Anti immigration parties on the rise

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Anti immigration parties on the rise

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Stirlingsays 03 Sep 15 5.39pm
Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.23pm Hopefully a Syrian family will move next door to you. They can tell you how they've literally made life and death choices to secure the future of their family, and you can impress them how many arm pit farts you can do ... while pontificating about their worth as human beings of course. Yawn. All human beings are equal in worth but that is different from saying that I'm responsible for them. Just like you are responsible for your children and not my children. So you tired out narrative only really works in your head because the demonization that you make is a caricature of a belief system you won't ever really understand. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

03 Sep 15 5.39pm

Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.23pm

Hopefully a Syrian family will move next door to you. They can tell you how they've literally made life and death choices to secure the future of their family, and you can impress them how many arm pit farts you can do ... while pontificating about their worth as human beings of course.

Yawn.

All human beings are equal in worth but that is different from saying that I'm responsible for them.

Just like you are responsible for your children and not my children.

So you tired out narrative only really works in your head because the demonization that you make is a caricature of a belief system you won't ever really understand.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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oldcodger 03 Sep 15 5.45pm
Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.39pm Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.23pm Hopefully a Syrian family will move next door to you. They can tell you how they've literally made life and death choices to secure the future of their family, and you can impress them how many arm pit farts you can do ... while pontificating about their worth as human beings of course. Yawn. All human beings are equal in worth but that is different from saying that I'm responsible for them. Just like you are responsible for your children and not my children. So you tired out narrative only really works in your head because the demonization that you make is a caricature of a belief system you won't ever really understand. You're the one who says you doubt their worth unless they stay in Syria, not me. You're arguing with yourself you plum.
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oldcodger

03 Sep 15 5.45pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.39pm

Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.23pm

Yawn.

All human beings are equal in worth but that is different from saying that I'm responsible for them.

Just like you are responsible for your children and not my children.

So you tired out narrative only really works in your head because the demonization that you make is a caricature of a belief system you won't ever really understand.

You're the one who says you doubt their worth unless they stay in Syria, not me. You're arguing with yourself you plum.

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dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 03 Sep 15 5.52pm
Quote nickgusset at 03 Sep 2015 5.22pm Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.17pm Quote dannyh at 03 Sep 2015 2.53pm No more of a joke than your opinion, no one said it was an easy choice to make, but make it they did. How do you think WW2 would have panned out if it weren’t for the French resistance? Hunted down and shot on sight, and that was the lucky ones, did they flee their own country ? nope they stayed and fought. I’m just saying there are two view points not just yours. I'm not saying it's not a s***ty situation to be in, nor am I dehumanising people (love to know how you worked that out) but is gathering up your family and getting on a dodgy tub and trusting your luck (and life) to a dodgy pirate any better than staying put ? Jamie made a good point, there are over a million refugees in bordering countries, what if they got together and tackled ISIS a million strong is bigger than our Army ten times over ! It would seem that when a country destabilises in the Middle Eastern part of the globe, Europe has to carry the can for it? I don't recall many Syrians risking life and limb to get to Britain during the Blitz to help us out, in fact we had to draw upon common wealth countries to keep our necks out of the brown stuff, Syria and the Middle East not so much. And as for you accusation that "our bad decision making as nations we have done more to help the ISIS of today come into being" is utterly wrong and as daft as saying it was Poland’s fault Hitler invaded for having to many Jews. ISIS are a fanatical bunch of loons we've always had them bleating on about hard done by this, and Allah that, HAMAS in 1986 proceeded by the Muslim Brother hood formed 1928, I could go on, but it's always been there. Seconded. Is that the same HAMAS that Israel were proactive in setting up? No they were not Nick as well you know, we've already done conspiracy theories this week "It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"
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dannyh

wherever I lay my hat....... 03 Sep 15 5.52pm

Quote nickgusset at 03 Sep 2015 5.22pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.17pm

Quote dannyh at 03 Sep 2015 2.53pm

No more of a joke than your opinion, no one said it was an easy choice to make, but make it they did. How do you think WW2 would have panned out if it weren’t for the French resistance? Hunted down and shot on sight, and that was the lucky ones, did they flee their own country ? nope they stayed and fought. I’m just saying there are two view points not just yours.

I'm not saying it's not a s***ty situation to be in, nor am I dehumanising people (love to know how you worked that out) but is gathering up your family and getting on a dodgy tub and trusting your luck (and life) to a dodgy pirate any better than staying put ?

Jamie made a good point, there are over a million refugees in bordering countries, what if they got together and tackled ISIS a million strong is bigger than our Army ten times over !

