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The Election Thread
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 EverybodyDannsNow  SE19 05 Dec 19 5.29pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
That's not what I said. I was referring to money and consistency.....Yeah, sure they sometimes point at actual unfairness, while directly contributing to it. Look, it's similar to the tax man who wants to join Jesus.....it's essentially the 'cake and eat it' brigade....The 'I can be rich, but I'm one of you or with you'. 'Don't be fooled by the rocks that I got. What a complete load of self deluded BS. A well off socialist is a hypocrite......give the extra away or admit that your support for that politics is a form of self aggrandisement.....a self image of yourself as moral while you make excuses for driving two cars and nice holidays while supporting 'equality'.
Never thought I’d be discussing JLO lyrics in a political exchange but here we go I interpret the lyrics more of a cultural belonging than any sort of monetary claim - she’s not claiming to be a socialist is she, just saying that despite her success, she still feels her home is ‘the block’ - I think a lot of people can relate to that, myself included. I also think you conflate having left-leaning tendencies with being a full blown socialist far too readily - my own experience is that there is only a relatively small minority of people who believe in pure socialism, and most just feel the scale has shifted too far one way.
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| Stirlingsays 05 Dec 19 5.31pm |
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Originally posted by SW19 CPFC
Mainly agree. Religion has been changed and adapted so much for no other purpose than power and convenience I find it amazing people still a) follow the modern incarnations of it and b) do so thinking they're following it correctly. Newsflash, you're not. Especially if you are CoE. Well done. Your version was created by a fat man with gout to get his way 1532 years after the fact. It's not correct. Waste of life I have more respect for Pagans than anyone who follows any branch of christianity. Agreed. Paganism makes more sense.....though ultimately you just end up finding yourself shagging some neurotic women who doesn't wash regularly enough.....some tosh about being one with nature or other. Edited by Stirlingsays (05 Dec 2019 5.31pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Stirlingsays 05 Dec 19 5.46pm |
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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
Never thought I’d be discussing JLO lyrics in a political exchange but here we go I interpret the lyrics more of a cultural belonging than any sort of monetary claim - she’s not claiming to be a socialist is she, just saying that despite her success, she still feels her home is ‘the block’ - I think a lot of people can relate to that, myself included. I'd kinda agree with that.....though I don't think you can really divorce the money from it. But I accept the broad premise....I used it more for illustration. Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
I also think you conflate having left-leaning tendencies with being a full blown socialist far too readily - my own experience is that there is only a relatively small minority of people who believe in pure socialism, and most just feel the scale has shifted too far one way. I think it undermines the central 'equality' message of socialism. It's not one I agree with but I can respect the intent nevertheless. I have an aversion to the 'cake and eat it' brigade. The 'I have a nice life but I'm a socialist'. Well, anyone can make their fiscals equal to the national average if they really wanted to. Socialism-lite.....The 'third way'....Blairism....Mandelsonism.....well ok, I'm essentially having a go at neo liberalism on the left as an inherent ideological tension. But I recognise your critique as having some validity....this criticism can obviously go too far and if you think I've stretched it then fair enough.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 05 Dec 19 5.53pm |
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Originally posted by Midlands Eagle
That's a huge insult to the late David Frost who was a heavyweight commentator whilst Schofield's target market seems to be housewives. The interesting thing about the Andrew Neil non interview with Boris Johnson is that I doubt whether anyone really cares apart from the BBC of course A lot of people care, including me. I wanted to see him grilled and his hypocrisy exposed by a serious political journalist. That his "advisers" have stopped it happening only confirms what I believe. That Johnson is a complete fake. An opportunist who will say anything so long as it keeps him in the job he has craved. Andrew Neil would have eviscerated him and might have done enough to save us all. No-one has yet really torn him apart on his refusal to publish the intelligence committee report on Russian interference or on the weaknesses we have in trying to negotiate a trade deal with the USA that won't see huge increases in drug costs for the NHS. Brexit will not gain us independence. It will leave us isolated and unprotected by our closest allies in Europe. Johnson knows this and is sacrificing the future of our children for his own selfishness. These days are truly the nadir of British politics in my lifetime. I wonder how long it will take before we recover and whether I will live to see it. My children and grand children are already blaming my generation for this disaster so you can all expect a backlash when they do get their hands on the wheel of state again and that is totally certain to happen.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Rudi Hedman Caterham 05 Dec 19 5.55pm |
