Greece on the Edge

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Stuk Top half 06 Jul 15 2.27pm
Quote serial thriller at 06 Jul 2015 2.08pm Quote chris123 at 06 Jul 2015 1.57pm Quote serial thriller at 06 Jul 2015 1.38pm Quote Hoof Hearted at 06 Jul 2015 12.25pm Quote chris123 at 06 Jul 2015 12.22pm Quote Hoof Hearted at 06 Jul 2015 12.19pm [Link] Greece wasted most of their money... the above article shows the utter waste of Billions invested in Olympic stadia and infrastructure. I can't find the article but I read about the incompetence and wastefulness of the Athens Metro (light rail system). Overpaying cleaners and ticket inspectors who don't even turn up for work and people not paying to use the system, so it runs at a huge loss. Stop making excuses for these people and stop blaming the banks. The Greeks have created their own financial sh1tstorm, now they must ride it out. [Link] Thanks Chris.... What a joke....... defend that left thinking people! Of the money the Troika has lent Greece, only 10% of it has actually gone to the public sector and the government. 90% of it has gone to private banks, so the idea that this has been caused by public sector malpractice is a total myth. As an example, the cost of the 2004 Olympics to the Greek state was around 9 billion euros: Greece's debt is nearing 400 billion, so blaming the cost of the Olympics is ludicrous. Obviously such debt accumulation could only be tolerated by a corrupt, dynastic government, and certainly that was the case with Pasok and New Democracy. But the real causes of Greek debt levels come from the 2007 crisis, and the idiocy of the EU and private banks in supporting a nation embroiled in a suffocating singular currency with loans they were never going to be able to pay back. For them to now come back demanding repayment is not only undemocratic (as the result yesterday showed), it's a bit like feeding your kid KFC every meal of their life and then complaining that they're overweight. The problem you have, Hoof, is you seem so blinded by your hatred for 'the left' that you are willing to defend some of the most shady, disreputable organisations in the world based on very little evidence, just to have a pop at people like myself. But look over this thread: even people like Stirling and WAGU, staunch adherents to right wing politics normally, can see how f*ed over the people of Greece have been here. It isn't a case of right vs left, it's people vs corporations. You're blinded - the banks that were bailed out were Greek banks. Our banks all took a huge haircut. Greek private banks. What happened is the same thing on a bigger scale as what happened across Europe after 2007: profit was privatised, while risk was nationalised. The Greek banks which accepted loans from German and French private banks were allowed to continue running on Troika handouts, while the money lost was recouped through public sector cuts, leading to high unemployment, a wage contraction of 25% and massive cuts to pensions etc. All of a sudden those same people vote in a government who promises to act in their interests and the EU, lead by Germany, kick up a massive fuss. Suddenly you see people like the German finance minister saying he can't work with a democratically elected minister in Tsipras, while Varoufakis is seemingly forced out. It's an insult to democracy and shows out austerity as a total scam. So please tell me, how exactly am I blinded? Because it's still Greek. Lend them money, they moan. Don't lend them money, they moan. Writing off their debt and letting them carry on the same is the worst outcome of all, every s*ty economy in the world would do the same. Optimistic as ever
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Stuk

Top half 06 Jul 15 2.27pm

Quote serial thriller at 06 Jul 2015 2.08pm

Quote chris123 at 06 Jul 2015 1.57pm

Quote serial thriller at 06 Jul 2015 1.38pm

Quote Hoof Hearted at 06 Jul 2015 12.25pm

Quote chris123 at 06 Jul 2015 12.22pm

Quote Hoof Hearted at 06 Jul 2015 12.19pm

[Link]

Greece wasted most of their money... the above article shows the utter waste of Billions invested in Olympic stadia and infrastructure.

I can't find the article but I read about the incompetence and wastefulness of the Athens Metro (light rail system). Overpaying cleaners and ticket inspectors who don't even turn up for work and people not paying to use the system, so it runs at a huge loss.

Stop making excuses for these people and stop blaming the banks.

The Greeks have created their own financial sh1tstorm, now they must ride it out.

[Link]

Thanks Chris....

What a joke....... defend that left thinking people!

Of the money the Troika has lent Greece, only 10% of it has actually gone to the public sector and the government. 90% of it has gone to private banks, so the idea that this has been caused by public sector malpractice is a total myth. As an example, the cost of the 2004 Olympics to the Greek state was around 9 billion euros: Greece's debt is nearing 400 billion, so blaming the cost of the Olympics is ludicrous.

Obviously such debt accumulation could only be tolerated by a corrupt, dynastic government, and certainly that was the case with Pasok and New Democracy. But the real causes of Greek debt levels come from the 2007 crisis, and the idiocy of the EU and private banks in supporting a nation embroiled in a suffocating singular currency with loans they were never going to be able to pay back. For them to now come back demanding repayment is not only undemocratic (as the result yesterday showed), it's a bit like feeding your kid KFC every meal of their life and then complaining that they're overweight.