It would seem that when a country destabilises in the Middle Eastern part of the globe, Europe has to carry the can for it? I don't recall many Syrians risking life and limb to get to Britain during the Blitz to help us out, in fact we had to draw upon common wealth countries to keep our necks out of the brown stuff, Syria and the Middle East not so much.

And as for you accusation that "our bad decision making as nations we have done more to help the ISIS of today come into being" is utterly wrong and as daft as saying it was Poland’s fault Hitler invaded for having to many Jews.

ISIS are a fanatical bunch of loons we've always had them bleating on about hard done by this, and Allah that, HAMAS in 1986 proceeded by the Muslim Brother hood formed 1928, I could go on, but it's always been there.

Seconded.

Is that the same HAMAS that Israel were proactive in setting up?

No they were not Nick as well you know, we've already done conspiracy theories this week

"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

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Hrolf The Ganger 03 Sep 15 5.53pm
Quote nickgusset at 03 Sep 2015 5.18pm Quote Hrolf The Ganger at 03 Sep 2015 5.04pm Quote jamiemartin721 at 03 Sep 2015 3.40pm Quote Hrolf The Ganger at 03 Sep 2015 2.26pm Quote jamiemartin721 at 03 Sep 2015 1.21pm Ironically, UKIP Nige seems to think we should be taking in more Syrian Refugees, and has called on the Prime Minister to do so. We should never confuse immigration with Asylum. A key point. Their needs to be a better processing of migrants/refugees. Those that really need help should be prioritised. One of the problems with this is that we are bound by rules that say we must allow free movement from European countries and have also had large numbers of economic migrants arriving from elsewhere. This means that, to many, refugees seem like they are adding to a growing problem rather than being seen as victims and statistically insignificant. They are being demonised because of years of excessive, poorly managed immigration which has turned a large number of the voting public against it. Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (03 Sep 2015 2.26pm) A valid point of course is that had we not agreed to the EU right to work, taking in a large number of refugees wouldn't be an issue. Problem of course is that the driver behind the EU working laws, was corporate interests, who were sponsors of both the Conservative and Labour party of the time, so there never was a chance of us not signing up. Exactly. One wonders if the average man's standard of living has benefited as much as commerce and finance. It's hard to say, however it is likely that the already rich have benefited a lot more and that the average man was not the first thing on their minds. Altruism is unlikely to be a factor in any of this I'm afraid. But all the cash trickles down Doesn't it? Well apparently it does and the World is generally better off, apparently. I can only make my own observations based on my personal experience. I am not qualified beyond that.
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Hrolf The Ganger

03 Sep 15 5.53pm

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Quote nickgusset at 03 Sep 2015 5.18pm

Quote Hrolf The Ganger at 03 Sep 2015 5.04pm

Quote jamiemartin721 at 03 Sep 2015 3.40pm

Quote Hrolf The Ganger at 03 Sep 2015 2.26pm

Quote jamiemartin721 at 03 Sep 2015 1.21pm

Ironically, UKIP Nige seems to think we should be taking in more Syrian Refugees, and has called on the Prime Minister to do so.

We should never confuse immigration with Asylum.

A key point. Their needs to be a better processing of migrants/refugees. Those that really need help should be prioritised.
One of the problems with this is that we are bound by rules that say we must allow free movement from European countries and have also had large numbers of economic migrants arriving from elsewhere. This means that, to many, refugees seem like they are adding to a growing problem rather than being seen as victims and statistically insignificant.
They are being demonised because of years of excessive, poorly managed immigration which has turned a large number of the voting public against it.

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (03 Sep 2015 2.26pm)

A valid point of course is that had we not agreed to the EU right to work, taking in a large number of refugees wouldn't be an issue.

Problem of course is that the driver behind the EU working laws, was corporate interests, who were sponsors of both the Conservative and Labour party of the time, so there never was a chance of us not signing up.

Exactly.

One wonders if the average man's standard of living has benefited as much as commerce and finance. It's hard to say, however it is likely that the already rich have benefited a lot more and that the average man was not the first thing on their minds.

Altruism is unlikely to be a factor in any of this I'm afraid.

But all the cash trickles down Doesn't it?

Well apparently it does and the World is generally better off, apparently.
I can only make my own observations based on my personal experience. I am not qualified beyond that.

