Rolf Harris

This page is no longer updated, and is the old forum. For new topics visit the New HOL forum.

Rolf Harris

Page 16 of 28 < 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 >

jamiemartin721 Reading 02 Jul 14 10.11am
Quote Farawayeagle at 02 Jul 2014 8.57am At his age I really don't see the point in prison. An Open prison -- which it seems possible he would get --- or at most a Category C prison would cost the taxpayers around 160 to 200 thousand pounds over 8 years. It would be better to fine him a few million and donate it to a sexual abuse organisation. As for those saying where is the punishment? I think losing your whole life achievement and all the official accolades you have had. Being disowned by your hometown and country and becoming a social pariah wherever you go -- and having the music and art you created ignored -- would be more than enough punishment. Edited by Farawayeagle (02 Jul 2014 9.00am) I think you have a point, but there is an issue beyond the norm of rehabilition here, we're talking about someone who was a prolific and unrepentant offender, over decades with a dozen plus victims (it would seem). Whilst I don't hold with the idea that punishment for its own sake is justified, it has to serve a rehabilitive process, we're not talking about someone who is a low risk offender. Had these crimes been committed recently, and come to life, he'd be looking at a life sentence as a serial sexual predatory offender considered to be a permanent and persistant threat to society (possibly even a whole life tariff). It'll probably cost 40-60k a year to keep him in prison, but thats money well spent. Him, Hall, Savile etc aren't just dirty old men. They are dedicated, persistant sex offenders, who abused children over a period of decades. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
Alert a moderator to this post

jamiemartin721

Reading 02 Jul 14 10.11am

Quote Farawayeagle at 02 Jul 2014 8.57am

At his age I really don't see the point in prison. An Open prison -- which it seems possible he would get --- or at most a Category C prison would cost the taxpayers around 160 to 200 thousand pounds over 8 years.

It would be better to fine him a few million and donate it to a sexual abuse organisation.

As for those saying where is the punishment?

I think losing your whole life achievement and all the official accolades you have had. Being disowned by your hometown and country and becoming a social pariah wherever you go -- and having the music and art you created ignored -- would be more than enough punishment.

Edited by Farawayeagle (02 Jul 2014 9.00am)

I think you have a point, but there is an issue beyond the norm of rehabilition here, we're talking about someone who was a prolific and unrepentant offender, over decades with a dozen plus victims (it would seem).

Whilst I don't hold with the idea that punishment for its own sake is justified, it has to serve a rehabilitive process, we're not talking about someone who is a low risk offender.

Had these crimes been committed recently, and come to life, he'd be looking at a life sentence as a serial sexual predatory offender considered to be a permanent and persistant threat to society (possibly even a whole life tariff).

It'll probably cost 40-60k a year to keep him in prison, but thats money well spent.

Him, Hall, Savile etc aren't just dirty old men. They are dedicated, persistant sex offenders, who abused children over a period of decades.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

Alert a moderator to this post

Cucking Funt Clapham on the Back 02 Jul 14 10.14am
Quote Superfly at 02 Jul 2014 10.04am Quote Stirlingsays at 02 Jul 2014 9.40am Quote Farawayeagle at 02 Jul 2014 8.57am At his age I really don't see the point in prison. An Open prison -- which it seems possible he would get --- or at most a Category C prison would cost the taxpayers around 160 to 200 thousand pounds over 8 years. It would be better to fine him a few million and donate it to a sexual abuse organisation. As for those saying where is the punishment? I think losing your whole life achievement and all the official accolades you have had. Being disowned by your hometown and country and becoming a social pariah wherever you go -- and having the music and art you created ignored -- would be more than enough punishment. Edited by Farawayeagle (02 Jul 2014 9.00am) Harris's art won't be ignored.....It doesn't work like that. Disagree - that's precisely how it works. Initial estimates are that his painting have dropped by 90% in value. And when was the last time you heard a Gary Glitter record played? That's slightly different, though. GG's stuff isn't heard publicly any more because of a collective decision by broadcasters to not play it. Over time, original Rolf Harris art will gain value simply because of the notoriety attached to it. Original watercolours by Hitler (and he did quite a few) go for millions when they come up for auction. Notoriety sells, no doubt about it. Wife beating may be socially acceptable in Sheffield, but it is a different matter in Cheltenham
Alert a moderator to this post

Cucking Funt

Clapham on the Back 02 Jul 14 10.14am

Quote Superfly at 02 Jul 2014 10.04am

Quote Stirlingsays at 02 Jul 2014 9.40am

Quote Farawayeagle at 02 Jul 2014 8.57am

It would be better to fine him a few million and donate it to a sexual abuse organisation.

