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Invalid user 2019 19 Aug 19 9.22pm | |
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Originally posted by Badger11
I got rid of mine last year just as someone told me they were coming back into fashion. Edited by Badger11 (19 Aug 2019 4.25pm) My eyes!!
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 19 Aug 19 9.25pm | |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
'It's the job of Parliament to ensure we get what we need and not just what everyone wants'. But the UK parliament has no power here, except the right to cancel. The extension runs out soon and the EU becomes free of us ! On their own that seems true but the UK Parliament can do much more than just cancel, so long as the EU agree to it, which is very likely as they too don't want a "no deal" exit. So long as those opposed to a "no deal" get their ducks in a row, and don't get hung up on the political infighting, we should be able to get some sense back onto the table, install an interim government with the specific aim of asking for a further extension during which a GE can be held, and a new Parliament elected. As the primary issue in front of the people at such a GE would be whether they still wanted a Brexit and if so what kind, we can be sure that would deliver a clear mandate and the MPs to see it through. I don't see what anyone has to fear from such an event, excepting those MPs who would lose their seats and my expectation that it would result in a hung Parliament which might take some time to resolve before some kind of compromise is worked out that the EU would accept. It has though to be better than this rush to commit suicide. Critical days for our democracy lay ahead.
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.TUX. 19 Aug 19 10.15pm | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
On their own that seems true but the UK Parliament can do much more than just cancel, so long as the EU agree to it, which is very likely as they too don't want a "no deal" exit. So long as those opposed to a "no deal" get their ducks in a row, and don't get hung up on the political infighting, we should be able to get some sense back onto the table, install an interim government with the specific aim of asking for a further extension during which a GE can be held, and a new Parliament elected. As the primary issue in front of the people at such a GE would be whether they still wanted a Brexit and if so what kind, we can be sure that would deliver a clear mandate and the MPs to see it through. I don't see what anyone has to fear from such an event, excepting those MPs who would lose their seats and my expectation that it would result in a hung Parliament which might take some time to resolve before some kind of compromise is worked out that the EU would accept. It has though to be better than this rush to commit suicide. Critical days for our democracy lay ahead. We don't have a democracy. Never have.
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Jimenez SELHURSTPARKCHESTER,DA BRONX 19 Aug 19 11.05pm | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
Glad to be of help! As 99% of everything I read from you is a load of tosh I don't regard your criticism very seriously. Indeed I regard it as a solid confirmation that those who support a "no deal" exit have no idea what they are actually seeking. You are just another with a pocket full of optimism. Yet you wasted 2 minutes of you're time responding?
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becky over the moon 20 Aug 19 7.48am | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
On their own that seems true but the UK Parliament can do much more than just cancel, so long as the EU agree to it, which is very likely as they too don't want a "no deal" exit. So long as those opposed to a "no deal" get their ducks in a row, and don't get hung up on the political infighting, we should be able to get some sense back onto the table, install an interim government with the specific aim of asking for a further extension during which a GE can be held, and a new Parliament elected. As the primary issue in front of the people at such a GE would be whether they still wanted a Brexit and if so what kind, we can be sure that would deliver a clear mandate and the MPs to see it through. I don't see what anyone has to fear from such an event, excepting those MPs who would lose their seats and my expectation that it would result in a hung Parliament which might take some time to resolve before some kind of compromise is worked out that the EU would accept. It has though to be better than this rush to commit suicide. Critical days for our democracy lay ahead. Surely, installing an unelected interim government to oppose the stated will of the people would hardly be in line with your idea of democracy? The reality is that after a successful vote of no confidence, BJ may decide NOT to use the 14 days available to re-form a government that is acceptable to the House, but may just call a GE immediately. Since the House doesn't sit again until 3rd September,a vote of no confidence would have to be tabled and approved and a GE takes 6 weeks to deliver, there still wouldn't be any time left to negotiate very much at all.In fact, with a bit of judicious timing, the clock could just be run down to 31st Octber anyway.
