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Margaret Thatcher

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Kermit8 Flag Hevon 15 Apr 13 9.27pm Send a Private Message to Kermit8 Add Kermit8 as a friend

Quote Penge Eagle at 15 Apr 2013 9.21pm

Quote Kermit8 at 15 Apr 2013 9.18pm

Market forces in the US dictate that there are a helluva lot of gunshops. Why Obama is trying to regulate this and stifle people's freedom smacks of a commie imo.

Comparing property price to guns. Nice one Kerm!


They are connected. The more Americans that are shot dead the more housing there is that becomes available and thus prices drop. Landlords are not happy at all. Hence, their support of Obama and his freedom hating pals.

 


Big chest and massive boobs

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matt_himself Flag Matataland 15 Apr 13 10.31pm Send a Private Message to matt_himself Add matt_himself as a friend

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 9.23pm

Quote Penge Eagle at 15 Apr 2013 9.11pm

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 8.47pm

Quote Penge Eagle at 15 Apr 2013 8.25pm

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 6.56pm

This'll please Penge. Good old market forces...

[Link]

How did you manage to get your ex council house in affluent Chislehurst?


I went to an estate agents.

So let's get this straight. A council tenant/s gets an opportunity to purchase the house they live in under Maggie Thatcher's Right to Buy scheme.

Then it was sold to somebody, then you or one or more people in between.

You complain about how awful it is that social housing was sold off by Thatcher, yet you live in former social housing. You couldn't make it up!

Ordinarily, you would never be able to afford to buy in Chislehurst otherwise.

Plus, due to market forces your property would have seen multiple increases in value from the day it became private to now, especially in an affluent area. No surprise there really, but I can't see you complaining.

YOU have benefited from Thatcher's Right To Buy scheme and subsequent market forces.

So please don't complain about something then take advantage of it.


Funnily enough, the woman I bought it off didn't have a portfolio of houses or an offshore tax free bank account.


I see your point, but sometimes you have to do things against principle to get by.


The mortgage payments are about one third of what I was paying in rent. I made use of the key worker scheme to get a grant towards my mortgage. I would have been a fool not to.

Even so, I still feel it was wrong for the witch to sell off social housing and not replace it.


I stand by my comments from earlier on.

You talk the talk but don't walk the walk.

 


"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 15 Apr 13 10.50pm

Quote matt_himself at 15 Apr 2013 10.31pm

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 9.23pm

Quote Penge Eagle at 15 Apr 2013 9.11pm

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 8.47pm

Quote Penge Eagle at 15 Apr 2013 8.25pm

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 6.56pm

This'll please Penge. Good old market forces...

[Link]

How did you manage to get your ex council house in affluent Chislehurst?


I went to an estate agents.

So let's get this straight. A council tenant/s gets an opportunity to purchase the house they live in under Maggie Thatcher's Right to Buy scheme.

Then it was sold to somebody, then you or one or more people in between.

You complain about how awful it is that social housing was sold off by Thatcher, yet you live in former social housing. You couldn't make it up!

Ordinarily, you would never be able to afford to buy in Chislehurst otherwise.

Plus, due to market forces your property would have seen multiple increases in value from the day it became private to now, especially in an affluent area. No surprise there really, but I can't see you complaining.

YOU have benefited from Thatcher's Right To Buy scheme and subsequent market forces.

So please don't complain about something then take advantage of it.


Funnily enough, the woman I bought it off didn't have a portfolio of houses or an offshore tax free bank account.


I see your point, but sometimes you have to do things against principle to get by.


The mortgage payments are about one third of what I was paying in rent. I made use of the key worker scheme to get a grant towards my mortgage. I would have been a fool not to.

Even so, I still feel it was wrong for the witch to sell off social housing and not replace it.


I stand by my comments from earlier on.

You talk the talk but don't walk the walk.

If you say so.

