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Badger11 Beckenham 08 Feb 23 4.28pm | |
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Originally posted by nead1
Interesting reference to the ECHR in an earlier post; this was set up post WW2, with very significant British influence, and has nothing to do with the EU. Correct it was setup as a response to the Communist eastern bloc the idea was to embarrass and pressurise them. Well they all joined the ECHR and promptly ignored it meanwhile in this country where we didn't have a problem the ECHR overruled our own justice system and is especially beloved by terrorists and sex criminals and those wishing to claim asylum. You say misleading nonsense if you can be bothered to go back through the Brexit thread you will see that pro Brexit posters including myself made it clear 1. Leave EU I hope we do leave, justice should be the responsibility of Parliament and the UK courts not some unelected supranational quango. Edited by Badger11 (08 Feb 2023 4.29pm)
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Behind Enemy Lines Sussex 08 Feb 23 4.34pm | |
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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
But if the majority of the country now want to join, how is that democratic? (call this a hypothetical, I really don't want to debate whether people do or don't) Do we stick with it indefinitely? When would you consider reasonable to allow people to have a say again, given the EU being 'undemocratic' was one of the pillars of the Vote Leave campaign? Broadly, a situation where you don't put something to a vote because you don't like what the outcome would be does not feel a great precedent. I wonder if back in the 1970's, if the voting public had been given a vote on joining the EEC if they'd been told that the trading block they joined would also morph into something different, whether the vote would still have been yes.
hats off to palace, they were always gonna be louder, and hate to say it but they were impressive ALL bouncing and singing. |
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EverybodyDannsNow SE19 08 Feb 23 4.49pm | |
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Originally posted by Behind Enemy Lines
I wonder if back in the 1970's, if the voting public had been given a vote on joining the EEC if they'd been told that the trading block they joined would also morph into something different, whether the vote would still have been yes. An interest speculation, but it is only that. How long would you be comfortable in denying people the right to vote on the issue for? You wouldn't have any concerns with that being both undemocratic and hypocritical?
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steeleye20 Croydon 08 Feb 23 5.26pm | |
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Brexit is disastrous and can only get worse. The common denominator in the argument that somehow in 5/10 years time things will get better is that no reason is ever advanced for this, rather like brexit 'opportunities' which have now been discarded. If the EU bonfire of laws and regulations now costing hundreds of millions and employing hundreds of civil servants does take place I would like to talk up the UK but can't find anything positive, and really there is an issue over our competence and judgement and position internationally which did not exist before. To be frank, we couldn't organise a p*** up in a brewery.
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georgenorman 08 Feb 23 5.34pm | |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
Brexit is disastrous and can only get worse. The common denominator in the argument that somehow in 5/10 years time things will get better is that no reason is ever advanced for this, rather like brexit 'opportunities' which have now been discarded. If the EU bonfire of laws and regulations now costing hundreds of millions and employing hundreds of civil servants does take place I would like to talk up the UK but can't find anything positive, and really there is an issue over our competence and judgement and position internationally which did not exist before. To be frank, we couldn't organise a p*** up in a brewery. "You would like to talk up the UK"!!! Edited by georgenorman (08 Feb 2023 5.35pm)
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Spiderman Horsham 08 Feb 23 5.35pm | |
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Originally posted by georgenorman
"You would like to talk up the UK"!!! Edited by georgenorman (08 Feb 2023 5.35pm) Beat me to it
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Spiderman Horsham 08 Feb 23 5.43pm | |
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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
Fair enough, that makes sense. For what it's worth, I completely agree on Starmer - the promises he made in his leadership bid are already distant memories and he's done a complete 180 on a lot of them. He'll say whatever he thinks people want to hear. Like women can have a p**** or men a cervix
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Behind Enemy Lines Sussex 08 Feb 23 5.56pm | |
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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
An interest speculation, but it is only that. How long would you be comfortable in denying people the right to vote on the issue for? You wouldn't have any concerns with that being both undemocratic and hypocritical?
Tony Blair himself said something along the lines of 'nobody realised how intertwined the UK had become within the EU State'. Which I would have thought went against one of Parliament's main cornerstones; namely, no Parliament can tie the hands of any future Parliament. But it looks as though successive Governments of both colours nearly achieved that. The UK is free to do more of what it pleases with less interference from people and bodies that we would otherwise find difficult to counter. And in answer to your last point; a whole generation had to wait before it was given the opportunity to question EU membership. I see no reason why the same should not apply going forward. Also, the EU has form on getting countries to vote again when the first vote doesn't go their way - Ireland, France, The Netherlands I believe all had to have another go in order to get the correct result. I don't see why the UK shouldn't buck that trend.
hats off to palace, they were always gonna be louder, and hate to say it but they were impressive ALL bouncing and singing. |
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EverybodyDannsNow SE19 08 Feb 23 5.59pm | |
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Originally posted by Spiderman
Like women can have a p**** or men a cervix To be honest that whole topic bores the sh*te out of me.
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EverybodyDannsNow SE19 08 Feb 23 6.05pm | |
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Originally posted by Behind Enemy Lines
Tony Blair himself said something along the lines of 'nobody realised how intertwined the UK had become within the EU State'. Which I would have thought went against one of Parliament's main cornerstones; namely, no Parliament can tie the hands of any future Parliament. But it looks as though successive Governments of both colours nearly achieved that. The UK is free to do more of what it pleases with less interference from people and bodies that we would otherwise find difficult to counter. And in answer to your last point; a whole generation had to wait before it was given the opportunity to question EU membership. I see no reason why the same should not apply going forward. Also, the EU has form on getting countries to vote again when the first vote doesn't go their way - Ireland, France, The Netherlands I believe all had to have another go in order to get the correct result. I don't see why the UK shouldn't buck that trend. Right, and having escaped the clutches of the evil EU and having reclaimed our wonderful democracy, you believe we should now deny anyone else the right to vote on the issue for a generation.
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Behind Enemy Lines Sussex 08 Feb 23 6.18pm | |
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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
Right, and having escaped the clutches of the evil EU and having reclaimed our wonderful democracy, you believe we should now deny anyone else the right to vote on the issue for a generation. Basically yes. Parliament needs to be given the chance to make Brexit work; it is not an overnight thing that can decided as quickly as people would probably like but it has 4 decades of ‘stuff’ to sort out.
hats off to palace, they were always gonna be louder, and hate to say it but they were impressive ALL bouncing and singing. |
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EverybodyDannsNow SE19 08 Feb 23 6.21pm | |
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Originally posted by Behind Enemy Lines
Basically yes. Parliament needs to be given the chance to make Brexit work; it is not an overnight thing that can decided as quickly as people would probably like but it has 4 decades of ‘stuff’ to sort out. Thank god we have our democracy back!
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