Calais migrant trouble

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Calais migrant trouble

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Stirlingsays 27 Jul 15 1.55pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 27 Jul 2015 1.08pm One of the problems of a lot of history is that it presents the easily 'digestible information' of the past, everyone remembers Emily Pankhurst, but forgets that it was her husband Richard who established the Suffrage movement for women's rights. An issue that many feminists like to conveniently forget, and consequently a very important man is airbrushed out of history It's a form of victim culture. There is a disadvantage to being born into certain families.....It's the luck of the draw....Socially, culturally. By far the biggest determining factor is the wealth of the family you're born into. I rage against the ceilings placed upon social mobility and they are there for all the working class....But strive and strive and you can break through....If you get reasonable breaks...The only thing to moan about is that it's just not an equal playing field.....And the bias is in the protection...nay insulation of wealth for those who already have it. The richest man in Britain is Asian....I don't think skin colour holds people back as much as personal attitudes to work and effort. We have black millionaires in this country....Just not enough of them. Ghetto culture has some responsibility I feel. Edited by Stirlingsays (27 Jul 2015 1.57pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

27 Jul 15 1.55pm

Quote jamiemartin721 at 27 Jul 2015 1.08pm

One of the problems of a lot of history is that it presents the easily 'digestible information' of the past, everyone remembers Emily Pankhurst, but forgets that it was her husband Richard who established the Suffrage movement for women's rights. An issue that many feminists like to conveniently forget, and consequently a very important man is airbrushed out of history

It's a form of victim culture.

There is a disadvantage to being born into certain families.....It's the luck of the draw....Socially, culturally.

By far the biggest determining factor is the wealth of the family you're born into.

I rage against the ceilings placed upon social mobility and they are there for all the working class....But strive and strive and you can break through....If you get reasonable breaks...The only thing to moan about is that it's just not an equal playing field.....And the bias is in the protection...nay insulation of wealth for those who already have it.

The richest man in Britain is Asian....I don't think skin colour holds people back as much as personal attitudes to work and effort. We have black millionaires in this country....Just not enough of them. Ghetto culture has some responsibility I feel.

Edited by Stirlingsays (27 Jul 2015 1.57pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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npn Crowborough 27 Jul 15 2.03pm
Quote corkery at 27 Jul 2015 1.54pm Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 1.25pm Simple solution: EU wide asylum policy. Regardless of where you enter the EU, you go into a pot and are allocated to whichever country is next in line (so if you apply in England or in Germany, your application is processed in the same way and if successful you are allocated to individual countries of the EU based on rules). Nope, ye caused the problem, ye can take them. It's not fair on other countries. I trust Ireland remembers that stance when they're receiving their EU grants from the likes of the 3rd largest net contributors to their budget?
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npn

Crowborough 27 Jul 15 2.03pm

Quote corkery at 27 Jul 2015 1.54pm

Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 1.25pm

Simple solution: EU wide asylum policy.

Regardless of where you enter the EU, you go into a pot and are allocated to whichever country is next in line (so if you apply in England or in Germany, your application is processed in the same way and if successful you are allocated to individual countries of the EU based on rules).

Nope, ye caused the problem, ye can take them. It's not fair on other countries.

I trust Ireland remembers that stance when they're receiving their EU grants from the likes of the 3rd largest net contributors to their budget?

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Stirlingsays 27 Jul 15 2.05pm
Quote legaleagle at 27 Jul 2015 1.44pm (Leaving aside whether a "full and final settlement" was or wasn't agreed post-war),should the German government be responsible for reparations to the families of those massacred in Greece 1941-45, or for paying back (with interest) the money the Greeks were forced to loan to Germany? Is it ok to say,it was their parents/grand parents not them and anyway,I wasn't personally involved? Modern day Germans owe no money to Greece.....They didn't trash Greece a certain percentage of their ancestors did.....Maybe some illogical guilt association for them...But when does it stop? However, the original settlement was a massive injustice to Greece and other countries. America and the allies gave Germany another chance to grow into a successful economy.....Massive and I say massive debt reparations were written off. I believe in the spirit of that German banks should forgo debts to Greece. They gave out the money like crack dealers.....They hold responsibility for the inability to pay. Edited by Stirlingsays (27 Jul 2015 2.11pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

27 Jul 15 2.05pm

Quote legaleagle at 27 Jul 2015 1.44pm

(Leaving aside whether a "full and final settlement" was or wasn't agreed post-war),should the German government be responsible for reparations to the families of those massacred in Greece 1941-45, or for paying back (with interest) the money the Greeks were forced to loan to Germany?

