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Vieira vs Roy V2.0
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 MrRobbo  Chaldon 15 May 23 8.38am |
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Originally posted by Goal Machine
I don’t think PV is a terrible manager but he had appeared to have lost the changing room towards the end. The fact Eze wasn’t playing is quite laughable when we think about it now with the benefit of hindsight. PV had an excellent first season and was very quickly able to gel a team of strangers into one playing decent, attractive football. He deserves credit for that. Something had to change with our dire run of form. It’s quite easy to say PV would have got results against the lesser teams, but I’m not sure. Had we lost the first two matches against Leicester and Leeds they would have leapfrogged us and we’d have been bang in trouble. The new manager bounce was timed to perfection. I’ve always liked Roy and those who previously criticised his ‘Royball’ tactics seem to forget he had the oldest squad in the league with a chronic lack of firepower. He did extremely well with limited resources to not just an avoid relegation, but comfortably so. He was never given the war chest Vieira had. Well done Parish for getting the big calls right as usual and well done Roy for doing a cracking job. My gut tells me that Roy will be here next season. I'd agree. What he demonstrated both with Palace and Nice, was that eh was able to come in and hit hte ground running. Getting players to quicky respect him and play for him. What seamed to happen in both scenarios, is that they ran into a sticky patch and the wheels fell off. He wasn't able to arrest the slide
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| MrRobbo Chaldon 15 May 23 8.40am |
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Originally posted by southnorwoodhill
This aligns perfectly to my baking analogy: one may have the ingredients but does one know how to put them together in the correct proportions and bake at the correct temperature for the correct amount of time? In football terms it's trying to put square pegs in round holes and using the wrong tactical formation for the players at hand. PV was guilty of this, the most egregious example being the belief that Jeff Schlupp could perform as a central holding midfielder in a 3 man midfield, and then sticking with it when it clearly wasn't working. Don't disagree with the sentiment, but Roy has also favoured Schlupp in a 3.
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| southnorwoodhill 15 May 23 8.48am |
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Originally posted by MrRobbo
Don't disagree with the sentiment, but Roy has also favoured Schlupp in a 3. Schlupp was also one of Roy's favourites during his first managerial term. I don't mind Jeff Schlupp, but not in a holding midfield role. Hughes is far more adept in the position.
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Lanzo-Ad  Lanzarote 15 May 23 9.06am |
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Originally posted by Goal Machine
I don’t think PV is a terrible manager but he had appeared to have lost the changing room towards the end. The fact Eze wasn’t playing is quite laughable when we think about it now with the benefit of hindsight. PV had an excellent first season and was very quickly able to gel a team of strangers into one playing decent, attractive football. He deserves credit for that. Something had to change with our dire run of form. It’s quite easy to say PV would have got results against the lesser teams, but I’m not sure. Had we lost the first two matches against Leicester and Leeds they would have leapfrogged us and we’d have been bang in trouble. The new manager bounce was timed to perfection. I’ve always liked Roy and those who previously criticised his ‘Royball’ tactics seem to forget he had the oldest squad in the league with a chronic lack of firepower. He did extremely well with limited resources to not just an avoid relegation, but comfortably so. He was never given the war chest Vieira had. Well done Parish for getting the big calls right as usual and well done Roy for doing a cracking job. My gut tells me that Roy will be here next season. He is, Thread closed.
“That’s a joke son, I say, that’s a joke.” “Nice boy, but he’s sharp as a throw pillow.” “He’s so dumb he thinks a Mexican border pays rent” “ “Son… I say, son, some people are so narrow minded they can look through a keyhole with both eyes.”__ Forhorn Leghorn |
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| NEILLO Shoreham-by-Sea 15 May 23 1.02pm |
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A '' terrible '' manager does not get a 12th placed finish in the Premier League and a FA Cup Semi Final. But having achieved that, Vieira was unable to push on. We've debated it to death on here, so I won't go over old ground. In today's Times it was reported that Vieira had an identical record of points as Roy has achieved v. the same opposition since he returned to Palace. So would Roy have achieved better results after the turn of the year ? Quite possibly, although the one game we have had against a ' top ' team, Spurs, we came up short. What I will say is that the performances, even in those identical games, have been so much more convincing than under Vieira and the players seem far more upbeat.
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| Ginger Pubic Wig Wickham de L'Ouest 15 May 23 1.04pm |
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Re-upping this which compares the points Roy has accrued against the same teams that PV played earlier this season. Leicester 3. 1. Roy. 16. PV 16 Despite this, I still think history has proved Parish right. Maybe PV would have kept us up, but Finally, the upturn in multiple players' performances, especially Eze, speaks very well if Roy.
