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Horrific Scenes In Paris

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bilbo Flag 14 Nov 15 4.51pm Send a Private Message to bilbo Add bilbo as a friend

Quote Willo at 14 Nov 2015 4.44pm

My wife and I were deeply saddened last night when we returned from a lovely night out with our daughter and her husband to discover the horrific news.My wife before going to bed just said "I'm thinking about those poor families".

Absolutely terrible and our thoughts and prayers go out to all the family and friends of those who lost their lives at the hands of barberic butchers.

A very dignified response by all accounts.

 

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gambler Flag Kent 14 Nov 15 4.52pm Send a Private Message to gambler Add gambler as a friend

Quote Cucking Funt at 14 Nov 2015 4.30pm

Jeez, so many c*nts.


All the usual ones.

 

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Tom-the-eagle Flag Croydon 14 Nov 15 4.52pm

Quote elgrande at 14 Nov 2015 4.47pm

It has now been revealed that the one cnut found dead near the stadium,with the Syrian passport belonged to someone who had entered the EU through Greece in early october.

Surprise f***ing surprise.


No f@cking surprise. Its going to get a lot f@ucking worse too. A lot, lot worse.


 


"It feels much better than it ever did, much more sensitive." John Wayne Bobbit

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 14 Nov 15 4.53pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.48pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.30pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.26pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.15pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.14pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 3.50pm


There will be groups and people from the Muslim community who in the coming hours and days will be on our T.V screens giving the Muslim response to these attacks. No doubt they will condemn these crimes, but ‘some’ will lay the blame squarely at the feet of Western foreign policy as being the cause of these crimes. Whatever the rights and wrong of Western foreign policy, there is simply no excuse for such violence; there certainly is no possible justification for such attacks in Islam. To speak only about foreign policy whilst diminishing the fact, or even excluding it entirely, that our faith is being hijacked is part of the problem and not the solution.

I'm extremely pleased people are expressing that sentiment.

It's just a shame that there are so many of your sort still blaming western foreign policy.


Expand on what you mean by 'your sort'

Well more specifically you, as I'd bet a grand you've alluded to the fact on here at some point.


Edited by johnfirewall (14 Nov 2015 4.26pm)


Are you saying western foreign policies haven't in any way affected the rise of the so called Islamic state?

Previously those remarks would have been made in response to attacks from preceding groups such as Al Queda who the west sought to take action against.

Are you saying that sort of mentality made from the perspective of western liberals with little consideration for peace is appropriate or helpful when moderate Muslims are dismissing such notions to focus on the fact that they themselves condemn the acts and dismiss such justifications?

Edited by johnfirewall (14 Nov 2015 4.49pm)


To my mind, ISIS are filling a vacuum left by interventions in Syria, Iraq and Libya for instance.

Whilst the intention of military interventions may have been to rid these countries of despots, it has backfired badly.

Obviously the rise of ISIS was not foreseen, however, it is still the result of Western actions

Edited by nickgusset (14 Nov 2015 4.55pm)

 

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Tom-the-eagle Flag Croydon 14 Nov 15 4.56pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.53pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.48pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.30pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.26pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.15pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.14pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 3.50pm


There will be groups and people from the Muslim community who in the coming hours and days will be on our T.V screens giving the Muslim response to these attacks. No doubt they will condemn these crimes, but ‘some’ will lay the blame squarely at the feet of Western foreign policy as being the cause of these crimes. Whatever the rights and wrong of Western foreign policy, there is simply no excuse for such violence; there certainly is no possible justification for such attacks in Islam. To speak only about foreign policy whilst diminishing the fact, or even excluding it entirely, that our faith is being hijacked is part of the problem and not the solution.

I'm extremely pleased people are expressing that sentiment.

It's just a shame that there are so many of your sort still blaming western foreign policy.


Expand on what you mean by 'your sort'

Well more specifically you, as I'd bet a grand you've alluded to the fact on here at some point.


