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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 06 Jul 24 8.45pm | |
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Originally posted by Badger11
A couple of random thoughts from the fall out. 1. I must admit I was surprised by the number of Lib Dem Mps I don't think they have a good leader or even coherent policies but obviously many people do. 2. The Greens are celebrating their 4 MPs but this is one I called right. On the various environmental threads I have previously said the Greens never get more than 7% of the vote and I was bang on. So although they have done better this time with their MPs they did not increase their share of the vote. 3. I think the Tories still do not understand what has happened. Plenty of talk about needing a leader to retake the centre ground from Labour, they just don't get it. It would not surprise me if they elect a new leader in the same mould as the last 4/5 . Perhaps it will take another whooping at the polls before they finally wake up and realise the answer is not to be a pale copy of labour but to have their own policies.
I rather think all those who seem to think that the Party turning right is what is required just don’t get it. It would finish the Tories. Any major party has to hold the centre or it is destined to become a minor party. There is now a minor party of the right. There is no room for another.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 06 Jul 24 8.55pm | |
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Originally posted by JRW2
You may have seen an article in today's Guardian by Peter Jenkins in which he argues that Sunak's most crucial task before stepping down is, "by whatever means he can", to return selection of leader to MPs. I agree. The purple-rinse ladies can be relied on to go for someone unsuitable. It was after Conservative MPs had had Ian Duncan Smith foisted on them as leader that they decided to change the rules. Another change is needed. I haven’t seen it but I think the sentiment is correct. Just as Biden’s primary task in the USA is to ensure Trump is denied a second term, Sunak’s last task is to ensure the Party doesn’t evaporate in the mists on the right. Making sure the MPs choose their own leader is essential.
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cryrst The garden of England 06 Jul 24 9.01pm | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
I rather think all those who seem to think that the Party turning right is what is required just don’t get it. It would finish the Tories. Any major party has to hold the centre or it is destined to become a minor party. There is now a minor party of the right. There is no room for another. You must have an aversion to reality. Politics on the right of centre doesn’t include goose stepping or wearing an iron cross. It simply is a different type of politics which doesn’t attempt to create a society of needy individuals. Look to the blue cities to see what the dems have done with their centre left ideals. Millions of people totally reliant on the state for their existence. Kinda sick don’t you think.
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Stirlingsays 06 Jul 24 9.01pm | |
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Not sure why there is talk of the US election on this thread but ok, I'll make the following observations. Trump was better for America and the economy is the evidence.....Before Covid America was doing well. Since Biden its future is looking much worse.....his home and foreign policy are a disaster. Neither of these two should be running and in a society where meritocracy carried more weight....as in the past...they wouldn't. That's neo/social liberalism in action. Given a fair fight Trump wins this election and the idea that Biden is better is nothing but TDS. Edited by Stirlingsays (06 Jul 2024 9.02pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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Stirlingsays 06 Jul 24 9.07pm | |
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Originally posted by cryrst
You must have an aversion to reality. Politics on the right of centre doesn’t include goose stepping or wearing an iron cross. It simply is a different type of politics which doesn’t attempt to create a society of needy individuals. Look to the blue cities to see what the dems have done with their centre left ideals. Millions of people totally reliant on the state for their existence. Kinda sick don’t you think. He's just wrong, looking back at most of his predictions on this site you find that a blind man throwing darts at a dartboard is more accurate than him. Still waiting for Mitt Romney to lead the GOP....talk about not knowing anything about the topic.....It's the same here....He thinks that a declining economy will still embrace centralism when it's been centralism that provided the decline. He can only think in terms of what is best for him....He's tone deaf to why the reality for most means that his ideas don't work.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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becky over the moon 06 Jul 24 9.36pm | |
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Originally posted by Spiderman
Welcome to our new “bright spark” Foreign Secretary. Heaven help us Ah, that would be the sam 'bright spark' who thinks that men can take 'hormones and thing' and grow a cervix. Biology not his strong point either......... and we thought Diane Abbott was bad