As for those saying where is the punishment?

Edited by Farawayeagle (02 Jul 2014 9.00am)

Harris's art won't be ignored.....It doesn't work like that.

Disagree - that's precisely how it works. Initial estimates are that his painting have dropped by 90% in value. And when was the last time you heard a Gary Glitter record played?

That's slightly different, though. GG's stuff isn't heard publicly any more because of a collective decision by broadcasters to not play it. Over time, original Rolf Harris art will gain value simply because of the notoriety attached to it. Original watercolours by Hitler (and he did quite a few) go for millions when they come up for auction.

Notoriety sells, no doubt about it.

Wife beating may be socially acceptable in Sheffield, but it is a different matter in Cheltenham

Alert a moderator to this post

npn Crowborough 02 Jul 14 10.24am
Quote Superfly at 02 Jul 2014 10.04am Quote Stirlingsays at 02 Jul 2014 9.40am Quote Farawayeagle at 02 Jul 2014 8.57am At his age I really don't see the point in prison. An Open prison -- which it seems possible he would get --- or at most a Category C prison would cost the taxpayers around 160 to 200 thousand pounds over 8 years. It would be better to fine him a few million and donate it to a sexual abuse organisation. As for those saying where is the punishment? I think losing your whole life achievement and all the official accolades you have had. Being disowned by your hometown and country and becoming a social pariah wherever you go -- and having the music and art you created ignored -- would be more than enough punishment. Edited by Farawayeagle (02 Jul 2014 9.00am) Harris's art won't be ignored.....It doesn't work like that. Disagree - that's precisely how it works. Initial estimates are that his painting have dropped by 90% in value. And when was the last time you heard a Gary Glitter record played? I very nearly bought one of his paintings a couple of years ago as an investment - thinking "it's a nice work to have around, and when he shuffles off in a few years, the price will rocket". Looks like I dodged a bullet (although if they really have dropped that low, I still might pick one up just for myself).
Alert a moderator to this post

npn

Crowborough 02 Jul 14 10.24am

Quote Superfly at 02 Jul 2014 10.04am

Quote Stirlingsays at 02 Jul 2014 9.40am

Quote Farawayeagle at 02 Jul 2014 8.57am

It would be better to fine him a few million and donate it to a sexual abuse organisation.

As for those saying where is the punishment?

Edited by Farawayeagle (02 Jul 2014 9.00am)

Harris's art won't be ignored.....It doesn't work like that.

Disagree - that's precisely how it works. Initial estimates are that his painting have dropped by 90% in value. And when was the last time you heard a Gary Glitter record played?

I very nearly bought one of his paintings a couple of years ago as an investment - thinking "it's a nice work to have around, and when he shuffles off in a few years, the price will rocket". Looks like I dodged a bullet (although if they really have dropped that low, I still might pick one up just for myself).

Alert a moderator to this post

Stirlingsays 02 Jul 14 10.24am
Quote Superfly at 02 Jul 2014 10.04am Disagree - that's precisely how it works. Initial estimates are that his painting have dropped by 90% in value. And when was the last time you heard a Gary Glitter record played? In Harris's case I'm more referring to his paintings.....I don't think Harris's music carried much weight anyway outside of humorous listening. Still, the reality is that art is art and how people respond to it differs. Berry's music is still played......The BBC have art by a pedophile right outside their entrance....If I remember correctly. Glitter's music is played around the world.....The man doesn't have to work.....I think he made £130,000 thanks to his music being played during the NBA finals. Initial estimates by who? They aren't worth anything. The worth of a painting isn't known until someone bids for it. The reputation of someone whether good or bad does have an effect, but not always how you might think. Hitler's paintings weren't put in the bin you know.....And he wasn't that good. If I remember correctly one of his went for nearly a hundred grand a few years back. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
Alert a moderator to this post

Stirlingsays

02 Jul 14 10.24am

Quote Superfly at 02 Jul 2014 10.04am

Disagree - that's precisely how it works. Initial estimates are that his painting have dropped by 90% in value. And when was the last time you heard a Gary Glitter record played?

