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The Election Thread
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 Stirlingsays  11 Dec 19 10.06am |
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Originally posted by DanH
I think you're probably about right. Absolutely astounded that Boris has managed to fight an entire election campaign avoiding scrutiny and shouting the same 3 word empty statement over and over again and the public just don't seem to care. It doesn't seem like Labour and Lib Dems have managed to swallow enough pride to stand down in seats that had a reasonable chance of keeping the Tory out so bit of a shambles all round really. I would Kevin Keegan love it though if we had a hung parliament and the whole thing has backfired on BJ and his awful cronies. Yeah, we haven't been hearing, 'for the many not the few' for years now. All election campaign messages are designed by feedback from focus groups and teams then create the message....all based on that feedback data......it's not as though Boris or Corbyn woke up and thought....you know what, I'm just going to repeat the same message. Edited by Stirlingsays (11 Dec 2019 10.28am)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Matov 11 Dec 19 10.15am |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Yeah, we haven't been hearing, 'for the many not the few' for years now. All election campaign messages are designed by feedback from focus groups and teams the create the message....all based on that feedback data......it's not as though Boris or Corbyn woke up and thought....you know what, I'm just going to repeat the same message. Edited by Stirlingsays (11 Dec 2019 10.08am) This election is about Brexit. Nothing else can happen before the matter is settled. I would argue that nothing can happen until we have left but accept that perhaps other might not see it that way. Get Brexit done makes perfect sense. As does Revoke A50. But ' A second referendum with a Leave option that does not actually mean Leave along with a franchise that will now include EU citizens and school kids' just does not scan as well.
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell. |
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| Rudi Hedman Caterham 11 Dec 19 10.20am |
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Originally posted by DanH
I think you're probably about right. Absolutely astounded that Boris has managed to fight an entire election campaign avoiding scrutiny and shouting the same 3 word empty statement over and over again and the public just don't seem to care. It doesn't seem like Labour and Lib Dems have managed to swallow enough pride to stand down in seats that had a reasonable chance of keeping the Tory out so bit of a shambles all round really. I would Kevin Keegan love it though if we had a hung parliament and the whole thing has backfired on BJ and his awful cronies. Power is their priority.
COYP |
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| DanH SW2 11 Dec 19 10.20am |
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Originally posted by Matov
This election is about Brexit. Nothing else can happen before the matter is settled. I would argue that nothing can happen until we have left but accept that perhaps other might not see it that way. Get Brexit done makes perfect sense. As does Revoke A50. But ' A second referendum with a Leave option that does not actually mean Leave along with a franchise that will now include EU citizens and school kids' just does not scan as well. But it doesn't 'Get It Done' though does it? It's just the beginning of new negotiations. It doesn't go away for a decade at least. I see this morning that BJ was so proud of his policies that he decided to hide in a fridge rather than be interviewed. If I was proud of my policies I would simply not hide in a fridge.
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| Rudi Hedman Caterham 11 Dec 19 10.30am |
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Originally posted by DanH
But it doesn't 'Get It Done' though does it? It's just the beginning of new negotiations. It doesn't go away for a decade at least. I see this morning that BJ was so proud of his policies that he decided to hide in a fridge rather than be interviewed. If I was proud of my policies I would simply not hide in a fridge. Nothing gets started with your politicians, but that’s what you want. We will have none of these obstructions. We’ll move onto negotiations and the future, not stuck in hotel California.
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 Hrolf The Ganger 11 Dec 19 10.44am |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
Good factual post I was really comparing the logic it is immigrants driving the pressure on the NHS, all over this site, with the reality of hospital admissions. When I worked at United Health it was no secret the aim was to totally take over a big slug of the NHS. I was aware of many high level meetings on the topic Do you not realise how daft that statement is? More people equals more admissions. Is that too difficult to grasp? How often do you need to be told this?
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| Mapletree Croydon 11 Dec 19 10.58am |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
This from a guy who described me as obnoxious. From what I remember you described Al Jazeera in favourable terms. The public services have become politicised and the NHS is a bulwark of the left.....just like you. You decided to criticise others about immigration when I wasn't aware we were even talking about it. The biggest problem of many in the NHS is it's usage by the elderly who have nowhere else to go. In some instances families burdening the state with a problem which traditionally was theirs. In part another problem encouraged by social liberalism's obsession with selfish individualism.
I do not recall ever telling you that you are obnoxious. I have rather a soft spot for you. Which is weird because I disagree with most of your views
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| chris123 hove actually 11 Dec 19 11.20am |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
I do not recall ever telling you that you are obnoxious. I have rather a soft spot for you. Which is weird because I disagree with most of your views Isn't that more interesting?
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| serial thriller The Promised Land 11 Dec 19 11.32am |
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Originally posted by Badger11
Okay it's prediction time which party do you think will win the biggest number of seats? A bit of analysis would also be appreciated. In the past I had a bit of a reputation for calling the correct election results since 1994. However this came to a shuddering halt in 2017 when I completely failed to take into account the Corbyn factor. So suitably chastened I cautiously suggest a Tory win with a majority of 40 plus seats. As to the why I think Brexit will be a key factor that plus some of Labour's crazy spending plans will frightened the uncommitted. So over to you I am particularity interested if you genuinely believe Labour will be the biggest party as at no stage has Corbyn been ahead so that's a pretty big leap of faith.
