I’m fine with that but it wasn’t a bluff and you still dismissed the figures.

Made me smile given that I am seriously doubting my own sanity at the moment. But yes, the 'Deep State' narrative has been troubling me of late because I have always tended towards the history as cock-up rather than conspiracy theory but this issue of the back-stop has troubled me from the beginning.

I remember watching footage of the Parlimentary Brexit committe early on in the process in which they had the then Brexit Minister, David Davies, under scrutiny with this issue of the Irish border under the spotlight. And he was absolutely convincing that it all boiled down to an issue around the collection of VAT on goods entering the UK and then crossing over into Ireland. Purely a technical issue that was solvable if the political will was there.

There was already a freedom of movement agreement in place, pre-dating the EU, with Southern Ireland and less than half of 1% of the UK's export cross at that border. Any hardening of it impacts directly on Ireland in a vastly disproportionate way to the UK and there was zero pressure on us to do anything other than keep it flowing.

And the notion of there being no border checks as things stands is utter nonsense. Both sides are policed with customs patrols. Just look up the issue of heating oil being bought in the north and taken to the south. The Irish customs are all over that. And once again, the UK are far more easy going than the Republic.

Yet May comes back with that backstop. Knowing that the DUP would never support it along with a significant amount of her own back benchers. It was a no-go from day 1.

So the only conclusion is that she never wanted it to pass.

And she got her way.

Perhaps I have lost the plot. Perhaps I need to don a tin-foil hat and write letters in green ink. But I just cannot arrive at any other conclusion given the evidence on the table in open view.

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

You give May too much credit. Not sure she is shrewd or savvy enough for this Machiavellian scheme. My thoughts that she is a double agent, on a snape vibe, are more considered in jest than reality.

When she announced the great idea of tea with Jezza she said it would have to be tied to her deal. Even then, and I assume now, she believes it could pass.

Politics is brinkmanship at its most extreme. Did you see Drax try to absolve himself of guilt for voting aye on MV3 with a point of order the next morning? He felt so guilty and compromised that he apologizes the next morning, yet he was ok voting for it the night before.

Her core strategy since day 1 was threaten a no deal, I think she might have thought the DUP and enough non tories would back her WA to avoid that, but it didn’t work out that way.

So now she is asking for June 30, and the media expect a counter offer of 1 year, but flexible enough to end early if there is an agreement on something.

She also now states in her letter of today that we would be prepared to fight euro elections.

2 things she vowed would never happen. She has really built a lot of bipartisan trust and credibility.......

I just think she is stubborn, a poor leader, and a weak and dimwitted negotiator.

Trump lost. Badly. Hahahahahahaha.

The claim has been made, and a case has been sent to the High Court with a request for a speedy hearing on the matter. A former Appeal Court Judge has agreed that there is a case to be made

[Link]

A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers

I want to believe all of what you claim about May, I really do. But you do not achieve high political office in any country by being as stupid as you claim she is.

It simply does not wash. Personally, and here I accept I am right into the conspiracy s***, I suspect her husband has played a huge role in all of this because they are in many ways a real 'power' couple. I accept that I am socially conservative with old fashioned views but I inherently distrust the motives of any politician who does not have children. I know that can be pulled to pieces in all sorts of ways but that is my gut instinct and nothing will ever change that.

May is shrewd, with an incredibly thick skin (by all political conventions she should have gone even though she won the leadership challenge because of the amount of votes cast against her) and she does not come back to us with a deal that she knows is going to fail without having a bloody good reason.

The DUP alone are reason it is a non-starter. And the DUP are the real deal when it comes to politics. This is not a game for them and I am sure they all still have to check underneath their cars for bombs along with knowing both victims and perpetrators of terrorist killings. They are a cut above your usual self serving political types we get in the UK. I am not defending them, and have never understood all that sectarian nonsense but they don't back down easily. She would have known that.

Yes, some of the ERG did back it but I suspect they worked out what was happening. Again, these are not silly people (nobody who makes it Parliament should ever be underestimated) and I believe worked it out too late.

Revoking A50 was never a goer. They need a second referendum to offer them at least a veneer of democratic accountability. May gets the Labour Party to give her that, with the backlash shared equally between them both.

In someways it deserves kudos for the cunning.

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

If we actually left, then we'd save £39bn on the Brexit divorce bill immediately. Then you have no more annual contributions to the EU going forward – which is £9bn net. That pays for a lot of UNITED KINGDOM public services you keep going on about.

Edited by Penge Eagle (05 Apr 2019 2.35pm)