In Harris's case I'm more referring to his paintings.....I don't think Harris's music carried much weight anyway outside of humorous listening.

Still, the reality is that art is art and how people respond to it differs.

Berry's music is still played......The BBC have art by a pedophile right outside their entrance....If I remember correctly.

Glitter's music is played around the world.....The man doesn't have to work.....I think he made £130,000 thanks to his music being played during the NBA finals.

Initial estimates by who? They aren't worth anything.
The worth of a painting isn't known until someone bids for it. The reputation of someone whether good or bad does have an effect, but not always how you might think.

Hitler's paintings weren't put in the bin you know.....And he wasn't that good. If I remember correctly one of his went for nearly a hundred grand a few years back.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Alert a moderator to this post

Superfly The sun always shines in Catford 02 Jul 14 10.38am
Fair enough (didn't know that about Glitters NBA pay out - and have to say I'm quite shocked) but as it was used in the punishment context, I can't see his paintings being any kind of asset until long after he's dead. The 90% figure is from a Radio Times piece from yesterday. But the link keeps on crashing my web browsers so I'll refrain from posting it. Lend me a Tenor 31 May to 3 June 2017 John McIntosh Arts Centre London Oratory School SW6 1RX with Superfly in the chorus [Link]
Alert a moderator to this post

Superfly

The sun always shines in Catford 02 Jul 14 10.38am

Fair enough (didn't know that about Glitters NBA pay out - and have to say I'm quite shocked) but as it was used in the punishment context, I can't see his paintings being any kind of asset until long after he's dead.

The 90% figure is from a Radio Times piece from yesterday. But the link keeps on crashing my web browsers so I'll refrain from posting it.

Lend me a Tenor

31 May to 3 June 2017

John McIntosh Arts Centre
London Oratory School
SW6 1RX

with Superfly in the chorus
[Link]

Alert a moderator to this post

Stirlingsays 02 Jul 14 11.04am
Quote Superfly at 02 Jul 2014 10.38am Fair enough (didn't know that about Glitters NBA pay out - and have to say I'm quite shocked) but as it was used in the punishment context, I can't see his paintings being any kind of asset until long after he's dead. The 90% figure is from a Radio Times piece from yesterday. But the link keeps on crashing my web browsers so I'll refrain from posting it. I'm not doubting you. Still, economics and morality rarely meet. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
Alert a moderator to this post

Stirlingsays

02 Jul 14 11.04am

Quote Superfly at 02 Jul 2014 10.38am

The 90% figure is from a Radio Times piece from yesterday. But the link keeps on crashing my web browsers so I'll refrain from posting it.

I'm not doubting you.

Still, economics and morality rarely meet.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Alert a moderator to this post