1. The polls are weighting things based on 2015. This is open to fault: there have been demographic shifts since then which mean there are less right/Brexit supporters. Similarly, there's a bigger number of young left voters. Most estimates suggest at least 4 million new registered voters, most of whom will vote anti-tory. Again, this isn't taken into account by the polls. 2. While Farage's gift to Boris raises his numbers, it does so in seats which are already tory, and is unlikely to translate in to new seats. In fact, the seats BP are standing in will have a split that will favour Labour. 3. According to yougov, we are already in the margin of error. In the next two days, the strength of Labour's ground campaign in marginal seats will make a difference, just as it did in 2017. I yhink, also, in marginal lib/tory seats you will see tactical voting work in the liberal's favour. 4. Am I optimistic? Despite my previous wind up post, I remain cautiously so. But it's interesting to see that many in the stock markets are now hedging money against the pound in anticipation, presumably, of a hung parliament. They usually have inside info. This Twitter account is worth a read. Not my political persuasion, but well evidenced analysis of polls and likely results... [Tweet Link]
Edited by serial thriller (11 Dec 2019 11.33am)
If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4 |
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| Midlands Eagle 11 Dec 19 11.44am |
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Originally posted by serial thriller
According to yougov, we are already in the margin of error. In the next two days, the strength of Labour's ground campaign in marginal seats will make a difference, just as it did in 2017. In 2017 Corbyn was a bit of an unknown quantity and Labour benefitted from that. Now we have had more time to get to know him and far too many traditional Labour supporters just don't like him and could cast their votes elsewhere in the hope of getting rid of him. Although the Corbyn hard left appeals to the London Labour supporters the Midlands and Northern heartlands that are traditional Labour voters but also voted for Brexit may be in two minds and are again likely to cast their votes elsewhere. People aren't stupid and are well aware that Corbyn has promised so much money to so many different groups that funding it all will be a big problem and although he is claiming that it will all be funded by increases in tax by the top 3% of earners plus Corporation Tax we know that ultimately ALL taxpayers will be hit hard in their pockets and no-one will vote for a party that will leave them financially worse off. Anyway, all will be revealed in a couple of days now
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| Matov 11 Dec 19 11.55am |
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Originally posted by DanH
But it doesn't 'Get It Done' though does it? It's just the beginning of new negotiations. It doesn't go away for a decade at least. We leave by the end of January. And fingers cross leave without a deal by the end of 2020. But there will be progress. One less star on that s***ty flag. Our MEP's back home. What do Labour offer us? Another referendum before the first has been implemented? With no real Leave option? Oh and EU citizens and kids voting in it. Yes, that solves everything. That will unify the country. It is a recipie for utter calamity. I get why many of you loathe Johnson. I really do. No love for him myself and I suspect that although I will cast my vote for the Tories tomorrow if we do leave the EU I suspect it will be the last time ever. But Corbyn as PM? Seriously? A man who gave succor to the IRA at the time it was trying to kill people on British streets? Who proclaims people like Hammas as friends? With that other w***er McDonnell by his side? And even bigger scumbag in my opinion and by far the more dangerous. Once Brexit is achieved then I am bowing out of all political discourse for a long long time. Cut ties with a lot of people who I have known for decades over it and suspect that those friendships will never be rekindled. Nobody will emerge from this unbloodied but so far it has been jaw-jaw. Painful yes but better than the alternatives. We don't leave and then I fear the worse because democracy will have been fatally undermined in this country. Our current political class, of all shades, are wretched. They really are. But we also all have to look in the mirror and ask what part we played in it as well. How vitriolic many of us have become, how dismissive of others point of views, how entrenched we have become. And for who? A political class that have shown zero true leadership or respect for the very basics of our democratic process?
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell. |
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| Willo South coast - west of Brighton. 11 Dec 19 11.57am |
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Originally posted by Midlands Eagle
In 2017 Corbyn was a bit of an unknown quantity and Labour benefitted from that. Now we have had more time to get to know him and far too many traditional Labour supporters just don't like him and could cast their votes elsewhere in the hope of getting rid of him. Although the Corbyn hard left appeals to the London Labour supporters the Midlands and Northern heartlands that are traditional Labour voters but also voted for Brexit may be in two minds and are again likely to cast their votes elsewhere. People aren't stupid and are well aware that Corbyn has promised so much money to so many different groups that funding it all will be a big problem and although he is claiming that it will all be funded by increases in tax by the top 3% of earners plus Corporation Tax we know that ultimately ALL taxpayers will be hit hard in their pockets and no-one will vote for a party that will leave them financially worse off. Anyway, all will be revealed in a couple of days now Economics of the madhouse and we know where it will all lead. It's that time of the year when young immature minds believe that a bearded, grey-haired gentlemen will bring them a lot of free gifts.Meanwhile everyone else will vote Conservative.
Edited by Willo (11 Dec 2019 12.25pm)
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