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Stirlingsays 03 Sep 15 5.55pm
Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.45pm You're the one who says you doubt their worth unless they stay in Syria, not me. You're arguing with yourself you plum. Again, you obviously don't understand an opposition argument. People are 'born' equal in worth.. What people became as adults.....Well.....Are you arguing that someone fighting for IS is equal in worth to an NHS nurse? I think when it comes to plums....You must be supplying a supermarket. Edited by Stirlingsays (03 Sep 2015 5.56pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

03 Sep 15 5.55pm

Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.45pm

You're the one who says you doubt their worth unless they stay in Syria, not me. You're arguing with yourself you plum.

Again, you obviously don't understand an opposition argument.

People are 'born' equal in worth..

What people became as adults.....Well.....Are you arguing that someone fighting for IS is equal in worth to an NHS nurse?

I think when it comes to plums....You must be supplying a supermarket.

Edited by Stirlingsays (03 Sep 2015 5.56pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 03 Sep 15 5.56pm
Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.39pm Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.23pm Hopefully a Syrian family will move next door to you. They can tell you how they've literally made life and death choices to secure the future of their family, and you can impress them how many arm pit farts you can do ... while pontificating about their worth as human beings of course. Yawn. All human beings are equal in worth but that is different from saying that I'm responsible for them. Just like you are responsible for your children and not my children. So you tired out narrative only really works in your head because the demonization that you make is a caricature of a belief system you won't ever really understand. Fairs fare that is literally the funniest sentence ever written on these hallowed boards. The rest of it is pure cobblers, but that is commedy gold, pissing myself here. "It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"
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dannyh

wherever I lay my hat....... 03 Sep 15 5.56pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.39pm

Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.23pm

Hopefully a Syrian family will move next door to you. They can tell you how they've literally made life and death choices to secure the future of their family, and you can impress them how many arm pit farts you can do ... while pontificating about their worth as human beings of course.

Yawn.

All human beings are equal in worth but that is different from saying that I'm responsible for them.

Just like you are responsible for your children and not my children.

So you tired out narrative only really works in your head because the demonization that you make is a caricature of a belief system you won't ever really understand.

Fairs fare that is literally the funniest sentence ever written on these hallowed boards.

The rest of it is pure cobblers, but that is commedy gold, pissing myself here.

"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

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DanH SW2 03 Sep 15 5.57pm
Quote dannyh at 03 Sep 2015 5.56pm Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.39pm Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.23pm Hopefully a Syrian family will move next door to you. They can tell you how they've literally made life and death choices to secure the future of their family, and you can impress them how many arm pit farts you can do ... while pontificating about their worth as human beings of course. Yawn. All human beings are equal in worth but that is different from saying that I'm responsible for them. Just like you are responsible for your children and not my children. So you tired out narrative only really works in your head because the demonization that you make is a caricature of a belief system you won't ever really understand. Fairs fare that is literally the funniest sentence ever written on these hallowed boards. The rest of it is pure cobblers, but that is commedy gold, pissing myself here. How many can you do out of interest Stirling?
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DanH

SW2 03 Sep 15 5.57pm

Quote dannyh at 03 Sep 2015 5.56pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.39pm

Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.23pm

Yawn.

All human beings are equal in worth but that is different from saying that I'm responsible for them.

Just like you are responsible for your children and not my children.

So you tired out narrative only really works in your head because the demonization that you make is a caricature of a belief system you won't ever really understand.

Fairs fare that is literally the funniest sentence ever written on these hallowed boards.

The rest of it is pure cobblers, but that is commedy gold, pissing myself here.

How many can you do out of interest Stirling?

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dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 03 Sep 15 5.58pm
Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.55pm Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.45pm You're the one who says you doubt their worth unless they stay in Syria, not me. You're arguing with yourself you plum. Again, you obviously don't understand an opposition argument. People are 'born' equal in worth.. What people became as adults.....Well.....Are you arguing that someone fighting for IS is equal in worth to an NHS nurse? I think when it comes to plums....You must be supplying a supermarket. Edited by Stirlingsays (03 Sep 2015 5.56pm) Old hairy ones ? "It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"
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dannyh

wherever I lay my hat....... 03 Sep 15 5.58pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.55pm

Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.45pm

You're the one who says you doubt their worth unless they stay in Syria, not me. You're arguing with yourself you plum.

Again, you obviously don't understand an opposition argument.

People are 'born' equal in worth..

What people became as adults.....Well.....Are you arguing that someone fighting for IS is equal in worth to an NHS nurse?

I think when it comes to plums....You must be supplying a supermarket.

Edited by Stirlingsays (03 Sep 2015 5.56pm)

Old hairy ones ?