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Badger11 Beckenham 20 Aug 19 8.24am | |
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Originally posted by becky
Surely, installing an unelected interim government to oppose the stated will of the people would hardly be in line with your idea of democracy? The reality is that after a successful vote of no confidence, BJ may decide NOT to use the 14 days available to re-form a government that is acceptable to the House, but may just call a GE immediately. Since the House doesn't sit again until 3rd September,a vote of no confidence would have to be tabled and approved and a GE takes 6 weeks to deliver, there still wouldn't be any time left to negotiate very much at all.In fact, with a bit of judicious timing, the clock could just be run down to 31st Octber anyway. I wonder if that would actually suit Corbyn as well as Johnson. Corbyn is currently in a bind but a GE after 31st Oct gets him off the hook. He gets his GE which he wants but after we have left. He can then point the finger at the Tories for Brexit whilst claiming the votes of the Remainers? I must admit I do not understand the position of the waverers it doesn't seem logically. They are saying we must take no deal off the table yet the EU is refusing to re-negotiate so if they are sincere the only options are May's deal which has been defeated 3 time or a no deal. Until the EU show a willingness to compromise no deal is the only logical option assuming you respect the referendum result. As for the Tory Remainer rebels if they side with a unity government they will be expelled from the Tory party and most will lose their seats at the next GE. Ken Clarke may not care as he is 79 but how many of the others are prepared to bin their political careers? I still think Johnson will get a no deal through by a very narrow margin and then call a GE at which point he will wipe the floor with Corbyn.
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W12 20 Aug 19 11.14am | |
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Originally posted by Badger11
I still think Johnson will get a no deal through by a very narrow margin and then call a GE at which point he will wipe the floor with Corbyn. No, this has last minute removal of the backstop and subsequent signing of a still punitive treaty written all over it. I just can't see the EU just walking away from £39bn and the chance to tie us in at least for a couple more years. Boris claims victory, a "compromise" is reached and MP's retire to the Red Lion to pat each other on the back and start to plot fully rejoining the EU. Leavers simply get phucked over yet again and Police get to fight all the nasty racists in the street. I hope I'm wrong.
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Badger11 Beckenham 20 Aug 19 11.54am | |
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Originally posted by W12
No, this has last minute removal of the backstop and subsequent signing of a still punitive treaty written all over it. I just can't see the EU just walking away from £39bn and the chance to tie us in at least for a couple more years. Boris claims victory, a "compromise" is reached and MP's retire to the Red Lion to pat each other on the back and start to plot fully rejoining the EU. Leavers simply get phucked over yet again and Police get to fight all the nasty racists in the street. I hope I'm wrong. Ridiculous, they would never retire to the Red Lion too down market for the likes of them. You may have a point about the rest of your statement.
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Mapletree Croydon 20 Aug 19 12.29pm | |
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Originally posted by Badger11
Ridiculous, they would never retire to the Red Lion too down market for the likes of them. You may have a point about the rest of your statement. Isn't there a subsidised bar at the HoC?
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Badger11 Beckenham 20 Aug 19 12.40pm | |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
Isn't there a subsidised bar at the HoC? Exactly
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 20 Aug 19 4.23pm | |
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Originally posted by becky
Surely, installing an unelected interim government to oppose the stated will of the people would hardly be in line with your idea of democracy? The reality is that after a successful vote of no confidence, BJ may decide NOT to use the 14 days available to re-form a government that is acceptable to the House, but may just call a GE immediately. Since the House doesn't sit again until 3rd September,a vote of no confidence would have to be tabled and approved and a GE takes 6 weeks to deliver, there still wouldn't be any time left to negotiate very much at all.In fact, with a bit of judicious timing, the clock could just be run down to 31st Octber anyway. As any interim government would be every bit as elected as any other it would fit perfectly with any idea of democracy! I recognise the tactics you suggest as the ones now being floated around as the threats to Parliament. If tried we would end up with a full blown constitutional crisis. I don't think many of Johnson's government would support such a plan actually being enacted so I don't think it is really viable. The Speaker may well have something to say about it too.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 20 Aug 19 4.32pm | |
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Originally posted by Jimenez
Yet you wasted 2 minutes of you're time responding? My "predictions of doom and gloom" aren't mine at all! They are where the consensus of export opinion lies. Actually I am far less worried about the short term issues. No doubt there will be some disruption but we will muddle through as we always do. Where there is a will and way will be found. I am much more concerned about the long term implications of separating ourselves from the EU regulatory regime and the power that such a big organisation brings to trade agreements and in world affairs. The regulatory regime aspect of this is hardly ever discussed but is actually one of the biggest downsides of us leaving.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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