Farawayeagle Sydney 02 Jul 14 11.07am
Quote jamiemartin721 at 02 Jul 2014 10.11am Quote Farawayeagle at 02 Jul 2014 8.57am At his age I really don't see the point in prison. An Open prison -- which it seems possible he would get --- or at most a Category C prison would cost the taxpayers around 160 to 200 thousand pounds over 8 years. It would be better to fine him a few million and donate it to a sexual abuse organisation. As for those saying where is the punishment? I think losing your whole life achievement and all the official accolades you have had. Being disowned by your hometown and country and becoming a social pariah wherever you go -- and having the music and art you created ignored -- would be more than enough punishment. Edited by Farawayeagle (02 Jul 2014 9.00am) I think you have a point, but there is an issue beyond the norm of rehabilition here, we're talking about someone who was a prolific and unrepentant offender, over decades with a dozen plus victims (it would seem). Whilst I don't hold with the idea that punishment for its own sake is justified, it has to serve a rehabilitive process, we're not talking about someone who is a low risk offender. Had these crimes been committed recently, and come to life, he'd be looking at a life sentence as a serial sexual predatory offender considered to be a permanent and persistant threat to society (possibly even a whole life tariff). It'll probably cost 40-60k a year to keep him in prison, but thats money well spent. Him, Hall, Savile etc aren't just dirty old men. They are dedicated, persistant sex offenders, who abused children over a period of decades. I'd have to disagree with you. I wouldn't want my tax picking up the tab. Founder Of The Crystal Palace Roller Coaster Association An Affiliate Of The Never A Dull Moment Club R.I.P. DJ Hardline -- Gone Way Too Soon GKAS Member 54
Alert a moderator to this post

Farawayeagle

Sydney 02 Jul 14 11.07am

Quote jamiemartin721 at 02 Jul 2014 10.11am

Quote Farawayeagle at 02 Jul 2014 8.57am

It would be better to fine him a few million and donate it to a sexual abuse organisation.

As for those saying where is the punishment?

Edited by Farawayeagle (02 Jul 2014 9.00am)

Whilst I don't hold with the idea that punishment for its own sake is justified, it has to serve a rehabilitive process, we're not talking about someone who is a low risk offender.

It'll probably cost 40-60k a year to keep him in prison, but thats money well spent.

Him, Hall, Savile etc aren't just dirty old men. They are dedicated, persistant sex offenders, who abused children over a period of decades.

I'd have to disagree with you. I wouldn't want my tax picking up the tab.

Founder Of The Crystal Palace Roller Coaster
Association

An Affiliate Of The Never A Dull Moment Club

R.I.P. DJ Hardline -- Gone Way Too Soon

GKAS Member 54

Alert a moderator to this post

jamiemartin721 Reading 02 Jul 14 11.18am
Quote Farawayeagle at 02 Jul 2014 11.07am Quote jamiemartin721 at 02 Jul 2014 10.11am Quote Farawayeagle at 02 Jul 2014 8.57am At his age I really don't see the point in prison. An Open prison -- which it seems possible he would get --- or at most a Category C prison would cost the taxpayers around 160 to 200 thousand pounds over 8 years. It would be better to fine him a few million and donate it to a sexual abuse organisation. As for those saying where is the punishment? I think losing your whole life achievement and all the official accolades you have had. Being disowned by your hometown and country and becoming a social pariah wherever you go -- and having the music and art you created ignored -- would be more than enough punishment. Edited by Farawayeagle (02 Jul 2014 9.00am) I think you have a point, but there is an issue beyond the norm of rehabilition here, we're talking about someone who was a prolific and unrepentant offender, over decades with a dozen plus victims (it would seem). Whilst I don't hold with the idea that punishment for its own sake is justified, it has to serve a rehabilitive process, we're not talking about someone who is a low risk offender. Had these crimes been committed recently, and come to life, he'd be looking at a life sentence as a serial sexual predatory offender considered to be a permanent and persistant threat to society (possibly even a whole life tariff). It'll probably cost 40-60k a year to keep him in prison, but thats money well spent. Him, Hall, Savile etc aren't just dirty old men. They are dedicated, persistant sex offenders, who abused children over a period of decades. I'd have to disagree with you. I wouldn't want my tax picking up the tab. Isn't that what tax is for though, the things you generally wouldn't want to pay for. I'm happy to pay to keep paedophiles and other threats to the public in prison. I'm a bit dubious about the money spent on say Trident or the Olympics. But prison services are something we should be spending more on. The offences are such that just levying a fine (and giving it to charity) wouldn't really serve as an example of justice being done to those victims. Plus criminals rarely if ever pay fines (as they're in prison, theres not really much you can do to levy on them). "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
Alert a moderator to this post

jamiemartin721

Reading 02 Jul 14 11.18am

Quote Farawayeagle at 02 Jul 2014 11.07am

Quote jamiemartin721 at 02 Jul 2014 10.11am

Quote Farawayeagle at 02 Jul 2014 8.57am

It would be better to fine him a few million and donate it to a sexual abuse organisation.

