Covid and the Ukraine war are the best thing to ever happen for Brexit - we can simply close our eyes and attribute any negative consequences to those, and none to Brexit.

I see a Tory MP was pronouncing the discovery of shellfish beds in the Thames estuary as a Brexit bonus this week - the general rule is anything remotely positive that happens in Britain is a result of Brexit (even when it's objectively nonsense, like above) and anything negative that happens in Britain has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with Brexit, even when it's to do with things like trade, shipping and industry.

It's a hell of a phenomenon.

I know Brexit is the be all and end all of your political identity, but it's not like that for everyone - why on earth would I be embarrassed about anything. I'm very, very satisfied who history will remember more kindly between the two camps.

The FT had an article today with some economic study predicting us as 5% worse off due to Brexit - it's pointless discussing those types of things though, because as with the campaign itself, anything professing to be factual, research-based or advocated by experts can simply be ignored by sticking your fingers in your ears and singing 'Rule Britannia'.

I'll say this again, Brexit was not done for economic reasons, it was mainly voted for stopping immigration and has hence been betrayed.

There were predictions on an overall economic restriction due to Brexit of between 3 and 5 percent. It should be remembered that this is a remainer perspective and a prediction that Europe does well while we don't......Well, with covid spending madness and the Ukraine war this all rather becomes moot, because we now have an economic strait jacket which is slowly restricting.

In fact I believe we will be more affected by economic collapse when it does come precisely because Brexit hasn't been pursued and instead the Tories have gone for a very very soft version that might as well not exist.

Another betrayal.

I completely disagree with your prediction that leaving the EU will be seen as economically disastrous......I don't think you appreciate just how dire the economic house of cards is....we are sitting in the middle of the pack in terms of European countries.

I believe the EU economic project will be seen as a failure....if it isn't already.....with a far looser and less ambitious system eventually taking its place.

Edited by Stirlingsays (11 Jan 2024 4.31pm)

No, it depended upon who you were listening to. If you believe political campaigns are ever honest and not slanted to present best outcomes for one perspective and the most negative for the opposition I don't know what to say to you.

The remainers lied just as hard.

However, the voters mainly voted for immigration purposes. If you listen to the post brexit interviews and analysis the brexit campaign decided to focus upon the economic arguments to avoid the remainers smearing with their usual 'racism' fetish that might have put off some of the northern Labour voters.

However, it was always about immigration.....which is why Brexit has turned out to be an utter betrayal by the Tories.

I know Brexit is the be all and end all of your political identity, but it's not like that for everyone - why on earth would I be embarrassed about anything. I'm very, very satisfied who history will remember more kindly between the two camps.

The FT had an article today with some economic study predicting us as 5% worse off due to Brexit - it's pointless discussing those types of things though, because as with the campaign itself, anything professing to be factual, research-based or advocated by experts can simply be ignored by sticking your fingers in your ears and singing 'Rule Britannia'.

No it wasn’t for the hardline devout anti-EU types. It was all about the most worthless of commodities, pride. Something that has never put any bread on the table. It’s great though if your priority is just waving flags.

Those selling the illusion of a reduction in immigration because of Brexit ought to be pilloried for their crimes. It was never going to happen. All it ever was going to do was change the source from Eastern Europe to Africa and Asia. I bet people are really pleased about that.