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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
Never thought I’d be discussing JLO lyrics in a political exchange but here we go I interpret the lyrics more of a cultural belonging than any sort of monetary claim - she’s not claiming to be a socialist is she, just saying that despite her success, she still feels her home is ‘the block’ - I think a lot of people can relate to that, myself included. I also think you conflate having left-leaning tendencies with being a full blown socialist far too readily - my own experience is that there is only a relatively small minority of people who believe in pure socialism, and most just feel the scale has shifted too far one way. I possibly agreed with you until, ‘She’s saying that despite her success, she still feels her home is ‘the block’ - I think a lot of people can relate to that, myself included.’ I think ‘I’m still Hispanic Jenny but the way I live, think and the people I mix with are from the Hills and very much not the block I was desperate to get out of’ might be more accurate. But the lyrics were cute while she was dating Ben Affleck or whichever celebrity circle she was socialising in and nobody from the block. Not that I blame her at all. Pop music is another ruthless industry where getting kids’ dollars in those few years are all up for grabs and any adult who buys most of it for any message rather than a dance is a fool. Edited by Rudi Hedman (05 Dec 2019 6.00pm)
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| EverybodyDannsNow SE19 05 Dec 19 6.17pm |
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Originally posted by Rudi Hedman
I possibly agreed with you until, ‘She’s saying that despite her success, she still feels her home is ‘the block’ - I think a lot of people can relate to that, myself included.’ I think ‘I’m still Hispanic Jenny but the way I live, think and the people I mix with are from the Hills and very much not the block I was desperate to get out of’ might be more accurate. But the lyrics were cute while she was dating Ben Affleck or whichever celebrity circle she was socialising in and nobody from the block. Not that I blame her at all. Pop music is another ruthless industry where getting kids’ dollars in those few years are all up for grabs and any adult who buys most of it for any message rather than a dance is a fool. Edited by Rudi Hedman (05 Dec 2019 6.00pm) Well you are guessing how and what she thinks, and indeed to some extent who she mixes with. As I said, it’s a position I can personally relate to, so I don’t see it as that unrealistic - I’ve had a relatively successful few years, financially am better of than most of those I grew up with and around, but still culturally consider the s***hole parts of Norbury and Thornton Heath where I was raised to be ‘where I’m from’ and I certainly feel more at home there than I would in an affluent area. Anyway, probably as much analysis as can be done from the chorus of Jenny from the block.
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| Rudi Hedman Caterham 05 Dec 19 6.33pm |
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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
Well you are guessing how and what she thinks, and indeed to some extent who she mixes with. As I said, it’s a position I can personally relate to, so I don’t see it as that unrealistic - I’ve had a relatively successful few years, financially am better of than most of those I grew up with and around, but still culturally consider the s***hole parts of Norbury and Thornton Heath where I was raised to be ‘where I’m from’ and I certainly feel more at home there than I would in an affluent area. Anyway, probably as much analysis as can be done from the chorus of Jenny from the block. I get you, and ‘I’m from....’ can mean exactly just that but obviously in the case of JLO it means more. She feels comfortable now in celebrity or showbiz circles. I’d be very surprised if she felt more comfortable in the block than the hills. Actually I’d be surprised if you did, meaning you may not be made to feel welcome after you thought might/would from experience of your past. But yes, it’s a dance track of nonsense in an election thread for serious discussion and casual slinging matches.
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| Stirlingsays 05 Dec 19 6.38pm |
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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
Well you are guessing how and what she thinks, and indeed to some extent who she mixes with. As I said, it’s a position I can personally relate to, so I don’t see it as that unrealistic - I’ve had a relatively successful few years, financially am better of than most of those I grew up with and around, but still culturally consider the s***hole parts of Norbury and Thornton Heath where I was raised to be ‘where I’m from’ and I certainly feel more at home there than I would in an affluent area. Anyway, probably as much analysis as can be done from the chorus of Jenny from the block.
