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  Hrolf The Ganger  08 Feb 20 10.56pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
I try never to waste my time, especially now it is running out fast. Whether I am actually learning very much here these days is a good question as I suspect we will all be treading water until November in the USA and December here. Until then I guess we will just more of the same alt right style moaning and groaning about anything remotely progressive. The number of times I read "lefties" being condemned for the world's problems always amuses, even though it makes me sad to think that so many are that prejudiced. I don't, by the way, include you in that criticism. You are always polite and respectful whilst disagreeing, even if a little sarcastic at times. I do though think we need to take things seriously. What we face isn't funny. The climate emergency is real yet we have the most powerful country on earth being led by a man intent on making things worse. We have the expectation of a substantial growth in the world's population, which raises many serious questions and no universally accepted answers. I am OK. It won't really impact me. So why do I care so much? Why not just go and have fun while I can? It's because I have kids, grandkids and one great granddaughter that I love. As well as a lovely wife who I expect to outlive me. I know my voice is insignificant but lots of insignificant voices together can make a lot of noise. And at least I have tried. People like you are responsible for the mess we are in now. Full of idealism and totally lacking foresight or wisdom.
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 becky over the moon 09 Feb 20 8.27am |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
I try never to waste my time, especially now it is running out fast. Whether I am actually learning very much here these days is a good question as I suspect we will all be treading water until November in the USA and December here. Until then I guess we will just more of the same alt right style moaning and groaning about anything remotely progressive. The number of times I read "lefties" being condemned for the world's problems always amuses, even though it makes me sad to think that so many are that prejudiced. I don't, by the way, include you in that criticism. You are always polite and respectful whilst disagreeing, even if a little sarcastic at times. I do though think we need to take things seriously. What we face isn't funny. The climate emergency is real yet we have the most powerful country on earth being led by a man intent on making things worse. We have the expectation of a substantial growth in the world's population, which raises many serious questions and no universally accepted answers. I know my voice is insignificant but lots of insignificant voices together can make a lot of noise. And at least I have tried. See....... you are part of the problem.
A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers |
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| Stirlingsays 09 Feb 20 8.33am |
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Originally posted by becky
See....... you are part of the problem. His beliefs and ideologies certainly are. A frigging wind up merchant looking for reactions. Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Feb 2020 8.34am)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 09 Feb 20 8.35am |
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Originally posted by becky
See....... you are part of the problem. It's this smart arse type of remark which belies attitudes which are part of the problem. The birthrate in the UK is not the problem. I have 2 daughters, 4 grandchildren and 1 grandchild at the moment. I haven't contributed to any growth in the population have I?
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Stirlingsays 09 Feb 20 8.38am |
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No son to carry on the name. A small, if petty victory, for a certain demographic.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| becky over the moon 09 Feb 20 8.45am |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
It's this smart arse type of remark which belies attitudes which are part of the problem. The birthrate in the UK is not the problem. I have 2 daughters, 4 grandchildren and 1 grandchild at the moment. I haven't contributed to any growth in the population have I? Maths not your strong point then....there are now 7 more people on the planet than when you and your wife started. It's not a 'smart arse' answer - it's a factual comment on people who are actually 'part of the problem' but won't acknowledge it. Whether it's UK birth rate or anywhere else is irrelevant - population growth is population growth.
A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers |
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 09 Feb 20 8.58am |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
People like you are responsible for the mess we are in now. Full of idealism and totally lacking foresight or wisdom. What on earth is wrong with imagining the ideal solutions to problems? Everyone understands that realism demands that pragmatism and compromise are also needed but identifying what result would yield the maximum benefit is hardly a waste of effort is it? Ignoring climate change in favour of short term economic goals, has to be the most striking example of a lack of foresight or wisdom I have witnessed in my lifetime. Believing that our country's future, in today's challenging world, is going to be better outside of the EU rather than as part of it, also shows a lack of foresight and wisdom. Of course you won't agree, and who is correct won't be known for a few years yet, but I can assure you I wouldn't bet much on your position. What we are doing is a huge gamble and I don't like taking gambles with my kid's futures.
