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Parish is the problem

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TheBigToePunt Flag 05 Oct 23 12.04pm Send a Private Message to TheBigToePunt Add TheBigToePunt as a friend

Originally posted by SnapperKain


You know, if someone came to the club with a billion in the bank and said "Parish, get out and don't let the door hit you on the arse on the way" and that person had the club's best interests at heart, I'd be the first one there waving Parish off.

Thing is that I don't think Parish is the problem. The yanks aren't up for owning a club outright, they're purely in it for the money and the thought of being outright owners I've no doubt repulses them.

So that leaves Textor and the bottom line is that I just don't trust him. A really quick Google search doesn't shine him in the best light with his approach to multi-club ownership, the way he treats those at the club, and the way he runs the club. For example:

Lyon - Currently under sanctions from the French Football Federation and having to sell up their better players on the cheap due to the way the club's been run financially.
[Link]

[Link]

Botafogo - Textor receiving death threats and fan protests after selling off one of their best players to, incidentally, Lyon.
[Link]

Molenbeek - Sacks entire management team five days before the season starts and it emerges that he put pressure on the coaches to play certain players or he'd start breaking contracts.
[Link]

And this article from the FT.com, that explains that Textor's business model is to get young players and then sell them off for profit, thereby generating more money for the investors, not necessarily the club (if it's in the FT, then it's not aimed at the likes of us is it?).
[Link]

So do you feel happy with this person having a controlling interest in the team? I don't think it would be a leap of imagination to see him selling off Palace players to make money to keep Lyon afloat and then suddenly our fortunes are intertwined with teams in other leagues, in other countries, how they are doing on the pitch, and more importantly, financially.

If Parish has spotted this (and I'm not a canny businessman nor a millionaire and I can spot it) then this is probably why he's being a pain in the backside to Textor and not letting him have his own way. Can't see Textor working to keep Olise, Eze, Doucouré, or Guéhi in the last transfer window with his mindset, let alone offering Wilf a lucrative deal to stay.

So whilst you might think people are sucking Parish's c*** on here, perhaps it's better than the devil's tit...

This is a very interesting post SnapperKain, thanks.

On your very first point (and I appreciate you are not suggesting otherwise, but just for clarity) if someone with a billion in the bank did buy CPFC tomorrow our transfer budget would not change. FFP requires that CPFC only spend what CPFC earns, regardless of what personal money the owner may want to throw around.

Leaving aside the idea of 'doing a Newcastle' at Palace (i.e. spending big sums quickly on players in the hope of getting into the top four, thereby increasing revenue so the original spending becomes permissible), a billionaire owner (or just any new owner, or just our current owners acting differently) might change our transfer strategy, but not our transfer budget. I think that is where Textor, and the points you make about him, become most significant.

Some pine for the semi-high risk, high-turnover, speculative approach Brighton have taken, for instance. Perhaps Textor is one of them.

Personally, I don't think it's wise. Southampton did something very similar, they got into the Europa League (maybe twice?) whilst buying low and selling high. It didn't last, didn't get them to the next level, and then it all caught up with them. I expect the same at Brighton. More to the point, we have the largest metropolitan catchment area in the UK (maybe the world) to try and find future players in. Brighton and Southampton don't. Focusing on the academy makes as much sense for us as speculative international transfers makes for them.

Even so, there was some suggestion that Textor had funded the purchases of Andersen, Geuhi, Dacoure etc. I presume that was in the form of a loan to CPFC, as a gift would not be allowed. Perhaps he did give those funds on the basis that the players get sold at profit, and that he gets his money back plus a bit more. Only Textor and Parish will know the details, but I'm not sure how that would be at odds with the new general strategy anyway - whoever's money has been spent, it has been spent by CPFC who must meet FFP requirements. I'm not sure what difference it would make if Textor was pressing Parish to sell players at profit - he is going to try and do that anyway - although I totally take your point about not having Textor running the club. All the more reason to have Parish there, as far as I a concerned.