If you do already then much respect.....Otherwise like Jenny....You aren't from the block...You were from the block and just enjoy your cake. Edited by Stirlingsays (05 Dec 2019 6.39pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Stirlingsays 05 Dec 19 6.45pm |
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Originally posted by Rudi Hedman
I get you, and ‘I’m from....’ can mean exactly just that but obviously in the case of JLO it means more. She feels comfortable now in celebrity or showbiz circles. I’d be very surprised if she felt more comfortable in the block than the hills. Actually I’d be surprised if you did, meaning you may not be made to feel welcome after you thought might/would from experience of your past. But yes, it’s a dance track of nonsense in an election thread for serious discussion and casual slinging matches.
It's almost as amusing a song as Price Tag by Jessie J. Commercial hippyism for the middle and working class who don't think too deeply. A principle you won't suffer for isn't a principle at all. Edited by Stirlingsays (05 Dec 2019 6.46pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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cryrst  The garden of England 05 Dec 19 7.22pm |
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Originally posted by SW19 CPFC
The 70s. I stopped reading after that. You would wouldn't you.
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 SW19 CPFC Addiscombe West 05 Dec 19 8.43pm |
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Originally posted by cryrst
You would wouldn't you. No brah But attempting to use an emotional argument based on events from half a century ago and then transplanting them into a debate about now to use as some form of equivalence is illogical and absurd Hence why I stopped at the ‘70s’. I’m fully aware as a comfortably higher rate taxpayer that I would need to pay more. I’ve already made my stance on this clear re. Taxation increase for the higher end. Yeah I’ll have less disposable, but so long as that money gets used where it’s needed then I am prepared to deal with it (unlikely, but my point stands). Your arguments are tired, emotional and cliched, but you’re entitled to them. What I really dislike is central London living business owners with multi million pound turnovers complaining about being taxed more when they send both their kids to private school and pay for private healthcare. Then have the cheek to insinuate they’re doing the state a favour by doing so and should get some sort of rebate. Go to another country where you can abuse the system. Not wanted. It is not I that needs to do more research.
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| Rudi Hedman Caterham 05 Dec 19 9.24pm |
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Originally posted by SW19 CPFC
No brah But attempting to use an emotional argument based on events from half a century ago and then transplanting them into a debate about now to use as some form of equivalence is illogical and absurd Hence why I stopped at the ‘70s’. I’m fully aware as a comfortably higher rate taxpayer that I would need to pay more. I’ve already made my stance on this clear re. Taxation increase for the higher end. Yeah I’ll have less disposable, but so long as that money gets used where it’s needed then I am prepared to deal with it (unlikely, but my point stands). Your arguments are tired, emotional and cliched, but you’re entitled to them. What I really dislike is central London living business owners with multi million pound turnovers complaining about being taxed more when they send both their kids to private school and pay for private healthcare. Then have the cheek to insinuate they’re doing the state a favour by doing so and should get some sort of rebate. Go to another country where you can abuse the system. Not wanted. It is not I that needs to do more research. Specifically what is unlikely? That it’ll get used where it’s needed? What if it gets used where it’s not needed or ends up being used to pay a growing debt bill? I don’t disagree with you btw. As soon as I could without being short at the end of the month I donated to Action Aid because those kids really have nothing. I’m just curious if it does go where it’s needed, or a lot of it wasted. Britain had to go through austerity in 2010, even the Lib Dem’s saw it had to. Since then in the last few years more spending should have happened, but to Corbyn’s levels brings back all those concerns that became reality even at the end of Bliar and Brown’s successful economic period, even if it was during historically low interest rates rippling over from the USA after 9/11. Eventually you’ll get your wish. Maybe in 5,10,15,20 years, and possibly not taxed a little more but a lot lot more. Will produce a tut and an eye roll.
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