Grooming Gangs + Tommy Robinson Thread

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Grooming Gangs + Tommy Robinson Thread

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 09 Jul 19 2.36pm
This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle Removed as duplicate. Edited by Wisbech Eagle (09 Jul 2019 2.53pm) For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 09 Jul 19 2.36pm

This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle

Removed as duplicate.

Edited by Wisbech Eagle (09 Jul 2019 2.53pm)

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Stirlingsays 09 Jul 19 2.58pm
This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle We all can have an opinion but the point is that no opinion amounts to evidence. What amounts to evidence can be an opinion. The same 'evidence' can result in opposing opinions.....All predictable word salad and constant repeating to bore people into leaving the argument. Essentially any conviction that includes the word, 'subjective' within its charge is exceedingly doubtful. Your contention that the US system is somehow different to the UK system to the extent that ours is safe from influence but theirs isn't is so ridiculous.....Their judges and Attorney General are appointed the same as ours......They are tools of the establishment, the same as ours. Our Attorney General is a standing politician and it was he who decided to re-charge Robinson after he won his appeal. It's the very definition of a political persecution ....and you don't have the balls to admit when you're wrong. Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Jul 2019 3.01pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

09 Jul 19 2.58pm

This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

We all can have an opinion but the point is that no opinion amounts to evidence.

What amounts to evidence can be an opinion.

The same 'evidence' can result in opposing opinions.....All predictable word salad and constant repeating to bore people into leaving the argument.

Essentially any conviction that includes the word, 'subjective' within its charge is exceedingly doubtful.

Your contention that the US system is somehow different to the UK system to the extent that ours is safe from influence but theirs isn't is so ridiculous.....Their judges and Attorney General are appointed the same as ours......They are tools of the establishment, the same as ours.

Our Attorney General is a standing politician and it was he who decided to re-charge Robinson after he won his appeal.

It's the very definition of a political persecution ....and you don't have the balls to admit when you're wrong.

Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Jul 2019 3.01pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 09 Jul 19 3.07pm
This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle Originally posted by elgrande Ha ha,what like they have done for the last 15 years... You are nothing more than an apologist for the grooming gangs. You disgust me. I have never, and nor will I ever, apologise for any kind of criminal activity. What these people did deserves the full force of the law to be applied without mercy. You though have no more idea than anyone else what the authorities were really doing to combat this. It seems that there were failings by social services, themselves often under staffed and under resourced. With reporting restrictions in place we just don't know the true and full picture. What is certain is that "Robinson's" crusade hindered the investigations and threatened the success of the prosecutions. If I was an investigating officer, already facing significant challenges in bringing these people to book, I would be as mad as hell with the self appointed "exposer of the grooming gang scandal" that "Robinson" promotes himself as. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 09 Jul 19 3.07pm

This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle

Originally posted by elgrande

Ha ha,what like they have done for the last 15 years...
You are nothing more than an apologist for the grooming gangs.
You disgust me.

I have never, and nor will I ever, apologise for any kind of criminal activity. What these people did deserves the full force of the law to be applied without mercy.

You though have no more idea than anyone else what the authorities were really doing to combat this. It seems that there were failings by social services, themselves often under staffed and under resourced. With reporting restrictions in place we just don't know the true and full picture. What is certain is that "Robinson's" crusade hindered the investigations and threatened the success of the prosecutions. If I was an investigating officer, already facing significant challenges in bringing these people to book, I would be as mad as hell with the self appointed "exposer of the grooming gang scandal" that "Robinson" promotes himself as.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 09 Jul 19 3.12pm
This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle Originally posted by cryrst If TR gets a fine. How long before there are calls for an appeal as the sentence would be deemed not harsh enough by some. Would a fine satisfy you wissy and you danh? After all it will be a judges decision which we should all abide by! I don't have an opinion on what an appropriate punishment should be. I don't have all the facts that the Judge does, nor the knowledge to weigh them up and make a decision. Whatever it is I will support it. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 09 Jul 19 3.12pm

This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle

Originally posted by cryrst

If TR gets a fine.
How long before there are calls for an appeal as the sentence would be deemed not harsh enough by some.
Would a fine satisfy you wissy and you danh?
After all it will be a judges decision which we should all abide by!

I don't have an opinion on what an appropriate punishment should be. I don't have all the facts that the Judge does, nor the knowledge to weigh them up and make a decision. Whatever it is I will support it.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 09 Jul 19 3.25pm
This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle Originally posted by Stirlingsays A fine? He deserves a medal. All these excuses in trousers aren't fit to call themselves Englishmen. The man was found guilty!!!! Comments like this make me so glad that the Trumps and Farages of this world are a temporary phenomenon, which thank goodness will never get their hands near the levers of power in the UK, as they have in the USA. Johnson might be a prat but he is no Trump and certainly not Farage. When Brexit is finally done and dusted the hard core that form the nucleus of the current noise makers can retreat into their dark corners (like this forum) and chortle to their hearts content about how things ought to be, were better under Thatcher, Powell was right.The only true English patriots are us, etc etc. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 09 Jul 19 3.25pm

This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

A fine? He deserves a medal.