The problem you have, Hoof, is you seem so blinded by your hatred for 'the left' that you are willing to defend some of the most shady, disreputable organisations in the world based on very little evidence, just to have a pop at people like myself. But look over this thread: even people like Stirling and WAGU, staunch adherents to right wing politics normally, can see how f***ed over the people of Greece have been here. It isn't a case of right vs left, it's people vs corporations.

You're blinded - the banks that were bailed out were Greek banks. Our banks all took a huge haircut.

Greek private banks. What happened is the same thing on a bigger scale as what happened across Europe after 2007: profit was privatised, while risk was nationalised. The Greek banks which accepted loans from German and French private banks were allowed to continue running on Troika handouts, while the money lost was recouped through public sector cuts, leading to high unemployment, a wage contraction of 25% and massive cuts to pensions etc.

All of a sudden those same people vote in a government who promises to act in their interests and the EU, lead by Germany, kick up a massive fuss. Suddenly you see people like the German finance minister saying he can't work with a democratically elected minister in Tsipras, while Varoufakis is seemingly forced out. It's an insult to democracy and shows out austerity as a total scam.

So please tell me, how exactly am I blinded?

Because it's still Greek.

Lend them money, they moan. Don't lend them money, they moan.

Writing off their debt and letting them carry on the same is the worst outcome of all, every s***ty economy in the world would do the same.

Optimistic as ever

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chris123 hove actually 06 Jul 15 2.30pm
Quote serial thriller at 06 Jul 2015 1.38pm Quote Hoof Hearted at 06 Jul 2015 12.25pm Quote chris123 at 06 Jul 2015 12.22pm Quote Hoof Hearted at 06 Jul 2015 12.19pm [Link] Greece wasted most of their money... the above article shows the utter waste of Billions invested in Olympic stadia and infrastructure. I can't find the article but I read about the incompetence and wastefulness of the Athens Metro (light rail system). Overpaying cleaners and ticket inspectors who don't even turn up for work and people not paying to use the system, so it runs at a huge loss. Stop making excuses for these people and stop blaming the banks. The Greeks have created their own financial sh1tstorm, now they must ride it out. [Link] Thanks Chris.... What a joke....... defend that left thinking people! Of the money the Troika has lent Greece, only 10% of it has actually gone to the public sector and the government. 90% of it has gone to private banks, so the idea that this has been caused by public sector malpractice is a total myth. As an example, the cost of the 2004 Olympics to the Greek state was around 9 billion euros: Greece's debt is nearing 400 billion, so blaming the cost of the Olympics is ludicrous. Obviously such debt accumulation could only be tolerated by a corrupt, dynastic government, and certainly that was the case with Pasok and New Democracy. But the real causes of Greek debt levels come from the 2007 crisis, and the idiocy of the EU and private banks in supporting a nation embroiled in a suffocating singular currency with loans they were never going to be able to pay back. For them to now come back demanding repayment is not only undemocratic (as the result yesterday showed), it's a bit like feeding your kid KFC every meal of their life and then complaining that they're overweight. The problem you have, Hoof, is you seem so blinded by your hatred for 'the left' that you are willing to defend some of the most shady, disreputable organisations in the world based on very little evidence, just to have a pop at people like myself. But look over this thread: even people like Stirling and WAGU, staunch adherents to right wing politics normally, can see how f***ed over the people of Greece have been here. It isn't a case of right vs left, it's people vs corporations. Greek banks were bailed out/refinanced because they ran out of liquidity and could no longer operate. The banks and governments money is our money - deposits, taxes, bonds - and then they lend our money and charge interest. Your pension fund will be tied up somewhere in a Government Gilt. Greece is borrowing at levels so low that the debt really couldn't be priced cheaper given the credit risk involved. So these big bad banks are really only trying to look after our money. Greek bondholders have already taken massive hits.
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chris123

hove actually 06 Jul 15 2.30pm

Quote serial thriller at 06 Jul 2015 1.38pm

Quote Hoof Hearted at 06 Jul 2015 12.25pm

Quote chris123 at 06 Jul 2015 12.22pm

Quote Hoof Hearted at 06 Jul 2015 12.19pm

[Link]

Greece wasted most of their money... the above article shows the utter waste of Billions invested in Olympic stadia and infrastructure.

Stop making excuses for these people and stop blaming the banks.

The Greeks have created their own financial sh1tstorm, now they must ride it out.

[Link]

Thanks Chris....

What a joke....... defend that left thinking people!

