want to be around". If you're offended by that, then it really isn't my problem. I think you'll find that someones skin being a different colour doesn't mean they don't contribute or that they're 'trying to benefit from the english culture'.


Edited by Steptoe (07 Jun 2015 6.33pm)

 

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Jamesrichards8 Flag 07 Jun 15 6.39pm Send a Private Message to Jamesrichards8 Add Jamesrichards8 as a friend

Quote Steptoe at 07 Jun 2015 6.29pm

Quote Jamesrichards8 at 07 Jun 2015 6.24pm

Quote Steptoe at 07 Jun 2015 4.05pm

Quote derben at 07 Jun 2015 4.01pm

Quote Steptoe at 07 Jun 2015 3.10pm

Quote derben at 07 Jun 2015 3.02pm

Quote nickgusset at 07 Jun 2015 2.57pm

[Link]

According to this article it is.

Why anyone wants to go near London these days is beyond me.

Not enough whites for your liking?

I certainly prefer being among people of my own race, language, culture and religion. What's wrong with that? Don't you?

While you're free to have a bee in your bonnet over race, no funnily enough race doesn't dictate who I want to be around.


Wow steptoe, you must be a really great person. Personally, i prefer to fraternize with those who contribute to and understand the english culture, not those simply trying to benefit from it. London's 'creativity and cool' is diminsihing at the same time as the white briton population is dwindling. Coincidence?

I said "funnily enough race doesn't dictate who I want to be around". If you're offended by that, then it really isn't my problem. I think you'll find that someones skin being a different colour doesn't mean they don't contribute or that they're 'trying to benefit from the culture'.


Edited by Steptoe (07 Jun 2015 6.29pm)


No i agree skin color doesn't mean that much. And i never said that i was offended. The bottom line is that as more foreigners come to london who neither speak the language, nor are familiar with the culture, London will continue to lose its unique and distinct culture. It's a plain sociological effect. I am not referring to skin color, as it is just as bad when white eastern europeans flood london. If you believe that it's alright for a culture that has been formed and molded over hundreds of years to be watered down then fine. I would argue that it's the same as imperialism. It was wrong for Britain to colonize places like india, for it diluted and altered their culture, a process called cultural hybridity. The same is happening now in London.

Edited by Jamesrichards8 (07 Jun 2015 6.40pm)

 


When you’re knocked on your back and your life’s a flop...

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Steptoe Flag 07 Jun 15 6.43pm

Quote Jamesrichards8 at 07 Jun 2015 6.39pm

Quote Steptoe at 07 Jun 2015 6.29pm

Quote Jamesrichards8 at 07 Jun 2015 6.24pm

Quote Steptoe at 07 Jun 2015 4.05pm

Quote derben at 07 Jun 2015 4.01pm

Quote Steptoe at 07 Jun 2015 3.10pm

Quote derben at 07 Jun 2015 3.02pm

Quote nickgusset at 07 Jun 2015 2.57pm

[Link]

According to this article it is.

Why anyone wants to go near London these days is beyond me.

Not enough whites for your liking?

I certainly prefer being among people of my own race, language, culture and religion. What's wrong with that? Don't you?

While you're free to have a bee in your bonnet over race, no funnily enough race doesn't dictate who I want to be around.


Wow steptoe, you must be a really great person. Personally, i prefer to fraternize with those who contribute to and understand the english culture, not those simply trying to benefit from it. London's 'creativity and cool' is diminsihing at the same time as the white briton population is dwindling. Coincidence?

I said "funnily enough race doesn't dictate who I want to be around". If you're offended by that, then it really isn't my problem. I think you'll find that someones skin being a different colour doesn't mean they don't contribute or that they're 'trying to benefit from the culture'.


Edited by Steptoe (07 Jun 2015 6.29pm)


No i agree skin color doesn't mean that much. And i never said that i was offended. The bottom line is that as more foreigners come to london who neither speak the language, nor are familiar with the culture, London will continue to lose its unique and distinct culture. It's a plain sociological effect. I am not referring to skin color, as it is just as bad when eastern europeans flood london. If you believe that it's alright for a culture that has been formed and molded over hundreds of years to be watered down then fine. I would argue that it's the same as imperialism. It was wrong for Britain to colonize places like india, for it diluted and altered their culture, a process called cultural hybridity. The same is happening now in London.