All these excuses in trousers aren't fit to call themselves Englishmen.

The man was found guilty!!!!

Comments like this make me so glad that the Trumps and Farages of this world are a temporary phenomenon, which thank goodness will never get their hands near the levers of power in the UK, as they have in the USA. Johnson might be a prat but he is no Trump and certainly not Farage. When Brexit is finally done and dusted the hard core that form the nucleus of the current noise makers can retreat into their dark corners (like this forum) and chortle to their hearts content about how things ought to be, were better under Thatcher, Powell was right.The only true English patriots are us, etc etc.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Jimenez SELHURSTPARKCHESTER,DA BRONX 09 Jul 19 3.36pm
This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle The man was found guilty!!!! Comments like this make me so glad that the Trumps and Farages of this world are a temporary phenomenon, which thank goodness will never get their hands near the levers of power in the UK, as they have in the USA. Johnson might be a prat but he is no Trump and certainly not Farage. When Brexit is finally done and dusted the hard core that form the nucleus of the current noise makers can retreat into their dark corners (like this forum) and chortle to their hearts content about how things ought to be, were better under Thatcher, Powell was right.The only true English patriots are us, etc etc. Shouldn't you be crown green bowling? Pro USA & Israel
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Jimenez

SELHURSTPARKCHESTER,DA BRONX 09 Jul 19 3.36pm

This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

The man was found guilty!!!!

Shouldn't you be crown green bowling?

Pro USA & Israel

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 09 Jul 19 3.45pm
This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle Originally posted by Stirlingsays What amounts to evidence can be an opinion. The same 'evidence' can result in opposing opinions.....All predictable word salad and constant repeating to bore people into leaving the argument. Essentially any conviction that includes the word, 'subjective' within its charge is exceedingly doubtful. Your contention that the US system is somehow different to the UK system to the extent that ours is safe from influence but theirs isn't is so ridiculous.....Their judges and Attorney General are appointed the same as ours......They are tools of the establishment, the same as ours. Our Attorney General is a standing politician and it was he who decided to re-charge Robinson after he won his appeal. It's the very definition of a political persecution ....and you don't have the balls to admit when you're wrong. Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Jul 2019 3.01pm) You seem obsessed by the idea that subjective questions automatically mean flawed judgements, when I suspect what you really mean is that you don't agree with the judgement. There is no logical reason why an experienced Judge cannot make an objective judgement on any question of law. They just need to establish the criteria and set measurements. Our AG might be a politician from the ruling party but he does not act politically, or alone. He has a department to advise him. In this case public interest considerations probably weighed heavily in the decision making. You see that as persecution solely because of your bias in support of the accused. Our AG is not a "tool of the establishment" at all. He is a tool of the law. In the USA the current AG Barr is behaving more like a personal attorney to Trump than as an independent AG. That hasn't always been true there but since Trump's election he has demanded personal loyalty from his appointees rather than loyalty to the constitution. Those that resist get sacked. That is not a healthy democracy. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 09 Jul 19 3.45pm

This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

What amounts to evidence can be an opinion.

The same 'evidence' can result in opposing opinions.....All predictable word salad and constant repeating to bore people into leaving the argument.

Essentially any conviction that includes the word, 'subjective' within its charge is exceedingly doubtful.

Our Attorney General is a standing politician and it was he who decided to re-charge Robinson after he won his appeal.

It's the very definition of a political persecution ....and you don't have the balls to admit when you're wrong.

Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Jul 2019 3.01pm)

You seem obsessed by the idea that subjective questions automatically mean flawed judgements, when I suspect what you really mean is that you don't agree with the judgement. There is no logical reason why an experienced Judge cannot make an objective judgement on any question of law. They just need to establish the criteria and set measurements.

Our AG might be a politician from the ruling party but he does not act politically, or alone. He has a department to advise him. In this case public interest considerations probably weighed heavily in the decision making. You see that as persecution solely because of your bias in support of the accused. Our AG is not a "tool of the establishment" at all. He is a tool of the law.

In the USA the current AG Barr is behaving more like a personal attorney to Trump than as an independent AG. That hasn't always been true there but since Trump's election he has demanded personal loyalty from his appointees rather than loyalty to the constitution. Those that resist get sacked. That is not a healthy democracy.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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becky over the moon 09 Jul 19 4.04pm
This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle I have never, and nor will I ever, apologise for any kind of criminal activity. What these people did deserves the full force of the law to be applied without mercy. You though have no more idea than anyone else what the authorities were really doing to combat this. It seems that there were failings by social services, themselves often under staffed and under resourced. With reporting restrictions in place we just don't know the true and full picture. What is certain is that "Robinson's" crusade hindered the investigations and threatened the success of the prosecutions. If I was an investigating officer, already facing significant challenges in bringing these people to book, I would be as mad as hell with the self appointed "exposer of the grooming gang scandal" that "Robinson" promotes himself as. If you listen to the Radio 4 interview that I posted a link to, according to Nazir Afsal the former Crown Prosecutor for the NE, the answer to that is nothing (for a very long time) as these girls were deemed to have freely made their own choices on sexual behaviour - even the 11 & 12 year olds. Or perhaps you may feel he is making it all up to cover up secret work. A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers
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becky

over the moon 09 Jul 19 4.04pm

This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

I have never, and nor will I ever, apologise for any kind of criminal activity. What these people did deserves the full force of the law to be applied without mercy.