Edited by johnfirewall (14 Nov 2015 4.26pm)


Are you saying western foreign policies haven't in any way affected the rise of the so called Islamic state?

Previously those remarks would have been made in response to attacks from preceding groups such as Al Queda who the west sought to take action against.

Are you saying that sort of mentality made from the perspective of western liberals with little consideration for peace is appropriate or helpful when moderate Muslims are dismissing such notions to focus on the fact that they themselves condemn the acts and dismiss such justifications?

Edited by johnfirewall (14 Nov 2015 4.49pm)


To my mind, ISIS are filling a vacuum left by interventions in Syria, Iraq and Libya for instance.

Whilst the intentions of military interventions may have been to rid these countries of despots, it has backfired badly.


Nothing to do with them being a bunch of murdering b@astards then?

 


"It feels much better than it ever did, much more sensitive." John Wayne Bobbit

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Cucking Funt Flag Clapham on the Back 14 Nov 15 4.56pm Send a Private Message to Cucking Funt Add Cucking Funt as a friend

Quote gambler at 14 Nov 2015 4.52pm

Quote Cucking Funt at 14 Nov 2015 4.30pm

Jeez, so many c*nts.


All the usual ones.


Quite.

 


Wife beating may be socially acceptable in Sheffield, but it is a different matter in Cheltenham

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 14 Nov 15 5.01pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.53pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.48pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.30pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.26pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.15pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.14pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 3.50pm


There will be groups and people from the Muslim community who in the coming hours and days will be on our T.V screens giving the Muslim response to these attacks. No doubt they will condemn these crimes, but ‘some’ will lay the blame squarely at the feet of Western foreign policy as being the cause of these crimes. Whatever the rights and wrong of Western foreign policy, there is simply no excuse for such violence; there certainly is no possible justification for such attacks in Islam. To speak only about foreign policy whilst diminishing the fact, or even excluding it entirely, that our faith is being hijacked is part of the problem and not the solution.

I'm extremely pleased people are expressing that sentiment.

It's just a shame that there are so many of your sort still blaming western foreign policy.


Expand on what you mean by 'your sort'

Well more specifically you, as I'd bet a grand you've alluded to the fact on here at some point.


Edited by johnfirewall (14 Nov 2015 4.26pm)


Are you saying western foreign policies haven't in any way affected the rise of the so called Islamic state?

Previously those remarks would have been made in response to attacks from preceding groups such as Al Queda who the west sought to take action against.

Are you saying that sort of mentality made from the perspective of western liberals with little consideration for peace is appropriate or helpful when moderate Muslims are dismissing such notions to focus on the fact that they themselves condemn the acts and dismiss such justifications?

Edited by johnfirewall (14 Nov 2015 4.49pm)


To my mind, ISIS are filling a vacuum left by interventions in Syria, Iraq and Libya for instance.

Whilst the intention of military interventions may have been to rid these countries of despots, it has backfired badly.

Obviously the rise of ISIS was not foreseen, however, it is still the result of Western actions

Edited by nickgusset (14 Nov 2015 4.55pm)

You seem to be suffering from something akin to Stockholm syndrome.
Over 200 people have just been killed or seriously injured and you want to bang on about our foreign policy suggesting that somehow these scum can claim some moral high ground.

Strange fellow.


Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (14 Nov 2015 5.03pm)

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (14 Nov 2015 5.04pm)

 

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-TUX- Flag Alphabettispaghetti 14 Nov 15 5.14pm Send a Private Message to -TUX- Add -TUX- as a friend

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.53pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.48pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.30pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.26pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.15pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.14pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 3.50pm


There will be groups and people from the Muslim community who in the coming hours and days will be on our T.V screens giving the Muslim response to these attacks. No doubt they will condemn these crimes, but ‘some’ will lay the blame squarely at the feet of Western foreign policy as being the cause of these crimes. Whatever the rights and wrong of Western foreign policy, there is simply no excuse for such violence; there certainly is no possible justification for such attacks in Islam. To speak only about foreign policy whilst diminishing the fact, or even excluding it entirely, that our faith is being hijacked is part of the problem and not the solution.