I agree that it's problematic if people move to a country and can't speak the language. As for cultures they change over time in various ways. Time will tell if the government or the population actually wants to change this situation. The referendum will be interesting.


 

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 07 Jun 15 8.32pm

Quote derben at 07 Jun 2015 3.02pm

Quote nickgusset at 07 Jun 2015 2.57pm

[Link]

According to this article it is.

Why anyone wants to go near London these days is beyond me.

Says the man on a London Football team website


 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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derben Flag 07 Jun 15 8.57pm

Quote jamiemartin721 at 07 Jun 2015 8.32pm

Quote derben at 07 Jun 2015 3.02pm

Quote nickgusset at 07 Jun 2015 2.57pm

[Link]

According to this article it is.

Why anyone wants to go near London these days is beyond me.

Says the man on a London Football team website


Born in West Croydon, lived in South and Upper Norwood. Left years ago and no one left there really to come back for. Occasional visits these days - find it more depressing each time (Croydon and London). Get to a few Palace away games still.

 

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johnfirewall Flag 08 Jun 15 9.41am Send a Private Message to johnfirewall Add johnfirewall as a friend

Bit of a contradiction as it's the 'rich kids' who can afford to be arty. Not that everyone else can't. They just stay skint and moan about it, paying through the nose to stay in arty areas like Camberwell which thanks to the Grove was on the up a century before this supposed golden period of 20 years ago where areas had their demographic, which formed the stereotypes which still persist today. They mention the sterility of Canary Wharf which has served the exact same purpose in this magical 20 years. Plus Notting Hill which has always been full of cnuts.

Interestingly another article on the site bemoans Shoreditchification, this time demonising hipsters rather than bankers. So I'm not really sure who's allowed to live where.

This said I do really hate the proliferation of the middle class in Peckham but that's because I think they're so fcuking stupid to want to live there. It's supply and demand, but more fool those chosing Peckham who aren't even rich kids.

To summarise, a load of sh1te and you're only interested in its socialist undertone.

 

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 08 Jun 15 9.55am

Usually these things turn out to be bollocks because people tend to be looking in the wrong places, or lamenting that the scene they were into has moved on.

I suspect London still produces a lot of creative types and has a cool underground scene or three that's burgeoning. Always has had in my experience, don't see why that would end.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 08 Jun 15 10.11am

Quote Jamesrichards8 at 07 Jun 2015 6.24pm

Quote Steptoe at 07 Jun 2015 4.05pm

Quote derben at 07 Jun 2015 4.01pm

Quote Steptoe at 07 Jun 2015 3.10pm

Quote derben at 07 Jun 2015 3.02pm

Quote nickgusset at 07 Jun 2015 2.57pm

[Link]

According to this article it is.

Why anyone wants to go near London these days is beyond me.

Not enough whites for your liking?

I certainly prefer being among people of my own race, language, culture and religion. What's wrong with that? Don't you?

While you're free to have a bee in your bonnet over race, no funnily enough race doesn't dictate who I want to be around.


Wow steptoe, you must be a really great person. Personally, i prefer to fraternize with those who contribute to and understand the english culture, not those simply trying to benefit from it. London's 'creativity and cool' is diminsihing at the same time as the white briton population is dwindling. Coincidence?

Culture of a nation isn't specific or excluded from influences from outside (in fact arguably it imports and exports cultural influences). The Arts for example have never been 'specifically English' they've been influenced and directed by inspiration and cultural import, as well as exporting that influence back into other national cultures (The Beatles for example where heavily influenced by American Rock N Roll, specifically from Black American culture, and then exported a new form of Anglo rock and roll to the States.

English culture, if it can be said to exist, doesn't exist in a vacuum, but is informed, informs and is inseperable from all of its influences and peers, internal and external.

All you are doing is mearly contributing to the discourse of culture, by selecting to support discourses of tradition, rather than change. I wouldn't say either are positive or negative, they just are. Both views of English Culture are typically flawed due to the subjectivity.


 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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Superfly Flag The sun always shines in Catford 08 Jun 15 10.54am Send a Private Message to Superfly Add Superfly as a friend

That's what I love about the HOL. In order to keep each topic fresh and interesting, we always find a way to switch it to racism. Which isn't at all tedious.