 

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matt_himself Flag Matataland 15 Apr 13 11.02pm Send a Private Message to matt_himself Add matt_himself as a friend

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 10.50pm

Quote matt_himself at 15 Apr 2013 10.31pm

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 9.23pm

Quote Penge Eagle at 15 Apr 2013 9.11pm

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 8.47pm

Quote Penge Eagle at 15 Apr 2013 8.25pm

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 6.56pm

This'll please Penge. Good old market forces...

[Link]

How did you manage to get your ex council house in affluent Chislehurst?


I went to an estate agents.

So let's get this straight. A council tenant/s gets an opportunity to purchase the house they live in under Maggie Thatcher's Right to Buy scheme.

Then it was sold to somebody, then you or one or more people in between.

You complain about how awful it is that social housing was sold off by Thatcher, yet you live in former social housing. You couldn't make it up!

Ordinarily, you would never be able to afford to buy in Chislehurst otherwise.

Plus, due to market forces your property would have seen multiple increases in value from the day it became private to now, especially in an affluent area. No surprise there really, but I can't see you complaining.

YOU have benefited from Thatcher's Right To Buy scheme and subsequent market forces.

So please don't complain about something then take advantage of it.


Funnily enough, the woman I bought it off didn't have a portfolio of houses or an offshore tax free bank account.


I see your point, but sometimes you have to do things against principle to get by.


The mortgage payments are about one third of what I was paying in rent. I made use of the key worker scheme to get a grant towards my mortgage. I would have been a fool not to.

Even so, I still feel it was wrong for the witch to sell off social housing and not replace it.


I stand by my comments from earlier on.

You talk the talk but don't walk the walk.

If you say so.


It's an observation and I have not seen anyone forthcoming from yourself to rebate it, particularly the above.

However, if you feel that fighting the system from your keyboard in the Suburbs brings around the next revolution, I pity you further.

 


"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 15 Apr 13 11.17pm

Quote matt_himself at 15 Apr 2013 11.02pm

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 10.50pm

Quote matt_himself at 15 Apr 2013 10.31pm

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 9.23pm

Quote Penge Eagle at 15 Apr 2013 9.11pm

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 8.47pm

Quote Penge Eagle at 15 Apr 2013 8.25pm

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 6.56pm

This'll please Penge. Good old market forces...

[Link]

How did you manage to get your ex council house in affluent Chislehurst?


I went to an estate agents.

So let's get this straight. A council tenant/s gets an opportunity to purchase the house they live in under Maggie Thatcher's Right to Buy scheme.

Then it was sold to somebody, then you or one or more people in between.

You complain about how awful it is that social housing was sold off by Thatcher, yet you live in former social housing. You couldn't make it up!

Ordinarily, you would never be able to afford to buy in Chislehurst otherwise.

Plus, due to market forces your property would have seen multiple increases in value from the day it became private to now, especially in an affluent area. No surprise there really, but I can't see you complaining.

YOU have benefited from Thatcher's Right To Buy scheme and subsequent market forces.

So please don't complain about something then take advantage of it.


Funnily enough, the woman I bought it off didn't have a portfolio of houses or an offshore tax free bank account.


I see your point, but sometimes you have to do things against principle to get by.


The mortgage payments are about one third of what I was paying in rent. I made use of the key worker scheme to get a grant towards my mortgage. I would have been a fool not to.

Even so, I still feel it was wrong for the witch to sell off social housing and not replace it.


I stand by my comments from earlier on.

You talk the talk but don't walk the walk.

If you say so.


It's an observation and I have not seen anyone forthcoming from yourself to rebate it, particularly the above.

However, if you feel that fighting the system from your keyboard in the Suburbs brings around the next revolution, I pity you further.


Well if you want to waste your energy pitying me, go right ahead.

I'll carry on with my trade union work representing my fellow teachers in tribunals, actively fighting the governments proposals whilst you (finger) paint your own image of me.

 

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Penge Eagle Flag Beckenham 16 Apr 13 12.02am Send a Private Message to Penge Eagle Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Penge Eagle as a friend

So Nick, are you "profiteering" out of this then???

