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Woman arrested for silent prayer, god save us

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HKOwen Flag Hong Kong 28 Dec 22 9.06am Send a Private Message to HKOwen Add HKOwen as a friend

How do you calculate the age of consent for dogs.......asking for a friend.

And may I tip my hat to the excellent and appropriate use of the word cavilling.

Edited by HKOwen (28 Dec 2022 9.07am)

 


Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.

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Mapletree Flag Croydon 28 Dec 22 9.26am Send a Private Message to Mapletree Add Mapletree as a friend

Originally posted by georgenorman

I have not misunderstood you continually stating that the purpose of the repressive legislation is to stop intimidation – just some of your cavilling against people standing silently in a public street: -

“Only those feeling intimidated can possibly know whether anyone doing anything is responsible for it. That the per-son standing silently doesn’t believe it intimidates is irrelevant.”
“Protecting the vulnerable from intimidation is never ridiculous. Thinking that those seeking help in an abortion clinic aren’t vulnerable to intimidation is ridiculous.”
“It has nothing to do with this issue though, where the concerns are obvious, as is the intimidation.”
“A user might well think that an innocent bystander is intimidating”

Of course discussion of abortion itself has a place in this thread. The fact that there are legally provided clinics for abortions does not make it less grubby and morally questionable, in the same way that a legal dispensary for drug addicts does not make drug taking less reprehensible. By the way, some left-wing ‘ethicists’, such as Dr. Peter Singer, argue that foetuses are neither rational nor self-aware and as a result, the preference of a mother to have an abortion automatically takes precedence. He also has said that young children have no automatic right to life and that it could be wholly ethical to terminate the life of a living, dependent child if it were disabled or even if its existence jeopardised the life chances of the mother. Singer argues that newborns lack the essential characteristics of personhood, “rationality, autonomy, and self-consciousness" and therefore "killing a newborn baby is never equivalent to killing a person, that is, a being who wants to go on living". (He has also argued that there is no moral reason why people should not have "mutually satisfying" sex with their pets.)

Deflection, distraction, irrelevant to the topic.

Focus on the point

Religious extremist breaks the law to try to intimidate often highly distressed people from pursuing their legal rights

The ethics of abortion have been debated thoroughly and are enshrined in legislation

Do you break the law every time you think you may not wholly agree with it? If so it would be interesting to see your criminal and driving record.

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards georgenorman Flag 28 Dec 22 10.13am Send a Private Message to georgenorman Add georgenorman as a friend

Originally posted by Mapletree

Deflection, distraction, irrelevant to the topic.

Focus on the point

Religious extremist breaks the law to try to intimidate often highly distressed people from pursuing their legal rights

The ethics of abortion have been debated thoroughly and are enshrined in legislation

Do you break the law every time you think you may not wholly agree with it? If so it would be interesting to see your criminal and driving record.

Deflection, distraction, irrelevant to the topic. I have been focused on the point that it is a bad, repressive law to arrest someone, religious or otherwise, for standing silently in a public street.

I don’t have any criminal convictions but do have 3 points on my diving licence for my car apparently travelling at a speed of 54 on a dual carriageway that, for no apparent reason, had a 50 mph limit instead of the usual 70 (perhaps I was causing someone distress or intimidating them).

 

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Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 28 Dec 22 1.01pm Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by georgenorman

I have not misunderstood you continually stating that the purpose of the repressive legislation is to stop intimidation – just some of your cavilling against people standing silently in a public street: -

“Only those feeling intimidated can possibly know whether anyone doing anything is responsible for it. That the person standing silently doesn’t believe it intimidates is irrelevant.”
“Protecting the vulnerable from intimidation is never ridiculous. Thinking that those seeking help in an abortion clinic aren’t vulnerable to intimidation is ridiculous.”
“It has nothing to do with this issue though, where the concerns are obvious, as is the intimidation.”
“A user might well think that an innocent bystander is intimidating”

Of course discussion of abortion itself has a place in this thread. The fact that there are legally provided clinics for abortions does not make it less grubby and morally questionable, in the same way that a legal dispensary for drug addicts does not make drug taking less reprehensible. By the way, some left-wing ‘ethicists’, such as Dr. Peter Singer, argue that foetuses are neither rational nor self-aware and as a result, the preference of a mother to have an abortion automatically takes precedence. He also has said that young children have no automatic right to life and that it could be wholly ethical to terminate the life of a living, dependent child if it were disabled or even if its existence jeopardised the life chances of the mother. Singer argues that newborns lack the essential characteristics of personhood, “rationality, autonomy, and self-consciousness" and therefore "killing a newborn baby is never equivalent to killing a person, that is, a being who wants to go on living". (He has also argued that there is no moral reason why people should not have "mutually satisfying" sex with their pets.)