The great unknown in all of this is who, if anyone, has put their own money into the bricks and mortar. The original Americans lent CPFC money to tide the club over during covid, and also for the Allardyce-era transfer spend. It seems Textor helped with the Vieria-era transfer spend. A top-rate academy has been built and paid for (I would urge anyone who hasn't already to watch the interview Parish gave to Gary Neville about the mind-blowing costs of that), whilst a new main stand has stalled. Parish has described the involvement of the Americans (including Textor) as a means by which to speed-up his development plans for the club, but none of us know the specifics. Did any of them come on board especially to spend their own money on bricks and mortar? If so, perhaps we have already done well out of them to get the academy built, but perhaps a different investor would have built the stand by now too. If they haven't paid for the academy then why are they here, given they can't spend their own money on transfers?

If I had to guess, I would say the original Americans came in to pay for the academy and the stand (fairly safe investments, permissible personal spending under FFP), and then to sell at a profit, and that Textor is more focused on the buying and selling of players at profit.

Edited by TheBigToePunt (05 Oct 2023 12.16pm)

 

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Putitout Flag Oxford 05 Oct 23 12.12pm Send a Private Message to Putitout Add Putitout as a friend

Since he took Palace over Parish, has got any number of things right, proof of that is we as a club are still after ten or so years in this incredibly competitive league .
He is only a football club chairman, he can’t get everything right, maybe sometimes best laid plans just will not come together. I,m thinking our last window could have addressed our real needs better than it did, and have said so , but Parish out , no way.
For every half dozen successful money bags owners there are any number of outright potential asset strippers , and the rest struggle as Parish, does with in almost all cases less success.

 

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taylors lovechild Flag 05 Oct 23 12.14pm Send a Private Message to taylors lovechild Add taylors lovechild as a friend

Originally posted by SnapperKain

So whilst you might think people are sucking Parish's c*** on here, perhaps it's better than the devil's tit...

Unless the devil is indeed prime Liz Hurley [Link]

 

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Painter Flag Croydon 05 Oct 23 1.58pm Send a Private Message to Painter Add Painter as a friend

Originally posted by Putitout

Since he took Palace over Parish, has got any number of things right, proof of that is we as a club are still after ten or so years in this incredibly competitive league .
He is only a football club chairman, he can’t get everything right, maybe sometimes best laid plans just will not come together. I,m thinking our last window could have addressed our real needs better than it did, and have said so , but Parish out , no way.
For every half dozen successful money bags owners there are any number of outright potential asset strippers , and the rest struggle as Parish, does with in almost all cases less success.

How many fans leaving Wembley in May 2013, anticipated immediate relegation as usual. The fact we are still in the premier 10 years later is due in a big part to Parish. Like him or loathe him it cannot be denied, he has been the most successful Chairman in our history.

 

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deflemonkid Flag 07 Oct 23 8.07am Send a Private Message to deflemonkid Add deflemonkid as a friend

Originally posted by TheBigToePunt

This is a very interesting post SnapperKain, thanks.

On your very first point (and I appreciate you are not suggesting otherwise, but just for clarity) if someone with a billion in the bank did buy CPFC tomorrow our transfer budget would not change. FFP requires that CPFC only spend what CPFC earns, regardless of what personal money the owner may want to throw around.

Edited by TheBigToePunt (05 Oct 2023 12.16pm)


This is a murky point in terms of FFP, been listening to the Price of football podcast the last couple of years and i keep hearing the term "converting a loan into shares" which is what's happened down on the south coast. Tony Bloom basically pumps loads of his own cash into the club as a "loan" and then down the road converts that loan to shares. It dilutes the value of a share but if you own them all and your not really in it to make a profit then its apparently above board.

I also think if Parish had such a suitor knocking on the door he'd gladly hand over the reins but as it stands he's definitely kept us punching above our weight as far as I can see.