"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

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oldcodger 03 Sep 15 6.01pm
Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.55pm Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.45pm You're the one who says you doubt their worth unless they stay in Syria, not me. You're arguing with yourself you plum. Again, you obviously don't understand an opposition argument. People are 'born' equal in worth.. What people became as adults.....Well.....Are you arguing that someone fighting for IS is equal in worth to an NHS nurse? I think when it comes to plums....You must be supplying a supermarket. Edited by Stirlingsays (03 Sep 2015 5.56pm) You're very confused. First you state that those leaving Syria have less worth as people because they didn't stay and defend their country. Then completely unprompted you feel the need to tell me that "you are responsible for your children and not my children." Either you feel some responsibility towards those in your country or you don't. With your all over the shop approach I'm not sure why you'd wish to write off others who decide to put their family first and get out of a dangerous situation. Edited by oldcodger (03 Sep 2015 6.04pm)
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oldcodger

03 Sep 15 6.01pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.55pm

Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.45pm

You're the one who says you doubt their worth unless they stay in Syria, not me. You're arguing with yourself you plum.

Again, you obviously don't understand an opposition argument.

People are 'born' equal in worth..

What people became as adults.....Well.....Are you arguing that someone fighting for IS is equal in worth to an NHS nurse?

I think when it comes to plums....You must be supplying a supermarket.

Edited by Stirlingsays (03 Sep 2015 5.56pm)

You're very confused. First you state that those leaving Syria have less worth as people because they didn't stay and defend their country. Then completely unprompted you feel the need to tell me that "you are responsible for your children and not my children."

Either you feel some responsibility towards those in your country or you don't. With your all over the shop approach I'm not sure why you'd wish to write off others who decide to put their family first and get out of a dangerous situation.

Edited by oldcodger (03 Sep 2015 6.04pm)

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Stirlingsays 03 Sep 15 6.01pm
Quote DanH at 03 Sep 2015 5.57pm How many can you do out of interest Stirling? None out of the arm pit.....But my natural ones are in of themselves a thing of wonder. Edited by Stirlingsays (03 Sep 2015 6.01pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

03 Sep 15 6.01pm

Quote DanH at 03 Sep 2015 5.57pm

How many can you do out of interest Stirling?

None out of the arm pit.....But my natural ones are in of themselves a thing of wonder.

Edited by Stirlingsays (03 Sep 2015 6.01pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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oldcodger 03 Sep 15 6.03pm
Quote dannyh at 03 Sep 2015 5.58pm Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.55pm Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.45pm You're the one who says you doubt their worth unless they stay in Syria, not me. You're arguing with yourself you plum. Again, you obviously don't understand an opposition argument. People are 'born' equal in worth.. What people became as adults.....Well.....Are you arguing that someone fighting for IS is equal in worth to an NHS nurse? I think when it comes to plums....You must be supplying a supermarket. Edited by Stirlingsays (03 Sep 2015 5.56pm) Old hairy ones ? Don't forget purple.
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oldcodger

03 Sep 15 6.03pm

Quote dannyh at 03 Sep 2015 5.58pm

Quote Stirlingsays at 03 Sep 2015 5.55pm

Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 5.45pm

You're the one who says you doubt their worth unless they stay in Syria, not me. You're arguing with yourself you plum.

Again, you obviously don't understand an opposition argument.

People are 'born' equal in worth..

What people became as adults.....Well.....Are you arguing that someone fighting for IS is equal in worth to an NHS nurse?

I think when it comes to plums....You must be supplying a supermarket.

Edited by Stirlingsays (03 Sep 2015 5.56pm)

Old hairy ones ?

Don't forget purple.

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Stirlingsays 03 Sep 15 6.04pm
Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 6.01pm You're very confused. First you state that those leaving Syria have less worth as people because they didn't stay and defend their country. Then completely unprompted you feel the need to tell me that "you are responsible for your children and not my children." Either you feel responsibility towards those in your country of you don't. With your all over the shop approach I'm not sure why you'd wish to write off others who decide to put their family first and get out of a dangerous situation. You are just inventing straw man caricatures of what I said. For anyone wishing to go over the actual posts rather than your deliberately myopic summary they will see just how you operate. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

03 Sep 15 6.04pm

Quote oldcodger at 03 Sep 2015 6.01pm

Either you feel responsibility towards those in your country of you don't. With your all over the shop approach I'm not sure why you'd wish to write off others who decide to put their family first and get out of a dangerous situation.

You are just inventing straw man caricatures of what I said.

For anyone wishing to go over the actual posts rather than your deliberately myopic summary they will see just how you operate.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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