As I say, our own society is problematic. I don't think we're going down the Putin route though, or that it would be helpful.

Another thing I've wondered (and neither of these posts are directed at you Stirling) is if people admire Putin's strong man stance - would they admire that in our own?
What bothers me there is the obvious, if EU leaders or the British or US governments were led by a similar kind of Putinesque (a new word) leader, then they would have sent a few thousand tanks and jets at the drop of a hat too. Where would we be then?
You could argue that would have stopped Russia. Who knows I guess. The reality on the ground is looking like if there had been, for instance, a couple of RAF squadrons, a US carrier detachment and maybe 25,000 soldier's, mainly US marines (just to throw some kind of realistic force out there), they would have chewed up and spat the invading Russian army out by now. That's how it looks anyway. God knows what that convoy would have looked like with jets, Warthogs and Apaches, but it reminds me of the retreating Iraqis and that massacre, for want of a better word.

Red and Blue Army!

Then I stand corrected. No-one though, Putin included, seriously believes that Nato would ever mount a major offensive nuclear strike on Russia. It's neither in their mandate, nor their interests to do so. The reason for it not formally being stated must be to allow for a degree of uncertainty if events developed when uncertainty would be useful, and/or the opportunity to use low yield weapons to destroy the resources of enemies who attacked with conventional weapons, but who could not mount a nuclear response.

We can ignore what Russia says is their policy. Just as they ignore it whenever it suits them.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

targeting of civilians is indeed a war crime. Not that anything happened over Coventry or Dresden (to my limited knowledge).

What is currently happening in Ukraine is a deliberate change in Russian Policy, and one that needs intervention, rather than soundbites, videos and sanctions.
civilians are being targeted by Russian military forces, and NATO and the UN just sit on their hands and wait.

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Gordon Brown. The crime is in progress. We don't need a feckin trial after the event. We need the crime stopping

Edited by Forest Hillbilly (19 Mar 2022 3.55pm)

I disengage, I turn the page.

Intervention initially in the form of an enforced ceasefire before peace talks resume

I disengage, I turn the page.

There's nothing in that 2014 declaration that needs updating to me. Anyway it's not as though Nato have restricted themselves.

Yeah, you hold on to those concepts, it'll make everything easier to deal with.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Really!!! It says different here. It also says that they DON'T have a 'No use first' policy.

I have have to say that you are somewhat deluded in your support of putin.

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