This page is no longer updated, and is the old forum. For new topics visit the New HOL forum.
Register | Edit Profile | Subscriptions | Forum Rules | Log In
JohnB 03 Apr 19 8.03am | |
---|---|
May inviting Corbyn for talks is purely a tactical move to shift the blame on to Labour. At the moment the default is a no deal brexit and with the tories not being able to survive a GE, the best move from May was to shift the blame to Labour and the EU. I think much of what's gone on over the last year has been tactical manoeuvring from the government to leave the EU with no deal, deflecting blame on the EU and now at the last minute Labour. Then when we have left they will hope to be able to invoke the civil contingencies act, giving the government huge amount of power over legislation. Over the next few days I expect May to firmly come out and say no agreement could be made and blame Corbyn.
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Matov 03 Apr 19 8.10am | |
---|---|
Originally posted by JohnB
May inviting Corbyn for talks is purely a tactical move to shift the blame on to Labour. At the moment the default is a no deal brexit and with the tories not being able to survive a GE, the best move from May was to shift the blame to Labour and the EU. I think much of what's gone on over the last year has been tactical manoeuvring from the government to leave the EU with no deal, deflecting blame on the EU and now at the last minute Labour. Then when we have left they will hope to be able to invoke the civil contingencies act, giving the government huge amount of power over legislation. Over the next few days I expect May to firmly come out and say no agreement could be made and blame Corbyn. Nice theory but from listening to the faces being trotted out this morning, this is not what is happening. This is all about ensuring a second referendum with Remain or what would be an absolutely farcical Brexit with us as nothing more than a vassal state of the EU as the only choices. They are f***ing us. As simple and crude as that. One last chance and that is if the 1922 Committee decide to withdraw their support from May. And that has to happen today.
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell. |
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Midlands Eagle 03 Apr 19 8.21am | |
---|---|
Originally posted by Matov
They have one last roll of the dice. Crash the Government, purge their ranks of any Remainer/Pro-May MP's, stick Boris in charge and fight a GE on the basis that we leave with No Deal. <snip> Lots of Remainers were smugly quiet about us never leaving. I always dismissed them as fools but perhaps it is people like me who are the naive ones?
The problem is that with so many closet Remainers in the party would they actually vote him in to the top job
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Badger11 Beckenham 03 Apr 19 8.27am | |
---|---|
Nick Ferrari to Tory Minister: "So what does an Marxist leader of a party riddled with anti-Semitism bring to the table".
One more point |
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Matov 03 Apr 19 8.34am | |
---|---|
Originally posted by Midlands Eagle
The problem is that with so many closet Remainers in the party would they actually vote him in to the top job And there in lays the issue. But if the reports are a true that a majority of Cabinet Ministers wanted 'No Deal' but May still did what she did, then it starts to get a whole lot more sinister. If there are no resignations by midday, then her 'coup' has succeeded. Even by themselves then they will not be enough but it has to be indicative of the wider pressures within the Conservative party.
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell. |
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
ex hibitionist Hastings 03 Apr 19 8.51am | |
---|---|
democracy is only a means to an end - it's why you'll never get a referendum on hanging, there's too many idiots out there, and 52% of them want to hang themselves - the customs union is not a betrayal it's a lifeline, and if it is a betrayal I couldn't give a toss because it's infinitely preferable to economic meltdown, and 90% of the finance and business community agree - Brexit is boll*cks, pure and simple, this whole thing is a catastrophe conceived and delivered by the Conservative Party - if Tommy Robinson, Nigel Farage, Rees Mogg, Fox, Bojo, Duncan Smith, Baker, the little ERG twerp they all take the p*ss out of get angry that's a good sign, clueless w*nkers the lot of them - their core support ironically is the white trash they're out to screw - f*ck 'em all, well done Theresa, I'm willing to compromise and accept a soft Brexit though I have to hold my nose, not because I'm unpatriotic or undemocratic, just don't fancy economic meltdown any time soon, or maybe I'm just a bleeding heart liberal either brainwashed by 'project fear' or one of its spokesmen.