 


Lend me a Tenor

31 May to 3 June 2017

John McIntosh Arts Centre
London Oratory School
SW6 1RX

with Superfly in the chorus
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We are goin up! Flag Coulsdon 08 Jun 15 10.57am Send a Private Message to We are goin up! Add We are goin up! as a friend

Firstly, London is still a great city, and if you think that there are no slightly quirky/underground scenes any more means you're simply not looking properly. The fact that these are promoted more quickly is not London's fault, it's probably the internet's. Information/word of mouth that used to take weeks to spread now takes minutes. One recent example is the dubstep movement which actually started in Croydon. I'm not a fan at all, but would that not count as something that started 'underground' and has now gone global? There is a reason prices keep going up, in the UK London is simply the place to be.

Secondly, the idea that London is now chock full of posh people is ludicrous. Walk around on any given day at 7pm and you will clearly see that this is not the case. Anyone that's studied city demographics will know that there will always need to be an affordable working class area, otherwise all the sh*t jobs don't get done. Don't tell me there aren't still awful parts of central London that aren't full of the working class (many of which are now immigrants), of course there are. Walk around ffs. I graduated two years ago from Sheffield Uni, and most of my mates are Northern, 90% of them have moved to London. It's just what you do. And they're not from rich backgrounds, they've just studied hard and now have good jobs. Doesn't mean they're posh, and it also doesn't mean they're boring, believe me they play hard at weekends. And they aren't all bankers.

Where I do agree with the article is that London's culture needs protecting. Don't shut places like Fabric/Madame JoJo's/Cable and don't pander to big companies that want to make everywhere a hub of Pret-a-f*cking-Mangers.

 


The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.

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derben Flag 08 Jun 15 11.04am

Quote jamiemartin721 at 08 Jun 2015 10.11am

Quote Jamesrichards8 at 07 Jun 2015 6.24pm

Quote Steptoe at 07 Jun 2015 4.05pm

Quote derben at 07 Jun 2015 4.01pm

Quote Steptoe at 07 Jun 2015 3.10pm

Quote derben at 07 Jun 2015 3.02pm

Quote nickgusset at 07 Jun 2015 2.57pm

[Link]

According to this article it is.

Why anyone wants to go near London these days is beyond me.

Not enough whites for your liking?

I certainly prefer being among people of my own race, language, culture and religion. What's wrong with that? Don't you?

While you're free to have a bee in your bonnet over race, no funnily enough race doesn't dictate who I want to be around.


Wow steptoe, you must be a really great person. Personally, i prefer to fraternize with those who contribute to and understand the english culture, not those simply trying to benefit from it. London's 'creativity and cool' is diminsihing at the same time as the white briton population is dwindling. Coincidence?

Culture of a nation isn't specific or excluded from influences from outside (in fact arguably it imports and exports cultural influences). The Arts for example have never been 'specifically English' they've been influenced and directed by inspiration and cultural import, as well as exporting that influence back into other national cultures (The Beatles for example where heavily influenced by American Rock N Roll, specifically from Black American culture, and then exported a new form of Anglo rock and roll to the States.

English culture, if it can be said to exist, doesn't exist in a vacuum, but is informed, informs and is inseperable from all of its influences and peers, internal and external.

All you are doing is mearly contributing to the discourse of culture, by selecting to support discourses of tradition, rather than change. I wouldn't say either are positive or negative, they just are. Both views of English Culture are typically flawed due to the subjectivity.


Again Jamie, I agree with a lot of this. As you say, 'culture' changes all the time and is influenced by all sorts of factors. The point is that many people resent the way it is changing and feel that benign and familiar aspects of culture are replaced by the opposite. I guess it is also a generational thing, I remember my parents' outrage at the likes of the Rolling Stones when they first appeared - long hair on men in particular! Also, their disapproval of the early immigrant populations in south London - I remember my father saying "they will be in Thornton Heath one day"! At the same time, he was a great boxing fan and had a framed, autographed photo of Randolph Turpin that he was very proud of!

 

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aquickgame2 Flag Beni = summer,Caribbean = winter 08 Jun 15 11.21am Send a Private Message to aquickgame2 Add aquickgame2 as a friend

Nothing round my part of London in the past 20 odd years has changed much....I love it.

 

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