Is it ok to say,it was their parents/grand parents not them and anyway,I wasn't personally involved?

Modern day Germans owe no money to Greece.....They didn't trash Greece a certain percentage of their ancestors did.....Maybe some illogical guilt association for them...But when does it stop?

However, the original settlement was a massive injustice to Greece and other countries.

America and the allies gave Germany another chance to grow into a successful economy.....Massive and I say massive debt reparations were written off.

I believe in the spirit of that German banks should forgo debts to Greece.

They gave out the money like crack dealers.....They hold responsibility for the inability to pay.

Edited by Stirlingsays (27 Jul 2015 2.11pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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serial thriller The Promised Land 27 Jul 15 2.13pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 27 Jul 2015 11.10am Quote serial thriller at 26 Jul 2015 12.22pm 3. Our public infrastructure is creaking under the burden of an ageing population and the government's outsourcing programme. Migrants, as they did after the war, and in the 60s, and in the 90s, would bring a young demographic workforce who would restrengthen public infrastructure. Only 3% of land in this country is built on, so the idea that we're full is a load of bollocks. What you've written is bollocks! The only reason our population aged is because too many immigrants arrived stealing jobs from the indigenous population and lowered wages so that people felt they couldn't afford to start a family. The only growth area of the population is in the muslim sector where they are breeding like rabbits - which is their strategy for domination. 3% of the land is a very low percentage if you include the whole of the UK. By doing that you're including land not habitable eg mountainous regions, flood plains, agricultural areas, dangerous coastal areas, woodland, swamps, areas of outstanding natural beauty... all of which of which cannot or should not be built upon! We have reached saturation point. The infrastructure cannot cope with any more arriving. Do you want us to become like Dhaka in Bangladesh... where millions fight for space to live in tin shacks and toilet facilities are shared by thousands and raw sewage gathers in pontoons? I wish you would think through your suggestions before putting them in print. Incredible. If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4
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serial thriller

The Promised Land 27 Jul 15 2.13pm

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Quote Hoof Hearted at 27 Jul 2015 11.10am

Quote serial thriller at 26 Jul 2015 12.22pm

3. Our public infrastructure is creaking under the burden of an ageing population and the government's outsourcing programme. Migrants, as they did after the war, and in the 60s, and in the 90s, would bring a young demographic workforce who would restrengthen public infrastructure. Only 3% of land in this country is built on, so the idea that we're full is a load of bollocks.

What you've written is bollocks!

The only reason our population aged is because too many immigrants arrived stealing jobs from the indigenous population and lowered wages so that people felt they couldn't afford to start a family. The only growth area of the population is in the muslim sector where they are breeding like rabbits - which is their strategy for domination.

3% of the land is a very low percentage if you include the whole of the UK. By doing that you're including land not habitable eg mountainous regions, flood plains, agricultural areas, dangerous coastal areas, woodland, swamps, areas of outstanding natural beauty... all of which of which cannot or should not be built upon!

We have reached saturation point. The infrastructure cannot cope with any more arriving.

Do you want us to become like Dhaka in Bangladesh... where millions fight for space to live in tin shacks and toilet facilities are shared by thousands and raw sewage gathers in pontoons?

I wish you would think through your suggestions before putting them in print.

Incredible.

If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4

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johnfirewall 27 Jul 15 2.18pm
Can I get some figures which would indicate we're not doing our bit? Of course having annual migration equating to an extra half percent of the population is minute compared to the several hundred percent of Lampedusa, but reverting to the crude reference of the country being 'full' France should be keeping them. Let's look at why people wish to come here. Some say it's the mark of a civilised society but I doubt even the left are going with that one anymore, and no one is going to be the envy of their neighbours by housing a migrant, not even in Brighton.
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johnfirewall

27 Jul 15 2.18pm

Can I get some figures which would indicate we're not doing our bit?

Of course having annual migration equating to an extra half percent of the population is minute compared to the several hundred percent of Lampedusa, but reverting to the crude reference of the country being 'full' France should be keeping them.

Let's look at why people wish to come here. Some say it's the mark of a civilised society but I doubt even the left are going with that one anymore, and no one is going to be the envy of their neighbours by housing a migrant, not even in Brighton.

