This page is no longer updated, and is the old forum. For new topics visit the New HOL forum.
Ukraine Situation - Should We Be Worried?
Register | Edit Profile | Subscriptions | Forum Rules | Log In
 Stirlingsays  30 Mar 22 6.45pm |
   |
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by georgenorman
You seriously believe that? Have you researched it?
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
|
 Alert a moderator to this post |
  |
| Stirlingsays 30 Mar 22 7.00pm |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Mapletree
Just the same as Afghanistan so yes this had been clear to me. In Afghanistan the allies effectively donated a massive war chest of machinery, weaponry and ammunition when they ran away at such speed. Be worried. I still can't quite get my head around it. God knows where all that has gone.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
 georgenorman 30 Mar 22 7.04pm |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Have you researched it? Hitler used to say Germany was badly treated and taken advantage of.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| Stirlingsays 30 Mar 22 7.30pm |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by georgenorman
Hitler used to say Germany was badly treated and taken advantage of. There is a reason that after WW2 you had the Marshall plan in Germany and not another Treaty of Versailles....No one wanted a repeat....Germans were staving to death in the twenties and being forced to work in factories for nothing by us and the French. You seriously think Hitler came to power as some sort of jolly idea that they would try something fresh or something? The Nazis came to power promising bread and work. Unfortunately memories don't appear to have been working well back in the nineties. Edited by Stirlingsays (30 Mar 2022 7.32pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| georgenorman 30 Mar 22 7.45pm |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Stirlingsays
There is a reason that after WW2 you had the Marshall plan in Germany and not another Treaty of Versailles....No one wanted a repeat....Germans were staving to death in the twenties and being forced to work in factories for nothing by us and the French. You seriously think Hitler came to power as some sort of jolly idea that they would try something fresh or something? The Nazis came to power promising bread and work. Unfortunately memories don't appear to have been working well back in the nineties. Edited by Stirlingsays (30 Mar 2022 7.32pm) And I guess Mussolini came to power due to those Abyssinians starving Italians to death.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| Stirlingsays 30 Mar 22 7.52pm |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by georgenorman
And I guess Mussolini came to power due to those Abyssinians starving Italians to death. Mussolini was nothing like as extreme as Hitler and was a response to socialism. A figure like Hitler would never have risen in Germany without the poverty that Germany was in. Why am I even arguing this?....it's in about a million books.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| georgenorman 30 Mar 22 8.01pm |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Mussolini was nothing like as extreme as Hitler and was a response to socialism. A figure like Hitler would never have risen in Germany without the poverty that Germany was in. Why am I even arguing this?....it's in about a million books. Fascists leaders were in power, or very significant, in many European countries.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| Stirlingsays 30 Mar 22 8.10pm |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by georgenorman
Fascists leaders were in power, or very significant, in many European countries. The rise of Fascism was in response to communism/socialism. No other country had undergone what Germany had after WW1, Hitler was extreme because the environment was extreme and he wouldn't have risen in Germany otherwise......Look take it up with the historians if you have a different view. Edited by Stirlingsays (30 Mar 2022 8.11pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| steeleye20 Croydon 30 Mar 22 9.38pm |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Here's the thing Steeleye. Russia could have become much closer to the West had it followed the same path as when Gorbachev and Yeltsin were in control. Sadly, it fell into the hands of Putin and his cronies. When Russia is once again ruled by wiser men, rather than gangsters, then perhaps the door will open once again. It is in every European's interest for Europe east and west to be united when we face the world's future problems. This does not mean we all have to join a particular club, but that we all have mutual interests and a desire for continued peace. Indeed H, however we are where we are. In the mire for years to come.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| silvertop Portishead 31 Mar 22 8.55am |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by Stirlingsays
There's an concerning issue here that I haven't seen raised here but that could have serious consequences for us here in the west. We are sending huge numbers of arms into Ukraine. I'm conflicted with this because I support their ability to fight the invasion. However the reality is that the Ukraine has many criminal gangs and there are serious weapons going in here....stingers, anti tank, portable anti air....Great if it's just in the hands of a professional army. However, anyone who is following this knows that civilian and foreign volunteers are a significant part of the resistance. So what happens with these weapons after this war? There's no administration to track who has what.....stuff is going to be sold on and there are many terrible people willing to use them. This could and probably will come back to bite us. We could be seeing terrorists getting hold of serious weaponry here....civilian airplanes shot out of the sky using anti air that we supplied to Ukraine is an awful consequence to think about. Too late now, but as I haven't seen it mentioned....I thought I'd mention it. Happened in Afghanistan. Was a time late 80s early 90s when us westerners could visit a border town and pay to fire an RPG, a Kalashnikov, hurl a grenade or, for a bit more money, a stinger. That was the nice part of the consequence of excess ordnance. The less nice was played out through the decade and into the next.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| silvertop Portishead 31 Mar 22 8.59am |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by georgenorman
Hitler used to say Germany was badly treated and taken advantage of. To be fair a lot of people said that after Versailles.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
| georgenorman 31 Mar 22 1.42pm |
|
|---|---|
|
Originally posted by silvertop
To be fair a lot of people said that after Versailles. What's fairness got to do with any of this.
|
|
| Alert a moderator to this post |
|
Login / RegisterNew users
Registration is now on our new message board
Existing users
To login with your existing username you will need to convert your account over to the new message board.
Sponsors
All images and text on this site are copyright © 1999-2024 The Holmesdale Online, unless otherwise stated.
Web Design by Guntrisoft Ltd.