 

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Dubai Eagle Flag 07 Oct 23 9.45am Send a Private Message to Dubai Eagle Add Dubai Eagle as a friend

Its certainly true that if the man with a £ billion burning a hole in his pocket did turn up on our door that we couldn't suddenly splash out of transfers (courtesy of FFP) but there are areas where we could improve our financial standing which in turn would improve our FFP position & then we could spend more on transfers because our revenue stream had improved along the way -

a) Naming rights for Selhurst Park
b) Naming rights for the Academy
c) Shirt sponsor - New deal with a company owned by our new benefactor at enhanced contract value -
d) In ground advertising favouring prime locations to a company owned by our new benefactor at enhanced contract value.

Of course now that these avenues are a more well trodden path from the days when Chelsea & Man City were able to name their price & inflate their balance sheet accordingly (to obtain better FFP positioning) even at todays "norm" they can still be a considerable leveraging tool for a PL club.

 

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rikz Flag Croydon 07 Oct 23 10.05am Send a Private Message to rikz Add rikz as a friend

Originally posted by eaglesdare

A year or two in the championship would do some of our fans the world of good.

It wouldn't change a thing, we would be demanding prem football, like now we're demanding a push into the top 10/Europe. If you don't have ambition to be better then there's probably no point supporting a competitive sporting club.

 

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Midlands Eagle Flag 07 Oct 23 2.27pm Send a Private Message to Midlands Eagle Add Midlands Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Dubai Eagle


c) Shirt sponsor - New deal with a company owned by our new benefactor at enhanced contract value -

The powers that be are supposed to have cut down on that with all commercial deals having to be at normal market rates although I'm sure that some of the big boys get away with it

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards grumpymort Flag US/Thailand/UK 07 Oct 23 3.20pm Send a Private Message to grumpymort Add grumpymort as a friend

Originally posted by Dubai Eagle

Its certainly true that if the man with a £ billion burning a hole in his pocket did turn up on our door that we couldn't suddenly splash out of transfers (courtesy of FFP) but there are areas where we could improve our financial standing which in turn would improve our FFP position & then we could spend more on transfers because our revenue stream had improved along the way -

a) Naming rights for Selhurst Park
b) Naming rights for the Academy
c) Shirt sponsor - New deal with a company owned by our new benefactor at enhanced contract value -
d) In ground advertising favouring prime locations to a company owned by our new benefactor at enhanced contract value.

Of course now that these avenues are a more well trodden path from the days when Chelsea & Man City were able to name their price & inflate their balance sheet accordingly (to obtain better FFP positioning) even at todays "norm" they can still be a considerable leveraging tool for a PL club.


FFP doesn't mean a great deal.

If you have the money you can spend and pay the fine this has been done by clubs before.

That list is what we should already be doing and a good business man in charge would have done this another bunch of reasons for SP out from his current role (no issue with him owning part of the club)

 


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(Alt VPN) - [Link]

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est1905 Flag 09 Oct 23 5.30pm Send a Private Message to est1905 Add est1905 as a friend

Originally posted by Dubai Eagle

Its certainly true that if the man with a £ billion burning a hole in his pocket did turn up on our door that we couldn't suddenly splash out of transfers (courtesy of FFP) but there are areas where we could improve our financial standing which in turn would improve our FFP position & then we could spend more on transfers because our revenue stream had improved along the way -

a) Naming rights for Selhurst Park
b) Naming rights for the Academy
c) Shirt sponsor - New deal with a company owned by our new benefactor at enhanced contract value -
d) In ground advertising favouring prime locations to a company owned by our new benefactor at enhanced contract value.

Of course now that these avenues are a more well trodden path from the days when Chelsea & Man City were able to name their price & inflate their balance sheet accordingly (to obtain better FFP positioning) even at todays "norm" they can still be a considerable leveraging tool for a PL club.

Premiership rules strictly now prohibit owners/investors/directors of a club having any connection whatsoever to income. IE: they are not allowed to buy naming rights for one of their companies and they are not allowed to use one of their companies to sponsor the club at a way inflated figure just to get the club's turnover/income up. This was pushed hard by Daniel Levy when Newcastle's takeover was completed (for obvious reasons). The thing that is unfair on everyone else is deals that are already in place at clubs such as Chelsea, Man City, Liverpool, United are allowed to not only stay in place but are also allowed to be renewed!