If you want to live in a world full of kindness, respect and love, try to show these qualities. |
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I'm not sure and 
I am not sure he'd have done so so convincingly.| Lanzo-Ad Lanzarote 15 May 23 1.18pm |
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Originally posted by NEILLO
A '' terrible '' manager does not get a 12th placed finish in the Premier League and a FA Cup Semi Final. But having achieved that, Vieira was unable to push on. We've debated it to death on here, so I won't go over old ground. In today's Times it was reported that Vieira had an identical record of points as Roy has achieved v. the same opposition since he returned to Palace. So would Roy have achieved better results after the turn of the year ? Quite possibly, although the one game we have had against a ' top ' team, Spurs, we came up short. What I will say is that the performances, even in those identical games, have been so much more convincing than under Vieira and the players seem far more upbeat. Delusion still reigns.
“That’s a joke son, I say, that’s a joke.” “Nice boy, but he’s sharp as a throw pillow.” “He’s so dumb he thinks a Mexican border pays rent” “ “Son… I say, son, some people are so narrow minded they can look through a keyhole with both eyes.”__ Forhorn Leghorn |
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Den1923  15 May 23 1.21pm |
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I think it is unkind to say PV was a terrible manager, what he did lack was experience of the EPL and man management, this you can only get with experience. It would appear from Eze comments maybe PV was not flexible enough to change what he was doing at the time which the team clearly saw and felt was not working. Roy on the other hand knew most of the players well and coupled with his experience and proven management skill and therefore at that late stage in the season it was the right call to bring him back to sort out the difficult situation as he did when FDV was sent on his way. Roy has clearly saved us yet again and hopefully we are now all respectful enough to appreciate and acknowledge his and Ray's efforts. I would not be unhappy if SP chooses to stick with him for one more season in order to get the right manager for the future!
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| Ginger Pubic Wig Wickham de L'Ouest 15 May 23 1.43pm |
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Originally posted by NEILLO
A '' terrible '' manager does not get a 12th placed finish in the Premier League and a FA Cup Semi Final. But having achieved that, Vieira was unable to push on. We've debated it to death on here, so I won't go over old ground. In today's Times it was reported that Vieira had an identical record of points as Roy has achieved v. the same opposition since he returned to Palace. So would Roy have achieved better results after the turn of the year ? Quite possibly, although the one game we have had against a ' top ' team, Spurs, we came up short. What I will say is that the performances, even in those identical games, have been so much more convincing than under Vieira and the players seem far more upbeat. I hope they credited HOL and The Ginger Public Wig for that insight, the b******s. I pointed this out a couple weeks ago.
If you want to live in a world full of kindness, respect and love, try to show these qualities. |
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| CrazyBadger Ware 15 May 23 2.09pm |
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I also do not think PV is a terrible manager, and agree that his downfall was that he couldn't reverse the bad run of form he was on, and could not get a tune(or a shot!) out of our squad. The opposition should not be dismissed, however. Roy's team have played the leagues worst teams since his return, and this has enabled him to allow this team to play with Freedom. In contrast, the Run that ultimately lost PV his job was against the leagues best. In order to compare the two, we really need to see how we do against better opposition, and that won't happen...this season. It'll be interesting vs the in-form Fulham this weekend. Its the hardest test we'll face since his return. Apart from the obvious change in mentality of team, the other thing Roy's return has brought is momentum. These run of games has enabled us to play our attacking brand of Royball without worrying too much about the opposition. Those first 2 games against Leicester and Leeds included a fair amount of luck, and that has brought a winning mentality. We'll never know if a PV team against a Leicester team who allowed us so much space would have gleaned the same points, and begun that momentum. (I suspect it wouldn't) I've loved Roys Return, but taking him back for a full season is by no means the answer. Id rather have him in the wings in case the next experiment fails !
"It was a Team effort, I guess it took all players working together to lose this one" |
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| NEILLO Shoreham-by-Sea 15 May 23 2.27pm |
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Originally posted by Lanzo-Ad
Delusion still reigns. Not at all. Just the ability to see beyond black or white ( that's not intended in a racial context ), something that's beyond you.
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| Lanzo-Ad Lanzarote 15 May 23 2.55pm |
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Originally posted by NEILLO
Not at all. Just the ability to see beyond black or white ( that's not intended in a racial context ), something that's beyond you. Well we will have to wait and see if any mug apoints him as manager, if they do lets see what happens.
“That’s a joke son, I say, that’s a joke.” “Nice boy, but he’s sharp as a throw pillow.” “He’s so dumb he thinks a Mexican border pays rent” “ “Son… I say, son, some people are so narrow minded they can look through a keyhole with both eyes.”__ Forhorn Leghorn |
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