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Ukraine Situation - Should We Be Worried?
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 eaglesdare  07 Apr 22 12.18pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
That wouldn't have saved any lives. The complaints from Putin about Ukraine joining Nato, and/or the EU, is propaganda. A smokescreen to justify what he always intended. Nato is not a "threat" to Russia. It is solely for defence, and exists to deter Russian aggression. Putin's action has probably increased the chances of whatever remains of Ukraine becoming a member of Nato. Prior to the invasion it might have been easier to negotiate a dmz either side of the borders, but that still seems negotiable. Nato is not going to be dragged into WW3 by anyone. Zelensky knows that. All he is doing is using the feelings of guilt that arise from our hands being tied when faced with atrocities, to secure more military aid and sanctions. Putin may not like the idea of Ukraine joining the EU, but he really doesn't have any cogent arguments to raise. We will just have to agree to disagree in that case!
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| Stirlingsays 07 Apr 22 12.51pm |
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Originally posted by PalazioVecchio
the Partition of Ukrain into two States ( Russian East and Ukranian West) is a good idea. But it need not be 50:50. In terms of territory and population a 65:35 split may make more sense. then use welfare & money to slowly re-locate peoples into the correct enclave. Something which should have been done in Northern Ireland....create a 100% Protestant Region to prevent any bloodshed. Probably a smaller region than the 6 Counties they got. 4 Counties with 100% Prod population....and peace for all.
Edited by PalazioVecchio (07 Apr 2022 12.20pm) I think it's going to be the end result as do many people. However, that's easy for us to say as it isn't our country. I couldn't look a Ukrainian man in the eyes and tell him not to fight for his land....it's grim. Still, how I see it there is a one sided meat grinder in the east. Logistics aren't going to be a problem for the Russians and they vastly over power the Ukrainians in equipment and fuel is no issue for them, the only downside for them could be morale as essentially, while the leadership present this war as an existential war that they can't afford to lose the common Russian soldier is the actual guy doing the killing on the ground and they are attacking not defending....they are fighting essentially their own kin....an Ukrainian to a Russian is essentially a Welshman to an Englishman. I think that's why you are seeing the Russians calling up lots of foreign fighters, Chechens and Georgians....probably Syrians turning up, I wouldn't be surprised if some of the war crimes are related to this. It seems obvious to me that the west are pushing for a continence of the war, personally I don't think they give anymore than lip service to what's best for Ukraine. This is purely a means for them to double down on the height of elitist stupidity over decades. Edited by Stirlingsays (07 Apr 2022 1.13pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 07 Apr 22 3.28pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
I think it's going to be the end result as do many people. However, that's easy for us to say as it isn't our country. I couldn't look a Ukrainian man in the eyes and tell him not to fight for his land....it's grim. Still, how I see it there is a one sided meat grinder in the east. Logistics aren't going to be a problem for the Russians and they vastly over power the Ukrainians in equipment and fuel is no issue for them, the only downside for them could be morale as essentially, while the leadership present this war as an existential war that they can't afford to lose the common Russian soldier is the actual guy doing the killing on the ground and they are attacking not defending....they are fighting essentially their own kin....an Ukrainian to a Russian is essentially a Welshman to an Englishman. I think that's why you are seeing the Russians calling up lots of foreign fighters, Chechens and Georgians....probably Syrians turning up, I wouldn't be surprised if some of the war crimes are related to this. It seems obvious to me that the west are pushing for a continence of the war, personally I don't think they give anymore than lip service to what's best for Ukraine. This is purely a means for them to double down on the height of elitist stupidity over decades. Edited by Stirlingsays (07 Apr 2022 1.13pm) You were doing quite well until you got to your last paragraph. I don't think the west are pushing for continence. That's just taking the p*ss! Then you cap that by introducing your favourite bogeymen, the "elites" who are blamed for everything. It's not just what's best for Ukraine that's at stake in all of this. It's what's best for all of Europe and beyond.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Stirlingsays 07 Apr 22 4.03pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
You were doing quite well until you got to your last paragraph. I don't think the west are pushing for continence. That's just taking the p*ss! Then you cap that by introducing your favourite bogeymen, the "elites" who are blamed for everything. It's not just what's best for Ukraine that's at stake in all of this. It's what's best for all of Europe and beyond. Well, I hope you're right that they aren't pushing for continuance but the impression I'm getting is that they are. Yes, the bogeymen are responsible....I'm sorry if that doesn't pass your sniff test. Edited by Stirlingsays (07 Apr 2022 4.08pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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BlueJay  UK 07 Apr 22 4.56pm |
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"Germany's foreign intelligence service, the BND, has heard messages from Putin's forces discussing the brutal murder of civilians in the city of horrors outside Kyiv, which was recaptured by Ukraine over the weekend. The transmissions have been linked to specific corpses seen in Bucha, with one soldier talking about how he and his colleagues shot dead someone on a bicycle (inset), while another said: 'First question soldiers, then shoot them.' The audio messages have been relayed to German parliament by the BND to further debunk baseless Kremlin claims that the bodies were staged by Ukraine after Russia withdrew from the city in a 'monstrous forgery'. Messages show the troops regularly discussed the potential war crimes as if they were talking about their everyday lives. The wiretap recordings also show that the Wagner Group (left) was present in the city and played 'a key role' in the massacre, and that there are likely similar scenes of slaughter elsewhere in the country. The shadowy military company which has been linked to a string of killings, rapes and war crimes around the world is known as Putin's private army which carries out his dirty work at an arm's length from the state."
