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Part Time James 18 Jul 17 4.33pm | |
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I never thought this was my stance but I'd be as happy seeing Will Smith play James Bond as I would seeing Rowan Atkinson play Martin Luther King. Both fantastic actors that would be incredibly entertaining.
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Ray in Houston Houston 18 Jul 17 4.38pm | |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
The bottom line is that they want to make money. So you're ok with reinventing the race/colour of a written character as long as it makes more money? So much for artistic integrity. FYI, have you noticed the increase in Hollywood movies of China as a locale and/or Chinese characters? It's not an accident. [Link] Based on your stated principle, that money trumps art, I'm sure you're looking forward to Jet Li playing James Bond.
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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Part Time James 18 Jul 17 4.41pm | |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
So you're ok with reinventing the race/colour of a written character as long as it makes more money? So much for artistic integrity. FYI, have you noticed the increase in Hollywood movies of China as a locale and/or Chinese characters? It's not an accident. [Link] Based on your stated principle, that money trumps art, I'm sure you're looking forward to Jet Li playing James Bond. I've actually lost track of which side of the argument you are on. The above reads like you are against actors portraying characters of a different traditional ethnicity. I thought earlier you were for it.
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jamiemartin721 Reading 18 Jul 17 4.47pm | |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
So you're ok with reinventing the race/colour of a written character as long as it makes more money? So much for artistic integrity. FYI, have you noticed the increase in Hollywood movies of China as a locale and/or Chinese characters? It's not an accident. [Link] Based on your stated principle, that money trumps art, I'm sure you're looking forward to Jet Li playing James Bond. James Bond just couldn't compete with Chinese and Hong Kong action cinema. Chow Yun Fat as James Bond, with Andrew Lau directing - Yes f**king please. That sh*t would be the bomb. I lost interest in action movies after getting into Hong Kong and Wishu. Once you've seen The Stormriders you realise exactly who should have been directing Lord of the Rings! Chocolate might be one the best action movies around, and its lead is a 15 year old autistic character.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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jamiemartin721 Reading 18 Jul 17 5.01pm | |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
"Whitewashing" in the entertainment industry has a long and shameful history. Think back to who played the Arabs in "Lawrence of Arabia"; it was Omar Sharif...yes...and Alec Guinness and Anthony Quinn - with Jose Ferrer as a Turk). This year, the lead Asian character from the book of "Ghost in the Shell" was played by Scarlett Johansson, which follows last year's nonsense with Emma Stone playing a half-Asian Hawaiian. Hollywood has been replacing characters - written as people of colour (irony alert) - with white actors since day one. Seeing as Hollywood has already established that the colour of a written character's skin is irrelevant to the movie portrayal of that character, it makes the whole debate about Bond moot. Somewhat unfairly in this specific case: the lead character in Ghost in the Shell isn't Asian, she's a cyborg, and she's not even in her original body (she's shifted form several times). She was originally Japanese, but exists in a trans-human society. Motoko aka the major loses her original body in childhood with full body prosthetic, with a cybernetic brain - hence the title - Ghost in the Shell. Its literally about someone divorced from their physical self. Sadly, it seems people made a lot of noise without being too familiar with the source, because as it turns out for all the films failings, Scarlett Johansson really nails the appearance from some of the anime. Even the original author thinks she's a great adaptation. Its the exception maybe that proves the rule, but actually Scarlett Johansson is a very good
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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Hrolf The Ganger 18 Jul 17 5.03pm | |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
So you're ok with reinventing the race/colour of a written character as long as it makes more money? So much for artistic integrity. FYI, have you noticed the increase in Hollywood movies of China as a locale and/or Chinese characters? It's not an accident. [Link] Based on your stated principle, that money trumps art, I'm sure you're looking forward to Jet Li playing James Bond. It has nothing to do with me. I'm not in the movie business. However, profit is the driving force behind all decisions made regarding casting. Even art for art sake still needs to eat. Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (18 Jul 2017 5.05pm)
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Hrolf The Ganger 18 Jul 17 5.07pm | |
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Originally posted by Part Time James
I never thought this was my stance but I'd be as happy seeing Will Smith play James Bond as I would seeing Rowan Atkinson play Martin Luther King. Both fantastic actors that would be incredibly entertaining. What about Ron Atkinson?
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Ray in Houston Houston 18 Jul 17 5.10pm | |
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Originally posted by Part Time James
I've actually lost track of which side of the argument you are on. The above reads like you are against actors portraying characters of a different traditional ethnicity. I thought earlier you were for it. 1950s Bond has to be a white man because it's not credible that he'd be anything else; while a 21st century Bond can be drawn from a much more varied genetic pot. Many other characters are similarly interchangeable. I'm fine with this. But Hollywood gets rightly criticised for replacing non-white characters with white actors just coz. The money argument doesn't always work either, because big budget movies like "Gods of Egypt" cast Gerrard Butler and some unknown Australian as it's main protagonists and Ridley Scott's "Exodus" had a cast of actors about as Egyptian as that of "Carry on Cleo". I am not fine with this. As Hrolf showed with his contradiction over money vs. white Bond, there's no simple black and white here (pun intended).
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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Ray in Houston Houston 18 Jul 17 5.13pm | |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
It has nothing to do with me. I'm not in the movie business. However, profit is the driving force behind all decisions made regarding casting. Even art for art sake still needs to eat. Great. So a non-white Bond is fine by you if it makes the Broccolis more money?
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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Hrolf The Ganger 18 Jul 17 5.19pm | |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
1950s Bond has to be a white man because it's not credible that he'd be anything else; while a 21st century Bond can be drawn from a much more varied genetic pot. Many other characters are similarly interchangeable. I'm fine with this. But Hollywood gets rightly criticised for replacing non-white characters with white actors just coz. The money argument doesn't always work either, because big budget movies like "Gods of Egypt" cast Gerrard Butler and some unknown Australian as it's main protagonists and Ridley Scott's "Exodus" had a cast of actors about as Egyptian as that of "Carry on Cleo". I am not fine with this. As Hrolf showed with his contradiction over money vs. white Bond, there's no simple black and white here (pun intended). White actors usually play foreign characters because they are box office draws where as a whole cast of unknown Egyptians, for example, will sink like a stone. I don't think this concept is dificult to grasp.
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cpj Kent 18 Jul 17 5.23pm | |
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Originally posted by johnno42000
I don't agree with the new Doctor IF she has just got the job because she is a woman. To me that is just as sexist as a man getting the job just because he is a man. However if she got it as she was the best candidate, good on her. Missy is possibly my favourite character and I hope she comes back. As a lifelong fan (haven't missed an episode since I started watching in about 1965), I hated Missy with a passion. Not sure about Jodie Whittaker - but glad it wasn't Kris Marshall who was favourite. The problem in the last few years has been the awful stories (especially Moffatt and his story arcs). Bring back decent stories and it doesn't really matter who the Doctor is. For the record, my favourite Doctors have been Pertwee, Troughton and Tennant.
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Hrolf The Ganger 18 Jul 17 5.29pm | |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
Great. So a non-white Bond is fine by you if it makes the Broccolis more money? I want Bond to be white because I'm white and his character has always been white. If he ever becomes Black it will be because someone thinks it will make more money, not to further the success of the Black 'race'. What ever colour he is, I will have more important things to worry about.
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