Greek banks were bailed out/refinanced because they ran out of liquidity and could no longer operate. The banks and governments money is our money - deposits, taxes, bonds - and then they lend our money and charge interest. Your pension fund will be tied up somewhere in a Government Gilt. Greece is borrowing at levels so low that the debt really couldn't be priced cheaper given the credit risk involved. So these big bad banks are really only trying to look after our money. Greek bondholders have already taken massive hits.

Alert a moderator to this post

jamiemartin721 Reading 06 Jul 15 3.08pm
What's the Capital of Greece? About £ 4.50 "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
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jamiemartin721

Reading 06 Jul 15 3.08pm

What's the Capital of Greece?

About £ 4.50

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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jamiemartin721 Reading 06 Jul 15 3.10pm
Still, once they've finished burning everything, it'll pick up in tourism. You'll be able to buy a pint and a blow job for the price of a pint of milk. Possibly less if you actually have the pint of milk. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
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jamiemartin721

Reading 06 Jul 15 3.10pm

Still, once they've finished burning everything, it'll pick up in tourism. You'll be able to buy a pint and a blow job for the price of a pint of milk. Possibly less if you actually have the pint of milk.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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Falmouth Eagles Falmouth, Cornwall 06 Jul 15 3.23pm
ABTA says it's business as usual in the resorts, bet it changes tomorrow one hour before I land in Santorini. (My own personal cloud)
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Falmouth Eagles

Falmouth, Cornwall 06 Jul 15 3.23pm

Send a Private Message to Falmouth Eagles

ABTA says it's business as usual in the resorts, bet it changes tomorrow one hour before I land in Santorini. (My own personal cloud)

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We are goin up! Coulsdon 06 Jul 15 3.40pm
Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 11.06am Did they a have a choice ? Yes, accept austerity Measures, they refused. Have you watched the news in the last 5 years???? The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.
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We are goin up!

Coulsdon 06 Jul 15 3.40pm

Send a Private Message to We are goin up!

Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 11.06am

Did they a have a choice ? Yes, accept austerity Measures, they refused.

Have you watched the news in the last 5 years????

The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.

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jamiemartin721 Reading 06 Jul 15 3.46pm
Quote Falmouth Eagles at 06 Jul 2015 3.23pm ABTA says it's business as usual in the resorts, bet it changes tomorrow one hour before I land in Santorini. (My own personal cloud) I might well have sold the naming rights for the Country by then. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
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jamiemartin721

Reading 06 Jul 15 3.46pm

Quote Falmouth Eagles at 06 Jul 2015 3.23pm

ABTA says it's business as usual in the resorts, bet it changes tomorrow one hour before I land in Santorini. (My own personal cloud)

I might well have sold the naming rights for the Country by then.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

Alert a moderator to this post

Stuk Top half 06 Jul 15 4.25pm
Quote Falmouth Eagles at 06 Jul 2015 3.23pm ABTA says it's business as usual in the resorts, bet it changes tomorrow one hour before I land in Santorini. (My own personal cloud) I'd eat a very large meal before you leave if I were you! Optimistic as ever
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Stuk

Top half 06 Jul 15 4.25pm

Quote Falmouth Eagles at 06 Jul 2015 3.23pm

ABTA says it's business as usual in the resorts, bet it changes tomorrow one hour before I land in Santorini. (My own personal cloud)

I'd eat a very large meal before you leave if I were you!

Optimistic as ever

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dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 06 Jul 15 4.31pm
Quote ghosteagle at 06 Jul 2015 11.29am Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 11.06am Would you borrow more money if you couldn’t afford to pay the original amount back ? Did they a have a choice ? Yes, accept austerity Measures, they refused. The country as a whole decided to live beyond it's means, and that new president of theirs is going to bankrupt the country. Totally and utterly the fault of the greedy gits who ran the country. You can't blame the banks, they did what banks do, blaming the banks for lending is like telling off a dog for barking, it's what they do. I think you have confused Greece with somewhere else. Narnia possibly? Oh what a riposte, filled with facts and intelligent argument to prove me wrong,,,,, oh no thats not it, I know what it is. A child like and a pathetic attempt to lay the blame for the financial melt down at the Bankers doors, or perhaps Germany for lending them billions so they didn't crash into the third world a few years back. "It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"
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dannyh

wherever I lay my hat....... 06 Jul 15 4.31pm

Quote ghosteagle at 06 Jul 2015 11.29am

Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 11.06am

Would you borrow more money if you couldn’t afford to pay the original amount back ?

Did they a have a choice ? Yes, accept austerity Measures, they refused.

The country as a whole decided to live beyond it's means, and that new president of theirs is going to bankrupt the country.

Totally and utterly the fault of the greedy gits who ran the country. You can't blame the banks, they did what banks do, blaming the banks for lending is like telling off a dog for barking, it's what they do.