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Stirlingsays 27 Jul 15 2.26pm
Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 1.51pm Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 1.44pm I'm literally foaming at the mouth.....If I look in the mirror I've no doubt that my eyes would be swiveling. In polite response to this.....No thanks. But why? Another debate, I know, but if not for this sort of thing, what is the EU for? Why? Control of our own immigration is why. We should take a set number of valid asylum cases that relates to our capacity to provide for them. I'm not in for the race to increase the disadvantage for our own poor to provide for other country's poor.....Beyond a set amount we can cope with. Are you aware of the size of waiting lists for social housing in this country? The poor here are being constantly f*cked as it is. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

27 Jul 15 2.26pm

Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 1.51pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 1.44pm

I'm literally foaming at the mouth.....If I look in the mirror I've no doubt that my eyes would be swiveling.

In polite response to this.....No thanks.

But why?

Another debate, I know, but if not for this sort of thing, what is the EU for?

Why?

Control of our own immigration is why.

We should take a set number of valid asylum cases that relates to our capacity to provide for them.

I'm not in for the race to increase the disadvantage for our own poor to provide for other country's poor.....Beyond a set amount we can cope with.

Are you aware of the size of waiting lists for social housing in this country?

The poor here are being constantly f*cked as it is.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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npn Crowborough 27 Jul 15 2.28pm
Quote johnfirewall at 27 Jul 2015 2.18pm Can I get some figures which would indicate we're not doing our bit? Of course having annual migration equating to an extra half percent of the population is minute compared to the several hundred percent of Lampedusa, but reverting to the crude reference of the country being 'full' France should be keeping them. Let's look at why people wish to come here. Some say it's the mark of a civilised society but I doubt even the left are going with that one anymore, and no one is going to be the envy of their neighbours by housing a migrant, not even in Brighton. Only from Wiki, and before the current influx started in earnest, but: Country Total Per 100 000 inhabitants Germany 22,165 27 Sweden 15,290 161 UK 14,570 23 France 14,325 22 Italy 9,270 15 Norway 6,125 123 Austria 6,000 71 Nether. 5,920 35 Belgium 5,880 53 Switz. 4,580 58 Denmark 2,105 38 Finland 1,840 34 Malta 625 348 Greece 625 1 Spain 565 1 Up to date figures would be good, but 30% less than Germany. Of course there are others doing far less. The point is, the burden should be evenly shared across all member states, as unpalatable as that may be. If the others are also forced to take their share, who knows, maybe net immigration would actually go down?
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npn

Crowborough 27 Jul 15 2.28pm

Quote johnfirewall at 27 Jul 2015 2.18pm

Can I get some figures which would indicate we're not doing our bit?

Only from Wiki, and before the current influx started in earnest, but:

Country Total Per 100 000 inhabitants
Germany 22,165 27
Sweden 15,290 161
UK 14,570 23
France 14,325 22
Italy 9,270 15
Norway 6,125 123
Austria 6,000 71
Nether. 5,920 35
Belgium 5,880 53
Switz. 4,580 58
Denmark 2,105 38
Finland 1,840 34
Malta 625 348
Greece 625 1
Spain 565 1

Up to date figures would be good, but 30% less than Germany. Of course there are others doing far less.

The point is, the burden should be evenly shared across all member states, as unpalatable as that may be. If the others are also forced to take their share, who knows, maybe net immigration would actually go down?

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npn Crowborough 27 Jul 15 2.31pm
Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 2.26pm Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 1.51pm Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 1.44pm I'm literally foaming at the mouth.....If I look in the mirror I've no doubt that my eyes would be swiveling. In polite response to this.....No thanks. But why? Another debate, I know, but if not for this sort of thing, what is the EU for? Why? Control of our own immigration is why. We should take a set number of valid asylum cases that relates to our capacity to provide for them. I'm not in for the race to increase the disadvantage for our own poor to provide for other country's poor.....Beyond a set amount we can cope with. Are you aware of the size of waiting lists for social housing in this country? The poor here are being constantly f*cked as it is. Isn't that precisely what I'm suggesting? A set number or percentage, meaning no more do we have people camping out in Calais to get over here (because it will make no difference where they apply in relation to where they end up)
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npn

Crowborough 27 Jul 15 2.31pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 2.26pm

Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 1.51pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 1.44pm

I'm literally foaming at the mouth.....If I look in the mirror I've no doubt that my eyes would be swiveling.

In polite response to this.....No thanks.

But why?

Another debate, I know, but if not for this sort of thing, what is the EU for?

Why?

Control of our own immigration is why.

We should take a set number of valid asylum cases that relates to our capacity to provide for them.

I'm not in for the race to increase the disadvantage for our own poor to provide for other country's poor.....Beyond a set amount we can cope with.

Are you aware of the size of waiting lists for social housing in this country?

The poor here are being constantly f*cked as it is.

