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Relegation 22/23

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Nicholas91 Flag The Democratic Republic of Kent 03 May 23 1.55pm Send a Private Message to Nicholas91 Add Nicholas91 as a friend

Originally posted by steeleye20

That would be too much for my nervous system, and I think many others!

An error, a dodgy decision, VAR wrong, miss from 3 feet etc etc. can end seasons of hard work and huge investment down the pan.

Thank God its not us.

I've got no idea I guess Saints have more ground to make up.

They are all good sides, better, I surmise, than anyone coming up.


TBF whilst I feel exactly the same I thought similarly when the likes of Fulham, Brentford and Bournemouth came up.

I think PL money can often transform C'ship teams that make the cut above the rest one season into competitive PL sides.

 


Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!

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TheBigToePunt Flag 03 May 23 2.49pm Send a Private Message to TheBigToePunt Add TheBigToePunt as a friend

Originally posted by silvertop

That's it. Saints are better than most teams in Europe. They would do well in every league save Spain and here.

I understand the argument that even a weak Premier League side is stronger than mid-table sides in most other leagues, as the EPL clubs have so much more money.

However, whilst money certainly talks, football clubs do need spirit, direction, hunger and togetherness.

I have often used Southampton as an example of the faults in the 'buy or develop young and/or unheard of players, sell at a profit, repeat' model. They've dodged the bullet a few times in recent years but their pending, whimpering relegation has been long-coming. Whether their squad could be upper mid-table in another league or not, their mentality would see any club relegated in the end.

Every time you give an untried kid a chance or take the plunge on a speculative transfer, you are taking a risk. There are only so many times you can go to the well before it runs dry.

Every time you sell your best player or prospect, you weaken your side. Even if the next untested, talented young player ultimately develops to be as good as the one you just sold, all the time that he remains a work in progress your team will be weaker than it was.

The more often you sell your best players the more the best players expect to be sold. The more the players expect to be sold the more they see your club as a stepping stone. The more that happens, the less committed to the club itself they are. How many of the Southampton players will already have checked out mentally, and had their agents working on their next move for weeks?


Clubs like Palace do need to trade well of course, but where Southampton are now seems partly the end game of their business model and the culture it creates. They touched the sky in qualifying for European football but the model made them work backward from there, not forwards. Wolves are the same. Brighton will end up there too.

Look at Leicester. With the players they have they should be far higher up, but they don't seem to have the togetherness and personal commitment that Roy's previous Palace team of old journeymen had. Mentally, many of their best assets are at other clubs already.

Southampton have traded their way out of the premier league, thereby losing far more money then they've made on player sales.

 

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Nicholas91 Flag The Democratic Republic of Kent 03 May 23 2.54pm Send a Private Message to Nicholas91 Add Nicholas91 as a friend

Originally posted by TheBigToePunt

I understand the argument that even a weak Premier League side is stronger than mid-table sides in most other leagues, as the EPL clubs have so much more money.

However, whilst money certainly talks, football clubs do need spirit, direction, hunger and togetherness.

I have often used Southampton as an example of the faults in the 'buy or develop young and/or unheard of players, sell at a profit, repeat' model. They've dodged the bullet a few times in recent years but their pending, whimpering relegation has been long-coming. Whether their squad could be upper mid-table in another league or not, their mentality would see any club relegated in the end.

Every time you give an untried kid a chance or take the plunge on a speculative transfer, you are taking a risk. There are only so many times you can go to the well before it runs dry.

Every time you sell your best player or prospect, you weaken your side. Even if the next untested, talented young player ultimately develops to be as good as the one you just sold, all the time that he remains a work in progress your team will be weaker than it was.

The more often you sell your best players the more the best players expect to be sold. The more the players expect to be sold the more they see your club as a stepping stone. The more that happens, the less committed to the club itself they are. How many of the Southampton players will already have checked out mentally, and had their agents working on their next move for weeks?


Clubs like Palace do need to trade well of course, but where Southampton are now seems partly the end game of their business model and the culture it creates. They touched the sky in qualifying for European football but the model made them work backward from there, not forwards. Wolves are the same. Brighton will end up there too.

Look at Leicester. With the players they have they should be far higher up, but they don't seem to have the togetherness and personal commitment that Roy's previous Palace team of old journeymen had. Mentally, many of their best assets are at other clubs already.

Southampton have traded their way out of the premier league, thereby losing far more money then they've made on player sales.

I think that's a very sage point.

There's a difference between having solid and effective succession planning in place and relying upon every other player turning into Gareth Bale, Mane or VVD frequently.

They did turn into somewhat of a revolving door team and with that you are bound to lose a lot of what is necessary on the softer side of things - joint venture, cohesion, fraternity etc.

Might just be another example, similar to many things in life, where balance is needed for sustainability and longer term success.

On a grander scale, I think Chelsea are demonstrating that even with spending a billion squid, you can quickly lose identity and therefore performance and effectiveness as a team.

 


Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!

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MrRobbo Flag Chaldon 03 May 23 5.17pm Send a Private Message to MrRobbo Add MrRobbo as a friend

Originally posted by TheBigToePunt

I understand the argument that even a weak Premier League side is stronger than mid-table sides in most other leagues, as the EPL clubs have so much more money.