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Teddy Eagle 06 Jul 24 10.04pm | |
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Originally posted by becky
Ah, that would be the sam 'bright spark' who thinks that men can take 'hormones and thing' and grow a cervix. Biology not his strong point either......... and we thought Diane Abbott was bad From his appearance on Celebrity Mastermind neither is history - Or catering. He is the gift that never stops being given back.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 06 Jul 24 10.54pm | |
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The idea that Trump fights fairly made me laugh out loud, given all the efforts he is making to avoid justice, but as it doesn’t belong here I will leave it. It was only introduced as a comparable to the need that Sunak has to ensure populism doesn’t succeed. If you feel driven by a genuine love of country it’s what you do.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 06 Jul 24 11.15pm | |
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Originally posted by cryrst
You must have an aversion to reality. Politics on the right of centre doesn’t include goose stepping or wearing an iron cross. It simply is a different type of politics which doesn’t attempt to create a society of needy individuals. Look to the blue cities to see what the dems have done with their centre left ideals. Millions of people totally reliant on the state for their existence. Kinda sick don’t you think. Whoever suggested it did? Reform is not though just a right of centre party. The Tories are exactly that. A centre right party. Reform are a populist party. Farage is a populist. He’s not a favourite of Trump by accident. Which though does nothing for him here, as Trump is very unpopular everywhere in the UK, with the exception of these pages it seems. Farage tells people on the right what they want to hear and makes stupid, unrealistic suggestions as “policy”. Like returning the small boats to France! That’s not reality. It’s populist day dreaming. They don’t actually have any policies. They have a wish list of fairy tales, which anyone could script write in half an hour. Dealing with welfare dependency needs planning in a whole bunch of interdependent areas. It certainly needs doing, no question about that, but it needs much more than just scribbling “we will eliminate welfare dependency” on the back of an envelope. Farage and Reform are not serious political entities. They are disrupters. The Tories need to distance themselves as far as possible from them.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 06 Jul 24 11.33pm | |
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Anyone who has any knowledge of my beliefs will know that my approach has nothing at all to do with “what’s best for me”. I know I am fortunate. I have had a successful business career before setting my own enterprises. I worked hard and smartly, was a responsible and caring employer, and now have enough for a comfortable retirement. I support the prospect of people like me bearing a higher tax burden. I also support making sure everyone who is fit enough contributes to society, either through paid work or voluntary support for others. Not necessarily many hours a week, but enough to make a difference. No one at all, other than the very elderly or infirm, should just sit in front of the TV or a key board all day. If people need help, then they should give it. If anyone relies on benefits then they need to earn those benefits. No free passes. Is that right wing? It certainly isn’t populist though! It is though common sense.
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HKOwen Hong Kong 06 Jul 24 11.41pm | |
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Originally posted by Matov
The Tories lose people like us then it is game over. Their only chance to ever making a come back is if they recognise this and act accordingly. I suspect the people on the ground such as Wilo understand this but, and I say this with all respect, they seem to be treated with more contempt by Conservative Central Office then anybody else. With the removal of Liz Truss, for whom the Conservative membership voted for, in favour of Sunak, who they did not, concrete proof of that. " people like you ". you have been told by the font of arrogance
Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance. |
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eaglesdare 06 Jul 24 11.59pm | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
Anyone who has any knowledge of my beliefs will know that my approach has nothing at all to do with “what’s best for me”. I know I am fortunate. I have had a successful business career before setting my own enterprises. I worked hard and smartly, was a responsible and caring employer, and now have enough for a comfortable retirement. I support the prospect of people like me bearing a higher tax burden. I also support making sure everyone who is fit enough contributes to society, either through paid work or voluntary support for others. Not necessarily many hours a week, but enough to make a difference. No one at all, other than the very elderly or infirm, should just sit in front of the TV or a key board all day. If people need help, then they should give it. If anyone relies on benefits then they need to earn those benefits. No free passes. Is that right wing? It certainly isn’t populist though! It is though common sense. Feels weird agreeing with one of your posts.
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