I'm extremely pleased people are expressing that sentiment.

It's just a shame that there are so many of your sort still blaming western foreign policy.


Expand on what you mean by 'your sort'

Well more specifically you, as I'd bet a grand you've alluded to the fact on here at some point.


Edited by johnfirewall (14 Nov 2015 4.26pm)


Are you saying western foreign policies haven't in any way affected the rise of the so called Islamic state?

Previously those remarks would have been made in response to attacks from preceding groups such as Al Queda who the west sought to take action against.

Are you saying that sort of mentality made from the perspective of western liberals with little consideration for peace is appropriate or helpful when moderate Muslims are dismissing such notions to focus on the fact that they themselves condemn the acts and dismiss such justifications?

Edited by johnfirewall (14 Nov 2015 4.49pm)


To my mind, ISIS are filling a vacuum left by interventions in Syria, Iraq and Libya for instance.

Whilst the intention of military interventions may have been to rid these countries of despots, it has backfired badly.

Obviously the rise of ISIS was not foreseen, however, it is still the result of Western actions

Edited by nickgusset (14 Nov 2015 4.55pm)


Firstly, personally i don't believe anything's ''backfired''.
Secondly, the ''unforeseen rise'' is quite the opposite.
Once again my thoughts are always with the innocent that have departed, their families and friends caught up in this f'kn manufactured 'war'.


 


Time to move forward together.

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 14 Nov 15 5.16pm

Quote Hrolf The Ganger at 14 Nov 2015 5.01pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.53pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.48pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.30pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.26pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 4.15pm

Quote johnfirewall at 14 Nov 2015 4.14pm

Quote nickgusset at 14 Nov 2015 3.50pm


There will be groups and people from the Muslim community who in the coming hours and days will be on our T.V screens giving the Muslim response to these attacks. No doubt they will condemn these crimes, but ‘some’ will lay the blame squarely at the feet of Western foreign policy as being the cause of these crimes. Whatever the rights and wrong of Western foreign policy, there is simply no excuse for such violence; there certainly is no possible justification for such attacks in Islam. To speak only about foreign policy whilst diminishing the fact, or even excluding it entirely, that our faith is being hijacked is part of the problem and not the solution.

I'm extremely pleased people are expressing that sentiment.

It's just a shame that there are so many of your sort still blaming western foreign policy.


Expand on what you mean by 'your sort'

Well more specifically you, as I'd bet a grand you've alluded to the fact on here at some point.


Edited by johnfirewall (14 Nov 2015 4.26pm)


Are you saying western foreign policies haven't in any way affected the rise of the so called Islamic state?

Previously those remarks would have been made in response to attacks from preceding groups such as Al Queda who the west sought to take action against.

Are you saying that sort of mentality made from the perspective of western liberals with little consideration for peace is appropriate or helpful when moderate Muslims are dismissing such notions to focus on the fact that they themselves condemn the acts and dismiss such justifications?

Edited by johnfirewall (14 Nov 2015 4.49pm)


To my mind, ISIS are filling a vacuum left by interventions in Syria, Iraq and Libya for instance.

Whilst the intention of military interventions may have been to rid these countries of despots, it has backfired badly.

Obviously the rise of ISIS was not foreseen, however, it is still the result of Western actions

Edited by nickgusset (14 Nov 2015 4.55pm)

You seem to be suffering from something akin to Stockholm syndrome.
Over 200 people have just been killed or seriously injured and you want to bang on about our foreign policy suggesting that somehow these scum can claim some moral high ground.

Strange fellow.


Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (14 Nov 2015 5.03pm)

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (14 Nov 2015 5.04pm)

Absolutely not. What happened is abhorrent. I'm also not saying they should have any moral high ground.
What I am saying is western actions have in part resulted in the rise of ISIS.

