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SW19 CPFC Addiscombe West 23 Mar 22 2.05pm | |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Latest Brand video on the lack of vaccine data research transparency.
This is pretty useful from Reuters on it [Link] There's 329,000 pages, and the FDA is proposing 500 pages be released per month, for various reasons, including avoiding trying to review and redact all 329000 pages of information in 108 days. Likely impossible for a 10 person team. I'd be interested to see if there are any other instances where a company has reviewed, redacted and released that much complex information in a 108 day period. I'd also be interested to know how much that might cost and how many people it would need on it to do so. I'd wager a hell of a lot on each count, and surely impractical even for an organisation with a 6bn budget. How many people would you need on that? 1000? Makes no sense. Plus, I'd imagine there would be plenty of errors working at that scale and speed, and errors are not the things you want when handling sensitive personal and commercial data. The most important takeout for me is it's not the daily mail esque headline of 'won't be released for 55 years', it's the less glamorous 'to be released monthly for the next 55 years'. Small but important difference for those more susceptible to a conspiracists magnet. As always, balance. Edited by SW19 CPFC (23 Mar 2022 2.07pm)
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Stirlingsays 23 Mar 22 3.17pm | |
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Originally posted by SW19 CPFC
Sort of. Being specific about the 55 year wait for the FDA reviewed material, it's not a case of nothing being released for 55 years, it's about releasing it in stages over 55 years (monthly) as they have a team of 10 that are also handling another 400 or so FOI requests. It's not the only thing on their plate. The FDA, which works hand in glove with the pharmaceutical industry worth hundreds of billions can afford a team of much larger than 10. Personally I don't accept that angle of argument. Originally posted by SW19 CPFC
This is pretty useful from Reuters on it [Link] There's 329,000 pages, and the FDA is proposing 500 pages be released per month, for various reasons, including avoiding trying to review and redact all 329000 pages of information in 108 days. Likely impossible for a 10 person team. Do you seriously think a request for 55 years has been made before? I don't know but monthly or not that sounds pretty suspect to me. If I remember correctly the judge rejected this request. If this ruling had been accepted just which aspects of thos 500 pages per month do you think the FDA would have been releasing for say the first twenty years.......controversial ones you think? Originally posted by SW19 CPFC
I'd be interested to see if there are any other instances where a company has reviewed, redacted and released that much complex information in a 108 day period. I'd also be interested to know how much that might cost and how many people it would need on it to do so. I'd wager a hell of a lot on each count, and surely impractical even for an organisation with a 6bn budget. How many people would you need on that? 1000? Makes no sense. Plus, I'd imagine there would be plenty of errors working at that scale and speed, and errors are not the things you want when handling sensitive personal and commercial data. Well, I can only go on the outcomes that the judge heard these justifications and rejected them....the BMJ didn't seem that impressed either. Also, I think you have to factor in that this isn't the thirties anymore with people physically having to thumb their way through pages. Even simple office software uses automations which can quickly find instances in a 'cntrl f' click. These reports also use databases, where information can be retrieved quickly....personally having a background in computing software I think the request was highly suspect. Originally posted by SW19 CPFC
The most important takeout for me is it's not the daily mail esque headline of 'won't be released for 55 years', it's the less glamorous 'to be released monthly for the next 55 years'. Small but important difference for those more susceptible to a conspiracists magnet. As always, balance. Edited by SW19 CPFC (23 Mar 2022 2.07pm) I don't wish to be facetious but instead of focusing upon magnets perhaps the article from the British medical journal cited and related in Brand's video deserves more emphasis upon the many yeared calls for transparency within this industry....one that has broken laws numerous times. Because far too many times it seems that it measures its principles in terms of profits against fines. Could it be true all those successful charges were also originally called conspiracies? Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Mar 2022 3.25pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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BlueJay UK 23 Mar 22 3.25pm | |
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Originally posted by SW19 CPFC
This is pretty useful from Reuters on it [Link] There's 329,000 pages, and the FDA is proposing 500 pages be released per month, for various reasons, including avoiding trying to review and redact all 329000 pages of information in 108 days. Likely impossible for a 10 person team. I'd be interested to see if there are any other instances where a company has reviewed, redacted and released that much complex information in a 108 day period. I'd also be interested to know how much that might cost and how many people it would need on it to do so. I'd wager a hell of a lot on each count, and surely impractical even for an organisation with a 6bn budget. How many people would you need on that? 1000? Makes no sense. Plus, I'd imagine there would be plenty of errors working at that scale and speed, and errors are not the things you want when handling sensitive personal and commercial data. The most important takeout for me is it's not the daily mail esque headline of 'won't be released for 55 years', it's the less glamorous 'to be released monthly for the next 55 years'. Small but important difference for those more susceptible to a conspiracists magnet. As always, balance. Edited by SW19 CPFC (23 Mar 2022 2.07pm) Fair points. Brand is a well meaning and decent man, but his shortfall is that he hardly does a 'deep dive' into the issues. He fleshes out a headline take and runs with it. Not as though I'm a big Farage fan, but when they went head to head on Question Time years back it was a good demonstration of this. Nowadays, Brand is coming at it from a different perspective where sometimes its talking point on the right that have his ear. That's by no means saying that he doesn't make many valid points, but it's important to recognise that what he presents is a 'take', a 'perspective' and that when people talk about the truth, it's often a partial and directed truth, with omissions to it that are equally truthful and valid in drawing a conclusion. Nothing wrong with taking his contributions alongside others though of course, as long as it's not solely done to prop up an existing view, rather than be open to various takes.