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| BlueJay UK 07 Apr 22 10.34pm |
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Russia says it would have to 'rebalance' if Finland and Sweden join NATO - [Link] You would think Putin and co would realise a natural consequence of the Russian invasion of Ukraine is that it becomes an inevitability that others will want to fast track entry to NATO. As well they should. A desperate and fatigued bully; an adequate description of both Putin and the anti western types who fight his corner. Clearly Putin expected Ukraine to instantly fold and that they'd have a new puppet-regime installed within days. Didn't happen, won't happen.
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| BlueJay UK 08 Apr 22 12.01am |
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Originally posted by eaglesdare
The amount of lives that could have been saved if Zelenskyy simply said ukraine would not join Nato and the EU! Instead he is going around making video calls and trying to drag other nations into a WW3! Just to expand on this... He is giving his nation a fighting chance against an invading army. Immediately rolling over and giving up chunks of your country (which is clearly what Putin wants, and may well still get), isn't leadership material and would've still resulted in significant civilian causalities, because many Ukranians wouldn't have gone along with it. Zelensky's life is literally on the line too, so I would take his stance with seriousness. Toy soldier territory isn't an option for him. He's living it. Edited by BlueJay (08 Apr 2022 1.01am)
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Forest Hillbilly  in a hidey-hole 08 Apr 22 9.15am |
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I am still at a loss as to why media reporting suggests Russian military are still destroying buildings and infrastructure. Surely this would just be targeting civilians ? And still no meaningful intervention from international Governments as to why this is being allowed to happen,...still.
I disengage, I turn the page. |
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| cryrst The garden of England 08 Apr 22 9.26am |
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Originally posted by Forest Hillbilly
I am still at a loss as to why media reporting suggests Russian military are still destroying buildings and infrastructure. Surely this would just be targeting civilians ? And still no meaningful intervention from international Governments as to why this is being allowed to happen,...still. I think the Russians may well be itching to use one of there intercontinental ballistic nuclear bombs.
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| Forest Hillbilly in a hidey-hole 08 Apr 22 9.36am |
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Originally posted by cryrst
I think the Russians may well be itching to use one of there intercontinental ballistic nuclear bombs. The spectre of escalation, as Putin has already threatened. And his actions already have the mentality of someone unhinged. Yet I return to the issue of the United Nations Security Council and other organisations meant to intervene.
I disengage, I turn the page. |
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| BlueJay UK 08 Apr 22 11.09am |
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Ukraine says more than 30 people are dead and 100 wounded after rockets hit a train station in the city of Kramatorsk in eastern Ukraine. It's been coined a 'Ukrainian provocation' by the Kremlin and Russian media. No doubt we need to give equal weight to this 'oh so believable' Kremlin line, on account of our own wicked western mainstream media /sarcasm
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 08 Apr 22 12.00pm |
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Originally posted by Forest Hillbilly
I am still at a loss as to why media reporting suggests Russian military are still destroying buildings and infrastructure. Surely this would just be targeting civilians ? And still no meaningful intervention from international Governments as to why this is being allowed to happen,...still. What do you think the west can do, that they aren't already doing, that wouldn't risk the start of WW3, and a nuclear disaster?
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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