Also if you read the thread, the issue of Western intervention was brought up by someone else. I'm responding to that.

Edited by nickgusset (14 Nov 2015 5.18pm)

 

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lancseagle Flag burnley 14 Nov 15 5.24pm Send a Private Message to lancseagle Add lancseagle as a friend

I'd never heard of ISIS pre saddam, gaddafi never been a truer saying of the better the devil you know.

 

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 14 Nov 15 5.38pm

An excellent post on Facebook earlier...


Call me selfish, but I don't want to get killed in a terrorist attack at a gig. So perhaps we could try something different from the War on Terror spiral? After all, it's not going so well. In 2001, when 9/11 happened, the jihadis were a small group of Saudi expats in the mountains of Afghanistan. Now jihadi groups control more than half of Syria, a third of Iraq, and large swathes of Libya. They're fighting in Yemen, in Afghanistan (still), in pakistan, in Somalia and in Nigeria. They've attacked in Paris (twice), Sousse, Sharm el-Sheikh, Beirut and other places just this year. If the West has been trying to stop jihadis since 9/11, it hasn't worked.

But it's much worse than that. The aim of jihadis is to shock Muslims in order to—as they see it—wake them up and get them to join their struggle. Bin Laden was explicit about it. One tactic to do that is to provoke an over-reaction from the West—and the West has been willing to oblige. Invading and occupying Iraq is the most obvious example, which led directly to the formation of the Islamic State of Iraq in 2007. But terrorist attacks also provoke increased government surveillance on all of us, the targeting of Muslim communities and social division. The jihadis' great allies are the politicians and journalists who shut down any attempt to understand this. The airwaves are full today of facile people saying that what happened in Paris is an attack on Western freedom and culture, so there's no point in thinking any more deeply about it. But on Thursday ISIS killed 43 people in Beirut with two suicide bombs—because they hate Arab culture?

I expect we'll carry on acting out the cycle that has worked so successfully for the jihadis since 2001. But personally, out of a sense of self-interest, I'd prefer it if we tried something different. Like: tackling the problem of Saudi Arabia, where the jihadi ideology comes from, and which prefers ISIS and the other jihadi groups to succeed if it means Shia Muslims can't live. Like: withdrawing support from Turkey while its intelligence agencies help the Nusra Front and turn a blind eye to ISIS, all because it hates the Kurds more than the jihadis and bombs them with NATO's blessing. Like: trying to refrain from destroying countries like Iraq and Libya, both now overrun by jihadis. Like: actually attempting to end the war in Syria, which is complicated and difficult, but Britain could help by at least not blocking negotiations as it did in the Geneva I and II peace conferences in 2012 and 2014, where British, French and American policy was to ensure the war continued by insisting that Assad stand down as a precondition to talks (why would he, when he hadn't lost the war?) and excluding Iran. Like: helping refugees who are fleeing from horror, mostly because we should obviously help people in need but also because it's not wise to have millions of people languishing in squalid camps building up resentment. The British, French and American governments thought for a few years that it was in their strategic interests for the Syrian war to go on, weakening Syria's ally Iran and knocking out an enemy of Israel. But it wasn't in the interests of us, the people, and certainly not of the thousands of Syrians who have died as a result.

I know people's first impulse when a terrorist attack happens is to want to hit back in a direct way, to punish the people who did it and deter others. But that impulse has been tested to destruction since 2001. Jihadis bank on it, it's a central part of their strategy. I don't know why we always go along with it. It'd be better to do things that might work instead.

 

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JL85 Flag London,SE9 14 Nov 15 5.46pm Send a Private Message to JL85 Add JL85 as a friend

Quote lancseagle at 14 Nov 2015 5.24pm

I'd never heard of ISIS pre saddam, gaddafi never been a truer saying of the better the devil you know.


You'd heard of Bin Laden and Al-Qeada, though, i take it?

Same mob, different flag.

 

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