I think you have confused Greece with somewhere else. Narnia possibly?

Oh what a riposte, filled with facts and intelligent argument to prove me wrong,,,,, oh no thats not it, I know what it is.

A child like and a pathetic attempt to lay the blame for the financial melt down at the Bankers doors, or perhaps Germany for lending them billions so they didn't crash into the third world a few years back.

"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

Alert a moderator to this post

ghosteagle 06 Jul 15 4.38pm
Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 4.31pm Quote ghosteagle at 06 Jul 2015 11.29am Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 11.06am Would you borrow more money if you couldn’t afford to pay the original amount back ? Did they a have a choice ? Yes, accept austerity Measures, they refused. The country as a whole decided to live beyond it's means, and that new president of theirs is going to bankrupt the country. Totally and utterly the fault of the greedy gits who ran the country. You can't blame the banks, they did what banks do, blaming the banks for lending is like telling off a dog for barking, it's what they do. I think you have confused Greece with somewhere else. Narnia possibly? Oh what a riposte, filled with facts and intelligent argument to prove me wrong,,,,, oh no thats not it, I know what it is. A child like and a pathetic attempt to lay the blame for the financial melt down at the Bankers doors, or perhaps Germany for lending them billions so they didn't crash into the third world a few years back. You are funny. But seriously, try reading up and get back when you have some facts.
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ghosteagle

06 Jul 15 4.38pm

Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 4.31pm

Quote ghosteagle at 06 Jul 2015 11.29am

Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 11.06am

Would you borrow more money if you couldn’t afford to pay the original amount back ?

Did they a have a choice ? Yes, accept austerity Measures, they refused.

The country as a whole decided to live beyond it's means, and that new president of theirs is going to bankrupt the country.

I think you have confused Greece with somewhere else. Narnia possibly?

Oh what a riposte, filled with facts and intelligent argument to prove me wrong,,,,, oh no thats not it, I know what it is.

You are funny. But seriously, try reading up and get back when you have some facts.

Alert a moderator to this post

dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 06 Jul 15 4.39pm
Quote We are goin up! at 06 Jul 2015 3.40pm Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 11.06am Did they a have a choice ? Yes, accept austerity Measures, they refused. Have you watched the news in the last 5 years???? Yes thanks have you, or has your head been firmly stuck in the sand. Try reading something. [Link] "It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"
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dannyh

wherever I lay my hat....... 06 Jul 15 4.39pm

Quote We are goin up! at 06 Jul 2015 3.40pm

Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 11.06am

Did they a have a choice ? Yes, accept austerity Measures, they refused.

Have you watched the news in the last 5 years????

Yes thanks have you, or has your head been firmly stuck in the sand.

Try reading something.

[Link]

"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

Alert a moderator to this post

dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 06 Jul 15 4.40pm
Quote ghosteagle at 06 Jul 2015 4.38pm Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 4.31pm Quote ghosteagle at 06 Jul 2015 11.29am Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 11.06am Would you borrow more money if you couldn’t afford to pay the original amount back ? Did they a have a choice ? Yes, accept austerity Measures, they refused. The country as a whole decided to live beyond it's means, and that new president of theirs is going to bankrupt the country. Totally and utterly the fault of the greedy gits who ran the country. You can't blame the banks, they did what banks do, blaming the banks for lending is like telling off a dog for barking, it's what they do. I think you have confused Greece with somewhere else. Narnia possibly? Oh what a riposte, filled with facts and intelligent argument to prove me wrong,,,,, oh no thats not it, I know what it is. A child like and a pathetic attempt to lay the blame for the financial melt down at the Bankers doors, or perhaps Germany for lending them billions so they didn't crash into the third world a few years back. You are funny. But seriously, try reading up and get back when you have some facts. [Link] I would ask you to read but I'm not sure you can. "It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"
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dannyh

wherever I lay my hat....... 06 Jul 15 4.40pm

Quote ghosteagle at 06 Jul 2015 4.38pm

Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 4.31pm

Quote ghosteagle at 06 Jul 2015 11.29am

Quote dannyh at 06 Jul 2015 11.06am

Would you borrow more money if you couldn’t afford to pay the original amount back ?

Did they a have a choice ? Yes, accept austerity Measures, they refused.

The country as a whole decided to live beyond it's means, and that new president of theirs is going to bankrupt the country.

I think you have confused Greece with somewhere else. Narnia possibly?

Oh what a riposte, filled with facts and intelligent argument to prove me wrong,,,,, oh no thats not it, I know what it is.

You are funny. But seriously, try reading up and get back when you have some facts.

[Link]

I would ask you to read but I'm not sure you can.

"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

Alert a moderator to this post

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