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Badger11 Beckenham 03 Apr 19 9.04am | |
---|---|
Originally posted by ex hibitionist
democracy is only a means to an end - it's why you'll never get a referendum on hanging, there's too many idiots out there, and 52% of them want to hang themselves - the customs union is not a betrayal it's a lifeline, and if it is a betrayal I couldn't give a toss because it's infinitely preferable to economic meltdown, and 90% of the finance and business community agree - Brexit is boll*cks, pure and simple, this whole thing is a catastrophe conceived and delivered by the Conservative Party - if Tommy Robinson, Nigel Farage, Rees Mogg, Fox, Bojo, Duncan Smith, Baker, the little ERG twerp they all take the p*ss out of get angry that's a good sign, clueless w*nkers the lot of them - their core support ironically is the white trash they're out to screw - f*ck 'em all, well done Theresa, I'm willing to compromise and accept a soft Brexit though I have to hold my nose, not because I'm unpatriotic or undemocratic, just don't fancy economic meltdown any time soon, or maybe I'm just a bleeding heart liberal either brainwashed by 'project fear' or one of its spokesmen. Not delivering on the referendum result is going to create problems further than the road. If history teaches us anything it is that reasonable politicians need to deliver reasonable solutions. When they fail to do this you open the door to the real nasty people. Thankfully in this country the nasty people on the left and the right have never had any real support amongst the people. However Parliament ignoring the democratic will of the people will make a rod for their own back. I think we will see an increase in the "nasty" politics and an increase in civil disturbances similar to France. Parliament and the government will wring their hands and says this is outrageous and yet they are the ones responsible. One of the key things that stands this country apart from many others is that we have an election which is largely fair and the losing side accept the result. In future why should anyone respect the result of the next GE or any election.
One more point |
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Willo South coast - west of Brighton. 03 Apr 19 9.09am | |
---|---|
Originally posted by Midlands Eagle
The problem is that with so many closet Remainers in the party would they actually vote him in to the top job In a leadership contest it is the MPs who vote until there are only 2 candidates and then members like me get to select one for the leadership.The membership is very much pro-brexit and in a recent poll 75% voted for 'No Deal'.A recent poll amongst members for the next Tory leader had Johnson ahead with Raab second.
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Willo South coast - west of Brighton. 03 Apr 19 9.20am | |
---|---|
Originally posted by Matov
And there in lays the issue. But if the reports are a true that a majority of Cabinet Ministers wanted 'No Deal' but May still did what she did, then it starts to get a whole lot more sinister. If there are no resignations by midday, then her 'coup' has succeeded. Even by themselves then they will not be enough but it has to be indicative of the wider pressures within the Conservative party. There are reports that some Tory MPs have urged cabinet ministers to stage a mutiny and make moves to oust May immediately.Some Conservative MPs now fear Brexit is in jeopardy and Iain Duncan Smith has said that legitimising Corbyn is appalling and is a disaster. The sooner May goes the better and I have been a fervent Conservative supporter for many,many a year serving my local party and taking an active role in both local and general elections.
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Mapletree Croydon 03 Apr 19 9.35am | |
---|---|
Originally posted by Alex1991
The brexit people voted for was a fallacy that was never going to be achievable. People like you who pushed that message are responsible for this mess. I really want to know what is the Brexit for which people voted And how people that claim to know have the data to make that determination I happen to know that the majority of leave voters wanted a Customs Union and no freedom of movement. I also know that re-running the referendum would result in Remaining Edited by Mapletree (03 Apr 2019 9.45am)
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Mapletree Croydon 03 Apr 19 9.39am | |
---|---|
Originally posted by Willo
There are reports that some Tory MPs have urged cabinet ministers to stage a mutiny and make moves to oust May immediately.Some Conservative MPs now fear Brexit is in jeopardy and Iain Duncan Smith has said that legitimising Corbyn is appalling and is a disaster. The sooner May goes the better and I have been a fervent Conservative supporter for many,many a year serving my local party and taking an active role in both local and general elections. I believe you may have mentioned. And your point is? So has my mother, mates with Cameron and a fierce Remainer. The same as for the rest of us, there is no common approach on this issue.
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
topcat Holmesdale / Surbiton 03 Apr 19 9.52am | |
---|---|
Shouldn't we see what May and Corbyn come up with before dismissing it? I suspect that this is just a way for May to blame Labour for Brexit but I'm happy to be proved wrong. There is also no reason to believe that Europe will agree even if they do come up with a compromise. Remember that Brexit may mean Brexit but not necessarily the version that you wanted.
It's 106 miles to Chicago, we got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark... and we're wearing sunglasses. |
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Registration is now on our new message board
To login with your existing username you will need to convert your account over to the new message board.
All images and text on this site are copyright © 1999-2024 The Holmesdale Online, unless otherwise stated.
Web Design by Guntrisoft Ltd.