However, whilst money certainly talks, football clubs do need spirit, direction, hunger and togetherness.

I have often used Southampton as an example of the faults in the 'buy or develop young and/or unheard of players, sell at a profit, repeat' model. They've dodged the bullet a few times in recent years but their pending, whimpering relegation has been long-coming. Whether their squad could be upper mid-table in another league or not, their mentality would see any club relegated in the end.

Every time you give an untried kid a chance or take the plunge on a speculative transfer, you are taking a risk. There are only so many times you can go to the well before it runs dry.

Every time you sell your best player or prospect, you weaken your side. Even if the next untested, talented young player ultimately develops to be as good as the one you just sold, all the time that he remains a work in progress your team will be weaker than it was.

The more often you sell your best players the more the best players expect to be sold. The more the players expect to be sold the more they see your club as a stepping stone. The more that happens, the less committed to the club itself they are. How many of the Southampton players will already have checked out mentally, and had their agents working on their next move for weeks?


Clubs like Palace do need to trade well of course, but where Southampton are now seems partly the end game of their business model and the culture it creates. They touched the sky in qualifying for European football but the model made them work backward from there, not forwards. Wolves are the same. Brighton will end up there too.

Look at Leicester. With the players they have they should be far higher up, but they don't seem to have the togetherness and personal commitment that Roy's previous Palace team of old journeymen had. Mentally, many of their best assets are at other clubs already.

Southampton have traded their way out of the premier league, thereby losing far more money then they've made on player sales.

Whilst I don't disagree with the sentiment. Almost every team in world football sells their bet players. There are probably only a handful who don't (Barca, Real, PSG etc).

Selling players to better clubs isn't a sign that you are doing something wrong, quite the opposite. It shows that you are doing something right.

We are quite uniquely not used to this situation as we've only sold a handful of players in the last decade.

I wouldn't take too much notice of Southampton, they are just an example of a club run badly. Bar a couple or windows, they have always had a net spend. They have just bought a load of dross.


 

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VinceHilaire Flag London 03 May 23 5.28pm Send a Private Message to VinceHilaire Add VinceHilaire as a friend

I’ll be honest - I am just so relieved to be just watching other clubs sweat about the relegation battle ahead! Roy - you are a genius!

We have 4 games coming up - and it would be ironic if our last game of the season against Forest - decides the fate of 1 or 2 clubs. After what happened last season at Everton, I would be happy to see them drop down

 

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Wilbraham413 Flag 05 May 23 2.43am Send a Private Message to Wilbraham413 Add Wilbraham413 as a friend

Originally posted by VinceHilaire

I’ll be honest - I am just so relieved to be just watching other clubs sweat about the relegation battle ahead! Roy - you are a genius!

We have 4 games coming up - and it would be ironic if our last game of the season against Forest - decides the fate of 1 or 2 clubs. After what happened last season at Everton, I would be happy to see them drop down

This is where I am, too. Watching these relegation battles, with the fans sh-tting themselves, I'm like, thank god we're not in that.

 


2017 Feb. (Van Aanholt) Palace 1 - 0 Middlesboro
2018 Jan. (Sako) Palace 1 - 0 Burnley
2019 May (Batshuayi, Batshuayi, OG, Van Aanholt, Townsend) Palace 5 - 3 Bournemouth
2020 Feb. (Van Aanholt) Palace 1 - 0 Newcastle

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Elpis Flag In a pub 05 May 23 7.11am Send a Private Message to Elpis Add Elpis as a friend

Originally posted by VinceHilaire
After what happened last season at Everton, I would be happy to see them drop down


If PV was still at the helm Forest would be getting a very easy ride in the last game .

 

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YT Flag Oxford 05 May 23 7.48am Send a Private Message to YT Add YT as a friend

"Come on Brighton!" is all I can say. On Monday, I mean.

 


Palace since 19 August 1972. Palace 1 (Tony Taylor) Liverpool 1 (Emlyn Hughes)

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Nicholas91 Flag The Democratic Republic of Kent 05 May 23 8.39am Send a Private Message to Nicholas91 Add Nicholas91 as a friend

Originally posted by YT

"Come on Brighton!" is all I can say. On Monday, I mean.

Agreed and we shall never speak of it again!

 


Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!

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monkey Flag Sittingbourne,but made in Bromley 05 May 23 8.52am Send a Private Message to monkey Add monkey as a friend

Originally posted by YT

"Come on Brighton!" is all I can say. On Monday, I mean.

Agreed, but now go and wash your mouth out thoroughly, preferably with bleach

 

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YT Flag Oxford 05 May 23 9.05am Send a Private Message to YT Add YT as a friend

Originally posted by monkey

Agreed, but now go and wash your mouth out thoroughly, preferably with bleach

I know!

 


Palace since 19 August 1972. Palace 1 (Tony Taylor) Liverpool 1 (Emlyn Hughes)

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Goalpost1 Flag Worcester Park 05 May 23 9.06am Send a Private Message to Goalpost1 Add Goalpost1 as a friend

I'll join the bleach queue!

 

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