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Terrorism
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 Ray in Houston  Houston 07 Dec 17 3.05pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Conflict is a bit like that.
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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cryrst  The garden of England 07 Dec 17 4.38pm |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
Not that I fully understood the Irish issue it wasn't just Catholics in Ireland doing terror as N I WAS AND IS STILL A BRITISH SOVEREIGNTY.Over here yes but in Ireland it was loyalists as well. I think that needs stating to leave no biase in opinions ray.
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jamiemartin721  Reading 07 Dec 17 4.43pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Conflict is a bit like that. So its not a war, but it is a conflict.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 07 Dec 17 4.51pm |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
Its a bit tricky, when we talk about people who fought for IS, as they're strictly speaking not necessarily terrorists in the traditional sense. Now I'm not saying they should get a pass, because obviously they're a threat if they decide to come home and conduct their Jyhad here. But its also significant maybe, that they went to Syria to fight, rather than conduct acts of terrorism in the UK. They should answer for the crimes in Syria and Iraq, but its important maybe to remember that not everyone is going to be a war criminal, wannabe suicide bomber who can't wait to kill British citizens either. That kind of disregard of life, where in its ok to just kill someone and that's that, kind of reminds me of the kind of mentality that IS has towards people in general. Sure, we might have to, where no other option exists. But we shouldn't jump and slaver with excitement at the possibility of killing people either.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 07 Dec 17 4.59pm |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
Which is the key point here - Yes, sometimes, its the only option, and those people can have no real complaints. But for the most part, it was a far more sensible approach to security in NI than having a 'shoot to kill' policy, based on intelligence. Its also important to remember that we weren't all that certain at identifying who was and wasn't in the Provisional IRA even when we got convictions and arrests. Much better, was the approach of creating ambushes of Provo's as they prepaired to launch 'operations' (ie catching them in the act having staked out weapon cashes etc). Because intelligence, often comes from questionable, unconfirmed and biased sources.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 07 Dec 17 5.02pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Are you giving equivalence to a band of murdering religious nutcases? No, I'm saying, its not something special, and reasonably understandable, compared to blowing yourself up at a concert. Its part and parcel of being the prime minister in any kind of conflict. You're a target and a reasonable one.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 07 Dec 17 5.05pm |
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Originally posted by chris123
Wow - I can't believe what I'm reading. What that I can understand why the Prime Minister is a target of Islamists associated with IS, compared to an Ariana Grande concert. I think its a far more reasoned and logical decision to target those in a position of authority and power. Its 101 terrorism and warfare.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| Ray in Houston Houston 07 Dec 17 5.07pm |
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Originally posted by cryrst
Not that I fully understood the Irish issue it wasn't just Catholics in Ireland doing terror as N I WAS AND IS STILL A BRITISH SOVEREIGNTY.Over here yes but in Ireland it was loyalists as well. I think that needs stating to leave no biase in opinions ray. Well, the Northern Irish are still "Irish" the same way that Scots are Scots and Welsh are sheep-shaggers. However, it wasn't the Northern Irish who came this close to blowing me up on three occasions. That was Irish Catholics. I do concur that the violence in Ireland was being perpetrated by all sides. What spilled over to the mainland was from one side in the fight only.
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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| Stuk Top half 07 Dec 17 5.08pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Don't be daft, targeting the Manchester Arena was a war crime, the prime minister is a legitimate military target. Doesn't mean I support it, but she's the head of state, in a country engaged in a war. Of course she's a target. WTF are you on about? We're not engaged in any war, anywhere. Sometimes you really try too hard to be devil's advocate. Even saying she is a legitimate target is a monumentally stupid thing to say.
Optimistic as ever |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 07 Dec 17 5.16pm |
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Originally posted by Stuk
WTF are you on about? We're not engaged in any war, anywhere. Sometimes you really try too hard to be devil's advocate. Even saying she is a legitimate target is a monumentally stupid thing to say. We were engaged in a war with IS, we were supporting military operations on the ground with the RAF. Do I think we were right, yes. But then I think that its probably also right, if your the other side, to target the people giving the orders, rather than some kids attending a concert. When we invaded Iraq, Saddam Hussain, was a direct target of US and UK bombing operations. It stands to reason, to target the enemy leaders.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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 Hrolf The Ganger 07 Dec 17 5.27pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
So its not a war, but it is a conflict. A war has to be declared.
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| Hrolf The Ganger 07 Dec 17 5.32pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
No, I'm saying, its not something special, and reasonably understandable, compared to blowing yourself up at a concert. Its part and parcel of being the prime minister in any kind of conflict. You're a target and a reasonable one. I'd say trying to kill a Prime Minister goes way above terrorism. That is an attempt to destabilise the country. That is justification to take serious action where the civil rights of a minority become secondary.
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