As for those saying where is the punishment?

Edited by Farawayeagle (02 Jul 2014 9.00am)

Whilst I don't hold with the idea that punishment for its own sake is justified, it has to serve a rehabilitive process, we're not talking about someone who is a low risk offender.

It'll probably cost 40-60k a year to keep him in prison, but thats money well spent.

Him, Hall, Savile etc aren't just dirty old men. They are dedicated, persistant sex offenders, who abused children over a period of decades.

I'd have to disagree with you. I wouldn't want my tax picking up the tab.

Isn't that what tax is for though, the things you generally wouldn't want to pay for. I'm happy to pay to keep paedophiles and other threats to the public in prison. I'm a bit dubious about the money spent on say Trident or the Olympics. But prison services are something we should be spending more on.

The offences are such that just levying a fine (and giving it to charity) wouldn't really serve as an example of justice being done to those victims. Plus criminals rarely if ever pay fines (as they're in prison, theres not really much you can do to levy on them).

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

Alert a moderator to this post

jamiemartin721 Reading 02 Jul 14 11.26am
Quote Stirlingsays at 02 Jul 2014 10.24am Quote Superfly at 02 Jul 2014 10.04am Disagree - that's precisely how it works. Initial estimates are that his painting have dropped by 90% in value. And when was the last time you heard a Gary Glitter record played? In Harris's case I'm more referring to his paintings.....I don't think Harris's music carried much weight anyway outside of humorous listening. Still, the reality is that art is art and how people respond to it differs. Berry's music is still played......The BBC have art by a pedophile right outside their entrance....If I remember correctly. Glitter's music is played around the world.....The man doesn't have to work.....I think he made £130,000 thanks to his music being played during the NBA finals. Initial estimates by who? They aren't worth anything. The worth of a painting isn't known until someone bids for it. The reputation of someone whether good or bad does have an effect, but not always how you might think. Hitler's paintings weren't put in the bin you know.....And he wasn't that good. If I remember correctly one of his went for nearly a hundred grand a few years back. There is a very healthy market in 'black art'. The price of 'Jim'll Fix it' badges, has risen dramatically in the last few years. Whilst the art value of Rolf's works will drop in the short term, chances are that there are people who collect objects of interest related to notorious criminals: esp when the individual has died, and the stigma about profiting from such objects diminishes. The face value may have decreased, unique, one of objects such as a painting by a celebrity criminal will hold its value very well, especially in certain markets. You woulnd't have got a fiver for a hitler painting in 1945, now, they go for a hundred grand, and he couldn't paint. The art world isn't exactly strangers to people who were deviants, perverts and weirdos. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
Alert a moderator to this post

jamiemartin721

Reading 02 Jul 14 11.26am

Quote Stirlingsays at 02 Jul 2014 10.24am

Quote Superfly at 02 Jul 2014 10.04am

Disagree - that's precisely how it works. Initial estimates are that his painting have dropped by 90% in value. And when was the last time you heard a Gary Glitter record played?

In Harris's case I'm more referring to his paintings.....I don't think Harris's music carried much weight anyway outside of humorous listening.

Still, the reality is that art is art and how people respond to it differs.

Berry's music is still played......The BBC have art by a pedophile right outside their entrance....If I remember correctly.

Glitter's music is played around the world.....The man doesn't have to work.....I think he made £130,000 thanks to his music being played during the NBA finals.

Hitler's paintings weren't put in the bin you know.....And he wasn't that good. If I remember correctly one of his went for nearly a hundred grand a few years back.

There is a very healthy market in 'black art'. The price of 'Jim'll Fix it' badges, has risen dramatically in the last few years. Whilst the art value of Rolf's works will drop in the short term, chances are that there are people who collect objects of interest related to notorious criminals: esp when the individual has died, and the stigma about profiting from such objects diminishes.

The face value may have decreased, unique, one of objects such as a painting by a celebrity criminal will hold its value very well, especially in certain markets.

