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Las Vegas shootings
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 Ray in Houston  Houston 03 Oct 17 4.41pm |
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Originally posted by Stuk
I reckon he probably took them in to the hotel in dribs and drabs, rather than an all-in-one go and tip the bellboy type of situation. Everything in a casino is on camera. They'll have footage.
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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jamiemartin721  Reading 03 Oct 17 4.43pm |
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Originally posted by dannyh
A man with that many weapons in his home, obviously has a massive hard on for guns and shooting, meaning he knows how to take aim, and with 22,000 people closely packed, with the weapon described, the death tool should be hundreds more. I'm NOT being sick or twisted, but the weapon he has, has a cyclic fire rate of up to 710 rounds per minute. As I said previously, anyone that prepared would have his mags lined up, 30 in each, each mag a max of ten seconds including change over, means in one minute he could have dropped over 180 rounds, two mins 360, 3 mins 540, etc etc. potentially over a 1100 rounds into a heavily and densely populated area in less than 6 mins. The two things don't match up, careful planning and preparation, a twisted dedication to firearms,but with totally s*** marksmanship. Doesn't add up.
I don't think its about the killing as many as possible, but the power over life and death. I suspect he'd want to pick people, and decide whether or not he'd shoot. Spree shooters don't tend to shoot people at random, but target people specifically. I can see him wanting to get someone in his sights, decide whether he wanted to drop them, and make a decision. Its a god complex power thing - To be on high, choosing who lives and who dies. My feeling would be he'd want to savour that. Then when they started running and hiding, or he'd gotten a few, he started being more indiscriminately, but by that point he'd probably become less controlled in his behaviour, his own excitement at the thrill driving him, rather than a methodical firing pattern. I suspect he'd have been firing not into the crowd randomly, but at individuals or groups of people he selected.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| Ray in Houston Houston 03 Oct 17 4.47pm |
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Thinking about the casino, I wonder if this will spark a number of hotel chains to go "gun free". With the spread of open carry laws around the states, many soft-occupancy spaces, like offices and restaurants where the public have access to private premises, have designated themselves gun free locations. This isn't as easy as it sounds - there is prescribed signage that has to be displayed at every possible entrance, otherwise a carrier can argue that he never saw the sign or the building wasn't in compliance. If people start refusing to stay at hotels that aren't gun-free, then they may be moved to change their policies.
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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| Stuk Top half 03 Oct 17 4.48pm |
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Originally posted by npn
Am I having drug fueled flashbacks, or did some bloke in a row with the police once park a tank outside South Norwood nick? It doesn't ring any bells.
Optimistic as ever |
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| Stuk Top half 03 Oct 17 4.49pm |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
Everything in a casino is on camera. They'll have footage. Yep, even your playing hands
Optimistic as ever |
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| Ray in Houston Houston 03 Oct 17 4.49pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Then when they started running and hiding, or he'd gotten a few, he started being more indiscriminately, but by that point he'd probably become less controlled in his behaviour, his own excitement at the thrill driving him, rather than a methodical firing pattern. I suspect he'd have been firing not into the crowd randomly, but at individuals or groups of people he selected. "Five men is a juicy opportunity; one man is a waste of ammo."
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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| dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 03 Oct 17 5.01pm |
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Originally posted by Ray in Houston
One can be "twisted" but still a very careful planner and executor of such a plan. As to marksmanship, don't get too caught up on that. I was a military qualified marksman in my younger days - shooting any number of weapons including the old British Army standard issue SLR, the Lee-Enfield #4 & #8 and a few others. Marksmen use single shot weapons because only the first shot will be on target. It's extremely difficult to be accurate at distance and, despite what Hollywood would have you believe, nigh-on impossible to hit anything that's moving. If you're what's moving - say from the recoil from the prior shot - you'll miss every other shot thereafter until you steady yourself again. The shooter used a bump-stock repeat firing modification, so he was just spraying indiscriminately into a large crowd. Accuracy be damned, he didn't care what he hit. I'm currently serving and a marksman. IMO any automatic weapon fire on bursts of 3-4 rounds into a densely populated crowd, generally hit someone or some thing, of course accuracey is impaired on automatic fire, but even if they were aimed shots its one every two seconds with your breathing rate. The point is, anyone even my nan, with a few hours training could rain down enough rounds in a crowded area to kill a lot more than thankfully happened.
"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'" |
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| Ray in Houston Houston 03 Oct 17 5.02pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Couldn't possibly be anything to do with it, could it? I think when you reach the point that you can wander around public space, sporting an assault rifle you either live in a completely f**ked third world hell hole, or a country that has completely f**ked up its policy on firearms. It's what happens when an activist group (NRA) has no opposition from the other side. They have to keep pushing the envelope because, without a cause with which to generate fear or outrage, there's no fundraising. The NRA - even that f***stick LaPierre - used to be a proponent of universal background checks. Once they realised there was no real opposition to the gun rights movement, though, they dropped that somewhat defensive stance and started pushing and pushing. It was only in 2008, for example, that the Supreme Court ruled that the right to bear arms applied to individuals (DC vs. Heller). Before that, the interpretation was that the 2nd amendment, in theory, applied only to militias, and individuals were getting away with it. Think about that...it was less than 10 years ago. This 2nd amendment cancer has mostly metastasised since then - almost entirely thanks to an unrestrained gun lobby and no push-back from lawmakers.
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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| Ray in Houston Houston 03 Oct 17 5.04pm |
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Originally posted by Stuk
Yep, even your playing hands Especially your playing hands.
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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| Ray in Houston Houston 03 Oct 17 5.08pm |
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Originally posted by dannyh
I'm currently serving and a marksman. IMO any automatic weapon fire on bursts of 3-4 rounds into a densely populated crowd, generally hit someone or some thing, of course accuracey is impaired on automatic fire, but even if they were aimed shots its one every two seconds with your breathing rate. The point is, anyone even my nan, with a few hours training could rain down enough rounds in a crowded area to kill a lot more than thankfully happened. Exactly. If you listen to the firing patterns on the cell phone videos, he was using prolonged bursts of 10+ rounds. From that distance, that's just indiscriminate. As to ease of use, that's one of the issues with the sale of civilian versions of military weapons. They're meant to be very easy to use so that anyone can be good at killing with them. Just point and shoot.
We don't do possession; we do defense and attack. Everything else is just wa**ing with a football. |
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 03 Oct 17 5.54pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
The Super Furry Animals have a psychedelic paint job one (or did) for festival gigs. I've danced on that.
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| Stirlingsays 03 Oct 17 6.20pm |
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The high elevation angle probably reduced the number of people he could kill with a single shot. A lower angle would have probably have been more effective to be more ghoulish about it. Or perhaps it was a trade off and he wanted the extra time to shoot before the cops got to him. It sounds like he thought it through. These time bombs are out there....if they are going to make guns easy to get....they should at least be making it harder to kill many quickly. It's weird that a civilian can have access to weapons better suited to the battlefield.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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