You though have no more idea than anyone else what the authorities were really doing to combat this. It seems that there were failings by social services, themselves often under staffed and under resourced. With reporting restrictions in place we just don't know the true and full picture. What is certain is that "Robinson's" crusade hindered the investigations and threatened the success of the prosecutions. If I was an investigating officer, already facing significant challenges in bringing these people to book, I would be as mad as hell with the self appointed "exposer of the grooming gang scandal" that "Robinson" promotes himself as.

If you listen to the Radio 4 interview that I posted a link to, according to Nazir Afsal the former Crown Prosecutor for the NE, the answer to that is nothing (for a very long time) as these girls were deemed to have freely made their own choices on sexual behaviour - even the 11 & 12 year olds.

Or perhaps you may feel he is making it all up to cover up secret work.

A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers

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PalazioVecchio south pole 09 Jul 19 4.47pm
This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle If Tommy dies in prison , who will keep civil-life civil ? Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford
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PalazioVecchio

south pole 09 Jul 19 4.47pm

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This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle

If Tommy dies in prison , who will keep civil-life civil ?

Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford

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Hrolf The Ganger 09 Jul 19 4.53pm
This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle That we all form our opinions from our experiences and our associations is true of course. Judges no doubt do too but the difference is that they have been trained to know how to set personal opinion aside and look at things through the objective lens of the law. If you have ever experienced the way a Judge can cut through the crap and get to the heart of an issue, as I have several times, as a plaintiff I hasten to add, then you won't have failed to be impressed. The Robinson case is not just any old case. You must be trying really hard not to see the lengths the law is going to convict him of something. We are not just talking about judges here.
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Hrolf The Ganger

09 Jul 19 4.53pm

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This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

That we all form our opinions from our experiences and our associations is true of course. Judges no doubt do too but the difference is that they have been trained to know how to set personal opinion aside and look at things through the objective lens of the law. If you have ever experienced the way a Judge can cut through the crap and get to the heart of an issue, as I have several times, as a plaintiff I hasten to add, then you won't have failed to be impressed.

The Robinson case is not just any old case.

You must be trying really hard not to see the lengths the law is going to convict him of something.

We are not just talking about judges here.

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Stirlingsays 09 Jul 19 5.04pm
This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle You seem obsessed by the idea that subjective questions automatically mean flawed judgements, when I suspect what you really mean is that you don't agree with the judgement. There is no logical reason why an experienced Judge cannot make an objective judgement on any question of law. They just need to establish the criteria and set measurements. Our AG might be a politician from the ruling party but he does not act politically, or alone. He has a department to advise him. In this case public interest considerations probably weighed heavily in the decision making. You see that as persecution solely because of your bias in support of the accused. Our AG is not a "tool of the establishment" at all. He is a tool of the law. In the USA the current AG Barr is behaving more like a personal attorney to Trump than as an independent AG. That hasn't always been true there but since Trump's election he has demanded personal loyalty from his appointees rather than loyalty to the constitution. Those that resist get sacked. That is not a healthy democracy. Anyone reading your posts can see what a waste of time it is. Completely myopic and answers the flaws in their logic with pin dancing. I can't wait for that block facility. Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Jul 2019 5.04pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

09 Jul 19 5.04pm

This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Anyone reading your posts can see what a waste of time it is.

Completely myopic and answers the flaws in their logic with pin dancing.

I can't wait for that block facility.

Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Jul 2019 5.04pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Mapletree Croydon 09 Jul 19 5.29pm
This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger The Robinson case is not just any old case. You must be trying really hard not to see the lengths the law is going to convict him of something. We are not just talking about judges here. I just love the way you will buy into any old conspiracy story if it fits with your world view and it's repeated often enough. It is strange, however, that you have not looked properly into the nature of the beast Read his history VERY CAREFULLY before you heap unreserved praise upon him. And consider at what point 'the establishment' started bearing down on him. To me, he is pretty lucky to have spent as little time as he has in prison. In the US he would have been in far longer.
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Mapletree

Croydon 09 Jul 19 5.29pm

This post has been merged from a topic called 'BBC fake news - Tommy Robinson' by Midlands Eagle

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

The Robinson case is not just any old case.

You must be trying really hard not to see the lengths the law is going to convict him of something.

We are not just talking about judges here.

I just love the way you will buy into any old conspiracy story if it fits with your world view and it's repeated often enough.

It is strange, however, that you have not looked properly into the nature of the beast

Read his history VERY CAREFULLY before you heap unreserved praise upon him. And consider at what point 'the establishment' started bearing down on him. To me, he is pretty lucky to have spent as little time as he has in prison. In the US he would have been in far longer.

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