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No Vax Novac
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 Stirlingsays  17 Jan 22 10.14am |
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De Santis talking sense in a world of the fear mongered. People have flocked to Florida and some of the highest vaccinated and strictest states have the worse problems.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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ASCPFC  Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 17 Jan 22 1.18pm |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
Lying little toad really thought people would believe he had covid in December. Good job not everyone is quite as credulous as a few on here. Here are some others, all liars. Turns out they are saying 95% of the men's top 100, yet 85% of the women's vaccinated. So there are definitely unvaccinated players at the Australian Open. It will be quite humourous when we discover how many of the women are unvaccinated.
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| Mapletree Croydon 17 Jan 22 3.55pm |
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Originally posted by grumpymort
BS you again showing you have no clue what you are talking about The vaccines in the UK are for emergency/temp use only they are not fully licensed you can not force people to take them and with the evidence as well that it does not stop spread in a court case you would rip them apart. The is not ebola or bubonic plague they was a real threat the numbers prove it this is not no increase in death rate has occurred go and look at the raw data of deaths and do the math. Well, you know I always bow to your greater knowledge. Even though I am a Director of HR with 35 years of experience I am sure you know best. So you are saying it isn't illegal to have someone work with patients in a Care Home without them having been vaccinated. Who knew.
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| Mapletree Croydon 17 Jan 22 3.57pm |
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Originally posted by ASCPFC
Here are some others, all liars. Well no, they have been tested and I assume the tests are confirmed As far as I know, Djokovic had no confirmed test and simply told the tennis authorities he had suffered from COVID in December. His behaviour at that time, on the other hand, gave no indication at all of a positive test and would have been extremely reckless had he been suffering from COVID. He just did a snow job on the authorities.
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| Mapletree Croydon 17 Jan 22 3.59pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
De Santis talking sense in a world of the fear mongered. People have flocked to Florida and some of the highest vaccinated and strictest states have the worse problems. As a scientist I am sure you understand the difference between correlation and causal effect. One differentiator will be levels of UV, another levels of deprivation.
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 grumpymort  US/Thailand/UK 17 Jan 22 5.51pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
It's a long way from nonsense! Whilst it's true that this appears not to have yet been tested in either a Court or Tribunal, and that legal opinion is not yet settled, the general opinion seems to be that it is reasonable for an employer to include a requirement to be vaccinated in their recruitment policy. You can read some of the reasoning here:-
No opinion in the court system you present your case based of laws and then evidence. If you are fired for not having a vaccine the other side needs to show it poses a great risk you working there well this cant be proven this virus is not a great risk. Originally posted by Mapletree
Well, you know I always bow to your greater knowledge. Even though I am a Director of HR with 35 years of experience I am sure you know best. So you are saying it isn't illegal to have someone work with patients in a Care Home without them having been vaccinated. Who knew.
Its always appeal to authority to you isn't it as if people in these roles know everything. 35 years experience doing what spreading company policies. If you fire someone from your care home because they wont be vaccinated for covid-19 yes that leaves it open to grounds of unfair dismissal. The loop hole in this is most care homes hire people short term this will require people to be vaccinated unless they show evidence of exemption or they will choose not to hire them to begin with Originally posted by Helmet46
I’ve read and I must confess I’m struggling to see that it shows that the unvaccinated only have cold like symptoms from Omicron and Delta, whilst boosted people get very ill. Genuine question (as I have no medical knowledge and assuming this is the paper you were referring to) what bits in this seemingly short paper articulate the findings you state above? (I appreciate I’ve probably done exactly what you said not to do, but that’s no medical knowledge coming out again). Edited by Helmet46 (17 Jan 2022 7.38am)
Have a look at Dr Michael Chan Chi-wai he shows omicron doesn't go straight for infected the lungs which is why most people report this is like a cold. the data is what is important and looking at the places it is taken from. Most people dont understand it which is why they use the simple bits out of these papers which do not explain what is really happened or shown. that link is not the full thing you need to go over the references etc as well. Edited by grumpymort (17 Jan 2022 6.17pm)
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| Helmet46 Croydon 17 Jan 22 6.22pm |
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Originally posted by grumpymort
Its always appeal to authority to you isn't it as if people in these roles know everything. 35 years experience doing what spreading company policies. If you fire someone from your care home because they wont be vaccinated for covid-19 yes that leaves it open to grounds of unfair dismissal. The loop hole in this is most care homes hire people short term this will require people to be vaccinated unless they show evidence of exemption or they will choose not to hire them to begin with Edited by grumpymort (17 Jan 2022 6.08pm) You can’t bring a claim for unfair dismissal, generally, if you’ve worked there for less than 2 years. It appears lots of people have lost their jobs from that sector due to this. Not sure how many cases are in the courts or waiting to go to court. I think the law is that from November you’re not allowed in a care home unless you are vaccinated.
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| Helmet46 Croydon 17 Jan 22 6.25pm |
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Originally posted by grumpymort
Have a look at Dr Michael Chan Chi-wai he shows omicron doesn't go straight for infected the lungs which is why most people report this is like a cold. the data is what is important and looking at the places it is taken from. Most people dont understand it which is why they use the simple bits out of these papers which do not explain what is really happened or shown. that link is not the full thing you need to go over the references etc as well. Edited by grumpymort (17 Jan 2022 6.17pm) You said read this study - it shows it. Well it didn’t. Where are the links to the studies that do show it then?
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 17 Jan 22 6.30pm |
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Originally posted by grumpymort
It has not been tested in court because it wouldn't hold up. No opinion in the court system you present your case based of laws and then evidence. If you are fired for not having a vaccine the other side needs to show it poses a great risk you working there well this cant be proven this virus is not a great risk.
It hasn't been tested in Court, or at a Tribunal, yet, because employers have been extremely tolerant and tried to encourage rather than coerce. What I am talking about is not though the sacking of existing employees, who after 2 years would have an argument that may hold up. That is yet to be determined. An employer could argue successfully that the rest of their staff being put at risk contravenes Health and Safety regulations which then negate any discrimination argument. We will have to wait for that. What I am talking about is making it a legitimate question when recruiting new staff, and there I see a much clearer picture. I think employers can set whatever terms they wish.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Stirlingsays 17 Jan 22 7.18pm |
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In principle I'm not against employers being able to discriminate in who they employ, for whatever reason...their money their choice.....Sure, there are probably some exceptions but I've always regarded that as common sense. However, that isn't the world we live in....and given the system we have I view this argument as highly one eyed. This idea that being vaccinated or unvaccinated makes a significant difference is one that will increasingly come under increased skepticism......especially since it's just a couple of months or even sooner that the government will tell you that jabs will be once a year and voluntary. Anyone looking back at these conversations in a year's time will likely have a sense of the absurd. Edited by Stirlingsays (17 Jan 2022 7.18pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Stirlingsays 17 Jan 22 7.30pm |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
As a scientist I am sure you understand the difference between correlation and causal effect. One differentiator will be levels of UV, another levels of deprivation. I wouldn't call myself a scientist, just someone who loved computers and went off and took an honours degree in them....then a teaching degree. People often like to grand-stand with titles but really the proof in the pudding is in how good you are at the coalface. Correlation isn't proof of causation, but then again it's often an indication. Having said that yes, these things are most often multifactored. In my opinion De Santis has been proven correct and Florida has benefited from his leadership compared to less free states. I see him figuring strongly amongst the republican candidates for 2024. Edited by Stirlingsays (17 Jan 2022 7.52pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Stirlingsays 17 Jan 22 7.49pm |
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I recommend that people watch Dr John Campbell's video for how things currently are and how they are likely to play out.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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