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 09 Feb 20 9.10am |
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Originally posted by becky
Maths not your strong point then....there are now 7 more people on the planet than when you and your wife started. It's not a 'smart arse' answer - it's a factual comment on people who are actually 'part of the problem' but won't acknowledge it. Whether it's UK birth rate or anywhere else is irrelevant - population growth is population growth. It seems to me that it's you who need to go back to school! There are couples involved in producing children! So I have replaced just one, as my wife replaced the other. Both of them have had 2 children too, so one each for them and their husbands. Eventually all will die so my replacement levels are precisely balanced. The issue which complicates things is increasing longevity and not replacement. I have not personally contributed to population growth at all.
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| becky over the moon 09 Feb 20 10.50am |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
It seems to me that it's you who need to go back to school! There are couples involved in producing children! So I have replaced just one, as my wife replaced the other. Both of them have had 2 children too, so one each for them and their husbands. Eventually all will die so my replacement levels are precisely balanced. The issue which complicates things is increasing longevity and not replacement. I have not personally contributed to population growth at all. If you say so ......
A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers |
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| Hrolf The Ganger 09 Feb 20 11.06am |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
What on earth is wrong with imagining the ideal solutions to problems? Everyone understands that realism demands that pragmatism and compromise are also needed but identifying what result would yield the maximum benefit is hardly a waste of effort is it? Ignoring climate change in favour of short term economic goals, has to be the most striking example of a lack of foresight or wisdom I have witnessed in my lifetime. Believing that our country's future, in today's challenging world, is going to be better outside of the EU rather than as part of it, also shows a lack of foresight and wisdom. Of course you won't agree, and who is correct won't be known for a few years yet, but I can assure you I wouldn't bet much on your position. What we are doing is a huge gamble and I don't like taking gambles with my kid's futures. There is no gamble. There is making a choice to leave which will lead to a number of eventualities just the same as choosing to remain. That is what your kind and their decision making have brought us to. Then they talked about increasing traffic problems. And what was the solution from Rory Stewart, the man hoping to run for mayor? Get people to walk more and plant lots of trees. Oh dear me. Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (09 Feb 2020 11.07am)
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 09 Feb 20 12.38pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
There is no gamble. There is making a choice to leave which will lead to a number of eventualities just the same as choosing to remain. That is what your kind and their decision making have brought us to. Then they talked about increasing traffic problems. And what was the solution from Rory Stewart, the man hoping to run for mayor? Get people to walk more and plant lots of trees. Oh dear me. Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (09 Feb 2020 11.07am) Of course it's a gamble. Every step down an uncertain road is one. The question is which was the bigger gamble. Staying where we were and trying to make it better or plunging into the unknown and untested in the hope it might be better. The problem I always saw was the unrealistic idea that we could return to where we used to be whilst the world has moved on rather a long way since then. I half saw that programme too as it was on in the room whilst I was otherwise occupied so I did not pay full attention. I fully get the issue about the problems associated with the radicalisation of prisoners and how challenging this must be. Modern slavery seems to be a growing issue everywhere but I wonder if it is more that we have just become aware of it, or have redefined it, rather than it actually growing. It's a problem in many major cities and not just London. Immigration in 2020 is a fact of life. How it's managed is another matter but we all need to get used to it. It's not just a one way street either. I was an immigrant for a while until I returned to the UK. That's the world we now live in.
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 09 Feb 20 12.48pm |
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Originally posted by becky
If you say so ...... You also fail to consider that both my parents, my wife's parents and those of one of my sons in law have all died. Families are a continuum, We have only replaced ours. It's countries with high birth rates combined with the increases in life expectancy that are causing the trend. A trend that is expected to fallen out by 2100. We just need to get there safely.
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