Isn't that precisely what I'm suggesting? A set number or percentage, meaning no more do we have people camping out in Calais to get over here (because it will make no difference where they apply in relation to where they end up)

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johnfirewall 27 Jul 15 2.33pm
Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 2.26pm Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 1.51pm Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 1.44pm I'm literally foaming at the mouth.....If I look in the mirror I've no doubt that my eyes would be swiveling. In polite response to this.....No thanks. But why? Another debate, I know, but if not for this sort of thing, what is the EU for? Why? Control of our own immigration is why. We should take a set number of valid asylum cases that relates to our capacity to provide for them. I'm not in for the race to increase the disadvantage for our own poor to provide for other country's poor.....Beyond a set amount we can cope with. Are you aware of the size of waiting lists for social housing in this country? The poor here are being constantly f*cked as it is. You're not expecting to elicit any agreement on the vile nationalistic notion that we should look after 'our own' are you? We all know our poor are only the victims when the rich are the perpetrators.
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johnfirewall

27 Jul 15 2.33pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 2.26pm

Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 1.51pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 1.44pm

I'm literally foaming at the mouth.....If I look in the mirror I've no doubt that my eyes would be swiveling.

In polite response to this.....No thanks.

But why?

Another debate, I know, but if not for this sort of thing, what is the EU for?

Why?

Control of our own immigration is why.

We should take a set number of valid asylum cases that relates to our capacity to provide for them.

I'm not in for the race to increase the disadvantage for our own poor to provide for other country's poor.....Beyond a set amount we can cope with.

Are you aware of the size of waiting lists for social housing in this country?

The poor here are being constantly f*cked as it is.

You're not expecting to elicit any agreement on the vile nationalistic notion that we should look after 'our own' are you?

We all know our poor are only the victims when the rich are the perpetrators.

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 27 Jul 15 2.35pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 27 Jul 2015 11.35am What happens is that they kill and maim each other and end up under the control of evil dictators like Mugabe. Other than Mugabe, can you give any other current dictators of formor colonies?
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 27 Jul 15 2.35pm

Quote Hoof Hearted at 27 Jul 2015 11.35am

What happens is that they kill and maim each other and end up under the control of evil dictators like Mugabe.

Other than Mugabe, can you give any other current dictators of formor colonies?

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Stirlingsays 27 Jul 15 2.36pm
Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 2.28pm Up to date figures would be good, but 30% less than Germany. Of course there are others doing far less. It isn't that different. Germany has a population size that's just over twenty percent larger than us. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

27 Jul 15 2.36pm

Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 2.28pm

Up to date figures would be good, but 30% less than Germany. Of course there are others doing far less.

It isn't that different. Germany has a population size that's just over twenty percent larger than us.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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jamiemartin721 Reading 27 Jul 15 2.39pm
Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 2.31pm Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 2.26pm Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 1.51pm Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 1.44pm I'm literally foaming at the mouth.....If I look in the mirror I've no doubt that my eyes would be swiveling. In polite response to this.....No thanks. But why? Another debate, I know, but if not for this sort of thing, what is the EU for? Why? Control of our own immigration is why. We should take a set number of valid asylum cases that relates to our capacity to provide for them. I'm not in for the race to increase the disadvantage for our own poor to provide for other country's poor.....Beyond a set amount we can cope with. Are you aware of the size of waiting lists for social housing in this country? The poor here are being constantly f*cked as it is. Isn't that precisely what I'm suggesting? A set number or percentage, meaning no more do we have people camping out in Calais to get over here (because it will make no difference where they apply in relation to where they end up) I think its very important to distinguish between Asylum cases, and people who are intending to enter the UK illegally. A lot of the people trying to smuggle themselves into the UK via Calais are people who have been returned from the UK Ports or rejected Asylum in France, and gone on the run. Most of these people won't be getting into the UK and claiming asylum, they'll be going to work illegally. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
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jamiemartin721

Reading 27 Jul 15 2.39pm

Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 2.31pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 2.26pm

Quote npn at 27 Jul 2015 1.51pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 27 Jul 2015 1.44pm

I'm literally foaming at the mouth.....If I look in the mirror I've no doubt that my eyes would be swiveling.

In polite response to this.....No thanks.

But why?

Another debate, I know, but if not for this sort of thing, what is the EU for?

Why?

Control of our own immigration is why.

Are you aware of the size of waiting lists for social housing in this country?

The poor here are being constantly f*cked as it is.

I think its very important to distinguish between Asylum cases, and people who are intending to enter the UK illegally. A lot of the people trying to smuggle themselves into the UK via Calais are people who have been returned from the UK Ports or rejected Asylum in France, and gone on the run.

Most of these people won't be getting into the UK and claiming asylum, they'll be going to work illegally.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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