 

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dreamwaverider Flag London 09 Oct 23 6.42pm Send a Private Message to dreamwaverider Add dreamwaverider as a friend

Originally posted by TheBigToePunt

This is a very interesting post SnapperKain, thanks.

On your very first point (and I appreciate you are not suggesting otherwise, but just for clarity) if someone with a billion in the bank did buy CPFC tomorrow our transfer budget would not change. FFP requires that CPFC only spend what CPFC earns, regardless of what personal money the owner may want to throw around.

Leaving aside the idea of 'doing a Newcastle' at Palace (i.e. spending big sums quickly on players in the hope of getting into the top four, thereby increasing revenue so the original spending becomes permissible), a billionaire owner (or just any new owner, or just our current owners acting differently) might change our transfer strategy, but not our transfer budget. I think that is where Textor, and the points you make about him, become most significant.

Some pine for the semi-high risk, high-turnover, speculative approach Brighton have taken, for instance. Perhaps Textor is one of them.

Personally, I don't think it's wise. Southampton did something very similar, they got into the Europa League (maybe twice?) whilst buying low and selling high. It didn't last, didn't get them to the next level, and then it all caught up with them. I expect the same at Brighton. More to the point, we have the largest metropolitan catchment area in the UK (maybe the world) to try and find future players in. Brighton and Southampton don't. Focusing on the academy makes as much sense for us as speculative international transfers makes for them.

Even so, there was some suggestion that Textor had funded the purchases of Andersen, Geuhi, Dacoure etc. I presume that was in the form of a loan to CPFC, as a gift would not be allowed. Perhaps he did give those funds on the basis that the players get sold at profit, and that he gets his money back plus a bit more. Only Textor and Parish will know the details, but I'm not sure how that would be at odds with the new general strategy anyway - whoever's money has been spent, it has been spent by CPFC who must meet FFP requirements. I'm not sure what difference it would make if Textor was pressing Parish to sell players at profit - he is going to try and do that anyway - although I totally take your point about not having Textor running the club. All the more reason to have Parish there, as far as I a concerned.

The great unknown in all of this is who, if anyone, has put their own money into the bricks and mortar. The original Americans lent CPFC money to tide the club over during covid, and also for the Allardyce-era transfer spend. It seems Textor helped with the Vieria-era transfer spend. A top-rate academy has been built and paid for (I would urge anyone who hasn't already to watch the interview Parish gave to Gary Neville about the mind-blowing costs of that), whilst a new main stand has stalled. Parish has described the involvement of the Americans (including Textor) as a means by which to speed-up his development plans for the club, but none of us know the specifics. Did any of them come on board especially to spend their own money on bricks and mortar? If so, perhaps we have already done well out of them to get the academy built, but perhaps a different investor would have built the stand by now too. If they haven't paid for the academy then why are they here, given they can't spend their own money on transfers?

If I had to guess, I would say the original Americans came in to pay for the academy and the stand (fairly safe investments, permissible personal spending under FFP), and then to sell at a profit, and that Textor is more focused on the buying and selling of players at profit.

Edited by TheBigToePunt (05 Oct 2023 12.16pm)

Good post. As was Snapperkain.
Haven't seen sydtheeagle posting this season. Shame. He has good angles.
Hope he is ok.

Edited by dreamwaverider (09 Oct 2023 6.43pm)

 

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Rachid Rachid Rachid Flag 09 Oct 23 7.10pm Send a Private Message to Rachid Rachid Rachid Add Rachid Rachid Rachid as a friend

I've not generally been a critic of SP but looked at what we had at the end of last season once Roy had straightened things out and thought that with additions in the full back areas and up front we could have a very good season.

As it turns out I think that the Board have looked at the three teams that have been promoted and a couple of others they perceive to be strugglers and closed the wallet.

Ultimately I think we'll be the losers as I think, in the end, the better players will get the hump with the lack of ambition and any prospect of European football.

SP and the Board have done well by us but I think that they have struck a bit lucky with Roy and found their goose that lays the golden egg.

 

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