Edited by georgenorman (28 Dec 2022 10.15am)

As you have received an accurate and succinct reply to this there is not a lot to add. You seem determined to either divert the discussion or avoid the point.

 


For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Teddy Eagle Flag 28 Dec 22 1.06pm Send a Private Message to Teddy Eagle Add Teddy Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Mapletree

Deflection, distraction, irrelevant to the topic.

Focus on the point

Religious extremist breaks the law to try to intimidate often highly distressed people from pursuing their legal rights

The ethics of abortion have been debated thoroughly and are enshrined in legislation

Do you break the law every time you think you may not wholly agree with it? If so it would be interesting to see your criminal and driving record.


It still hasn't been explained what intimidation was involved.

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards georgenorman Flag 28 Dec 22 1.15pm Send a Private Message to georgenorman Add georgenorman as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

As you have received an accurate and succinct reply to this there is not a lot to add. You seem determined to either divert the discussion or avoid the point.

Quite the opposite, it is you who wants to divert to avoid the reality of the repressive law and the increasingly morally dubious 'legal right' that it facilitates.

 

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PalazioVecchio Flag south pole 28 Dec 22 3.52pm Send a Private Message to PalazioVecchio Add PalazioVecchio as a friend

another christian arrested for praying in the street

[Link]

 


Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford

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chris123 Flag hove actually 28 Dec 22 4.03pm Send a Private Message to chris123 Add chris123 as a friend

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle


It still hasn't been explained what intimidation was involved.

Looks like these orders are issued in accordance with the Anti Social, Crime and Policing act 2014 and references acts that cause harassment, alarm or distress.

 

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Teddy Eagle Flag 28 Dec 22 4.15pm Send a Private Message to Teddy Eagle Add Teddy Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by chris123

Looks like these orders are issued in accordance with the Anti Social, Crime and Policing act 2014 and references acts that cause harassment, alarm or distress.

Yes but what about a lady praying constitutes harassment or causes alarm or distress?

 

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cryrst Flag The garden of England 28 Dec 22 5.29pm Send a Private Message to cryrst Add cryrst as a friend

Originally posted by PalazioVecchio

another christian arrested for praying in the street

[Link]

This was a year or so ago and I think he sued and won 2.5 k damages for wrongful arrest.

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards berlinpalace Flag berlin 28 Dec 22 7.01pm Send a Private Message to berlinpalace Add berlinpalace as a friend

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle


It still hasn't been explained what intimidation was involved.

OK, slowly, and hopefully for the last time. The reason these restrictions are in place is because several christian fundamentalist groups, one of which this particular woman is a member of, have been running a campaign where they regularly turn up in large numbers to protest on the doorsteps of facilities offering abortion services. These protests have included a whole range of behaviours such as silent praying, waving placards with pictures of bloody foetuses, screaming abuse and other forms of intimidation.
Given that the people who work there and the people who need these services would rather not run this gauntlet every day they have asked that the protests be moved from directly in front of their premises. As these fundamentalists cannot be trusted to behave themselves some local authorities have introduced measures whereby all of their methods of protest are banned from the immediate vicinity of the clinics.
Knowing all of this, and determined to be a martyr for the cause, this woman deliberately broke the law for the fourth time. It doesn't really matter what she was doing, she's a known activist and she knew all she had to do was stand there and she'd get her name in the papers.

 

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards georgenorman Flag 28 Dec 22 7.08pm Send a Private Message to georgenorman Add georgenorman as a friend

Originally posted by berlinpalace

OK, slowly, and hopefully for the last time. The reason these restrictions are in place is because several christian fundamentalist groups, one of which this particular woman is a member of, have been running a campaign where they regularly turn up in large numbers to protest on the doorsteps of facilities offering abortion services. These protests have included a whole range of behaviours such as silent praying, waving placards with pictures of bloody foetuses, screaming abuse and other forms of intimidation.
Given that the people who work there and the people who need these services would rather not run this gauntlet every day they have asked that the protests be moved from directly in front of their premises. As these fundamentalists cannot be trusted to behave themselves some local authorities have introduced measures whereby all of their methods of protest are banned from the immediate vicinity of the clinics.
Knowing all of this, and determined to be a martyr for the cause, this woman deliberately broke the law for the fourth time. It doesn't really matter what she was doing, she's a known activist and she knew all she had to do was stand there and she'd get her name in the papers.

Says it all really, you are arrested for doing nothing.

 

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