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Stirlingsays 23 Mar 22 4.01pm | |
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Brand speaks to power. The sad fact....that he regularly comments on...is that many on the left are in support of the establishment because they view it as being in their interests. This means that many...not all...the energy and criticisms of the elites comes from the right. However, I agree with him that the labels are far less important than the actual issues themselves. In my view he's right that coalitions can be formed on specifics where unaccountable power over the lives of everybody has been outsourced. Endless division over everything just works against everyone.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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ASCPFC Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 23 Mar 22 4.13pm | |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Brand speaks to power. The sad fact....that he regularly comments on...is that many on the left are in support of the establishment because they view it as being in their interests. This means that many...not all...the energy and criticisms of the elites comes from the right. However, I agree with him that the labels are far less important than the actual issues themselves. In my view he's right that coalitions can be formed on specifics where unaccountable power over the lives of everybody has been outsourced. Endless division over everything just works against everyone. There seems to no middle ground these days - it's all apparently black and white, even when it clearly isn't.
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BlueJay UK 23 Mar 22 4.37pm | |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Brand speaks to power. The sad fact....that he regularly comments on...is that many on the left are in support of the establishment because they view it as being in their interests. This means that many...not all...the energy and criticisms of the elites comes from the right. However, I agree with him that the labels are far less important than the actual issues themselves. Yes, in fairness this is, and in a way always has been his central point and is hard to fault as a useful way forward.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 23 Mar 22 10.54pm | |
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Still testing positive. That's 10 days now, plus the 3 days with symptoms before a positive test. So still isolating, but walking alone, avoiding people and not touching anything. No symptoms now, other than feeling very tired, very soon after doing anything at all. Which is unusual for me. The number of people in Cornwall with Covid is now at the highest level ever, so my empirical experience is bourne out.
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Spiderman Horsham 24 Mar 22 6.56am | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
Still testing positive. That's 10 days now, plus the 3 days with symptoms before a positive test. So still isolating, but walking alone, avoiding people and not touching anything. No symptoms now, other than feeling very tired, very soon after doing anything at all. Which is unusual for me. The number of people in Cornwall with Covid is now at the highest level ever, so my empirical experience is bourne out. Apologies for not sending you best wishes Eire, as I have not been following this thread. Hope you are on the end. Take care. Obviously didn’t affect your typing hand
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 24 Mar 22 11.25am | |
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Originally posted by Spiderman
Apologies for not sending you best wishes Eire, as I have not been following this thread. Hope you are on the end. Take care. Obviously didn’t affect your typing hand It's allowed me to use it more, as I have been stuck at home a lot and doing anything physical doesn't last too long at the moment. Thanks for the good wishes.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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Spiderman Horsham 24 Mar 22 12.11pm | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
Still testing positive. That's 10 days now, plus the 3 days with symptoms before a positive test. So still isolating, but walking alone, avoiding people and not touching anything. No symptoms now, other than feeling very tired, very soon after doing anything at all. Which is unusual for me. The number of people in Cornwall with Covid is now at the highest level ever, so my empirical experience is bourne out. Wife has just tested positive. She had been working at the airport last weekend where no one seems to be wearing a mask! She felt very I’ll last couple of days but is better today
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Nicholas91 The Democratic Republic of Kent 24 Mar 22 12.37pm | |
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Originally posted by Spiderman
Wife has just tested positive. She had been working at the airport last weekend where no one seems to be wearing a mask! She felt very I’ll last couple of days but is better today At the risk of exposing my own ignorance I do wonder whether it is Omicron or any other strain flying about these days? I tested positive a few weeks ago, after a long spell of unrelated illness and was virtually asymptomatic. In any case, wish yourself and Wife all the best, you too Wisbech and hopefully this is a milder strain most people are picking up recently (although again, would reference my earlier statement regarding my ignorance).
Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!! |
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Jimenez SELHURSTPARKCHESTER,DA BRONX 24 Mar 22 12.54pm | |
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Originally posted by Nicholas91
At the risk of exposing my own ignorance I do wonder whether it is Omicron or any other strain flying about these days? I tested positive a few weeks ago, after a long spell of unrelated illness and was virtually asymptomatic. In any case, wish yourself and Wife all the best, you too Wisbech and hopefully this is a milder strain most people are picking up recently (although again, would reference my earlier statement regarding my ignorance). Yes it used to be called a cold.
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