You woulnd't have got a fiver for a hitler painting in 1945, now, they go for a hundred grand, and he couldn't paint. The art world isn't exactly strangers to people who were deviants, perverts and weirdos.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

Alert a moderator to this post

Forest Hillbilly in a hidey-hole 02 Jul 14 11.31am
Prison. It has several functions, in no particular order of importance. * Punishment, and to some extent retribution from the victim(s) , and society. * Protection of the public. Of paramount importance in some cases. * Rehabilitation. Not as successful as we'd hope, as offenders are often re-introduced to society as better-equipped not to get caught. But strangely, most of them are caught. Re-offending. Open prisons and fining are different issues, as the public would not be deemed 'at risk' Edited by Forest Hillbilly (02 Jul 2014 11.32am) I disengage, I turn the page.
Alert a moderator to this post

Forest Hillbilly

in a hidey-hole 02 Jul 14 11.31am

Send a Private Message to Forest Hillbilly

Prison.
It has several functions, in no particular order of importance.

* Punishment, and to some extent retribution from the victim(s) , and society.
* Protection of the public. Of paramount importance in some cases.
* Rehabilitation. Not as successful as we'd hope, as offenders are often re-introduced to society as better-equipped not to get caught. But strangely, most of them are caught. Re-offending.

Open prisons and fining are different issues, as the public would not be deemed 'at risk'

Edited by Forest Hillbilly (02 Jul 2014 11.32am)

I disengage, I turn the page.

Alert a moderator to this post

Stirlingsays 02 Jul 14 11.39am
Quote Forest Hillbilly at 02 Jul 2014 11.31am Prison. It has several functions, in no particular order of importance. * Punishment, and to some extent retribution from the victim(s) , and society. * Protection of the public. Of paramount importance in some cases. * Rehabilitation. Not as successful as we'd hope, as offenders are often re-introduced to society as better-equipped not to get caught. But strangely, most of them are caught. Re-offending. Open prisons and fining are different issues, as the public would not be deemed 'at risk' Edited by Forest Hillbilly (02 Jul 2014 11.32am) Very true many are.....However, they are then known and the first names to pop up on a localised database when complaints come in. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
Alert a moderator to this post

Stirlingsays

02 Jul 14 11.39am

Quote Forest Hillbilly at 02 Jul 2014 11.31am

Prison.
It has several functions, in no particular order of importance.

* Punishment, and to some extent retribution from the victim(s) , and society.
* Protection of the public. Of paramount importance in some cases.
* Rehabilitation. Not as successful as we'd hope, as offenders are often re-introduced to society as better-equipped not to get caught. But strangely, most of them are caught. Re-offending.

Open prisons and fining are different issues, as the public would not be deemed 'at risk'

Edited by Forest Hillbilly (02 Jul 2014 11.32am)

Very true many are.....However, they are then known and the first names to pop up on a localised database when complaints come in.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Alert a moderator to this post

black eagle. south croydon. 02 Jul 14 11.46am
i met Rolf Harris as a kid doing work experience at a radio station,still a bit shocked by all this,never in a million years did he come across as a paedo. i hate to think what he and Saville got up to when they were at large together at Broadmoor in 1973. still Harris will have to go through public humiliation in prison of everyone trying to have a pop at him something that Saville got away with it. i hope he suffers in prison before he dies,again something Saville never had to endure.
Alert a moderator to this post

black eagle.

south croydon. 02 Jul 14 11.46am

i met Rolf Harris as a kid doing work experience at a radio station,still a bit shocked by all this,never in a million years did he come across as a paedo.

i hate to think what he and Saville got up to when they were at large together at Broadmoor in 1973.

still Harris will have to go through public humiliation in prison of everyone trying to have a pop at him something that Saville got away with it.

i hope he suffers in prison before he dies,again something Saville never had to endure.

Alert a moderator to this post

Page 16 of 28 < 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 >

Previous Topic | Next Topic

Crystal Palace FC Supporters' Website - The Holmesdale Online

Rolf Harris

Site Map

New users

Existing users

Sponsors