Security equating to 'encouraging [sic]' Palestinians to face Israeli shells with their bare chests whilst being placed at hospitals, schools and other such buildings where, coincidentally, a s*** load of Hamas rockets are situated?

Palestinians need to reject these c***s. They are killing these people.

Edited by matt_himself (17 Aug 2014 7.33pm)

They aren't though are they? Israeli rockets are. You're conclusion is based on the premise that Israel have to launch rockets at civilian targets if there are rockets based there (something which seems true although to what extent none of us know).

Let's not forget that the human cost of blowing up schools, hospitals and other humanitarian relief centres is far greater if they are destroyed with US weapons that annihilate everything but the fillings in their teeth, than if they accept that massacring dozens is not a fair price to pay to destroy some largely ineffective rockets.

There is NO justification for bombing these targets, just as there have never been any justification for targeting civilians. People only become human shields if you still go on and fire weapons at them. It is always a two-way process, and no matter how extreme Hamas' actions become, Israel will always be committing unspeakably depraved acts if they continue to fire.

Edited by serial thriller (17 Aug 2014 7.45pm)

I don't know, nor will I claim to know, the exact situation in terms of where rockets are or are not situated in Gaza. Hamas claims they are in underground tunnels, Israel say they are in humanitarian areas. But both of those are serial liars.

I agree with you that Hamas is an obstacle to peace. However their rockets have killed 3 civilians since the fighting began, and to my mind this makes any justification on Israel's behalf about bombing hospitals, schools etc. in order to protect people f*cking laughable. They are to blame for their actions, and as much as they try and shift the blame, I hope it is Netanyahu and his government going to sleep every night with the cries of innocent Palestinian children ringing in their ears.

As for the bit in bold, yes I do try and be 'right on' Matt, I much prefer it to being 'right off' the mark. I've long accepted my role in your mind as some sort of lefty-liberal cyborg intent on cosying up to terrorists, converting the nation in to peadophile vegans while sucking Karl Marx's posthumous member till it coughs up it's final centuries-old load, but actually, and this might come as a surprise to you, I'm really just a human being with a couple of views I agree upon with you and a few that I don't. I try to think about nice things when I get angry, drink some orange juice maybe, take a walk, and avoid unnecessary confrontation. I'll die one day and so will you, ending both of our pointless little cameos on this planet, neither any more right or wrong about anything than when we first plopped from our mother's uterus'. So basically what I'm saying is, instead of getting some warped self-satisfaction from unprovoked sly digs at those you categorise as opposing your perceptions of the world on here, why not have a sit down, put some chilled jazz on, maybe think about loved ones, before committing to post on a public forum eh?

I'm not unaware that it's been going on ad infinitum but this doesn't make it any more tolerable.

In killing a non-threatening civilian you are taking life from somebody who posed no threat to you in order to prove a point to somebody else. It is a sick thing to do and should be avoided at all costs. It suggests a hierarchy of life and an arrogance of control that repeatedly doesn't deliver the ends it desires. Are Israel doing anything more than flaming the hostilities towards them in Palestine by murdering civilians, are they achieving a long lasting peace by blowing bits of family members in to the air which are lying dormant waiting for aid?

Sure they may take out a few bombs in the process, but the bombs aren't the issue; it's the mentality that allows the Palestinians to vote in Hamas who will fight Israel by any means necessary, be it by arms, suicide bombings or something even worse, and that's the mentality which surges through Gaza every time Israel decide to target innocents.

So what? Because Israel aren't committing genocide their actions are justifiable?

1000 civilians killed is 1000 too many, and by using the fact that rockets are placed in a civilian area as an excuse for such numbers suggests to me that it is a price they are willing to pay. Those 4 kids they killed on the beach, with no bombs or tunnels in sight, just plain gunned down...it's just so tragic, and to try and excuse it by saying that Israel aren't exercising their power to commit the same crime on everyone in Gaza is no excuse at all.

I would say they are targeting civilians in that they are targeting areas in which they know civilians will be residing and most probably killed. It is indiscriminate murder and thus I stand by every single point I have posted.

You said Israel were killing civilians......Well, the reality is that indiscriminate killing would have resulted in a death total many many times over a thousand...The truth is that they are attacking Hamas who chose to fight from mostly civilian areas, for obvious reasons...You might not like this reality but it's a fact.

So after I prove the logic of this wrong you make the refinement to your statement that Israel are targeting areas where they know civilians are present....You deem that unacceptable. Lets forgo the fact that Israel have prewarned these areas beforehand....The logic of your statement would also describe the allies bombing German cities and towns in the war?

Are they criminals then? They knew civilians were around the installations they attacked.

This is a war.....It is horrific and I don't support what the action in Gaza.....But I bulk at your overall descriptions of motivation and intent.

Edited by Stirlingsays (17 Aug 2014 10.03pm)