I'm sorry Nick, but how can anyone take you seriously if you don't practice what you preach. Your views are utterly irrelevant.

Plus you cannot back up in your own words the countless links to left wing propaganda when challenged. It's all becoming a bit of a joke now.

 

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 16 Apr 13 6.39am

Quote Penge Eagle at 16 Apr 2013 12.02am

So Nick, are you "profiteering" out of this then???

I'm sorry Nick, but how can anyone take you seriously if you don't practice what you preach. Your views are utterly irrelevant.

Plus you cannot back up in your own words the countless links to left wing propaganda when challenged. It's all becoming a bit of a joke now.


I'm not profiteering, I'm providing a home for my kids!

 

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Willo Flag South coast - west of Brighton. 16 Apr 13 8.43am Send a Private Message to Willo Add Willo as a friend

Quote nickgusset at 15 Apr 2013 11.17pm


I'll carry on with my trade union work representing my fellow teachers in tribunals,

Being a dyed-in-the-wool Tory right-winger I have engaged in many a 'Full and frank' discussion with left-wing teachers.


 

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JohnyBoy Flag 16 Apr 13 8.51am Send a Private Message to JohnyBoy Add JohnyBoy as a friend

Quote Moose at 15 Apr 2013 3.37pm

Quote jamiemartin721 at 15 Apr 2013 11.30am

Quote Plane at 15 Apr 2013 9.50am

Quote Ouzo Dan at 15 Apr 2013 8.51am

f*** the belgrano, it was an enemy vessel, when at war you kill the enemy.

I would have been disgusted if Thatcher hadn't given the order to sink it.


...Is the correct answer.

Is the wrong answer - IT WAS NOT A WAR - The UK specifcally declined a declaration of war that was its right, under UN agreement on soverign nations which we signed and help draft.

It was thus designated a conflict with an exclusion zone. It would be a crime to attack any vessel outside of the exlcusion zone.

Tactically, of course it was the right military decision to sink the Belgrano, but that doesn't mean there isn't a case to answer. Much like its tactically astute to utilise black operations against your enemy's - doesn't prevent it being murder.

I agree with her decision, but it was technically a 'war crime' and she should have been investigated for it, and potentially faced trial if there was a case to be answered.



Call me silly, but I can't understand why, when the Argentinians involved in the conflict are happy to admit that the Belgrano was a legitimate target, so many British are still making a massive deal about it. Sorry for all the Wiki copy / pasting:

Captain Bonzo, Captain of the Belgrano, wrote his memories about the sinking in the book "1093 Tripulantes del Crucero ARA General Belgrano", published in 1992. In this book he wrote that it is "improper to accept that the attack by HMS Conqueror was a treason". During an interview in 2003 he had stated that the General Belgrano was only temporarily sailing to the west at the time of the attack, and his orders were to attack any British ships which came within range of cruiser's armament.

In August 1994, an official Argentine Defence Ministry report written by armed forces auditor Eugenio Miari was released which described the sinking of the Belgrano as "a legal act of war", explaining that "acts of war can be carried out in all of the enemy's territory" and "they can also take place in those areas over which no state can claim sovereignty, in international waters."

La Nación published a reader's letter from Admiral Enrique Molina Pico (head of the Argentine Navy in the 1990s) in 2005 in which Pico wrote that the Belgrano was part of an operation that posed a real threat to the British task force, but was holding off for tactical reasons. Pico added that "To leave the exclusion zone was not to leave the combat zone to enter a protected area".

Methinks if it hadn't been Thatcher who had given the order, the brouhaha might never have been so great...


I have heard it all now - using Wikipedia or the Daily Mail to justify what happened. As has been alluded to that's like using the Widgery report to justify the Bloody Sunday shootings.
And Mr Stirlings point that no-one fights for the UN HMMM! My father represented the UN during the Congo crisis of 1961, one of a hotch-potch of soldiers from non aligned countries that were sent to establish a peace in central Africa. 'Fighting to keep the peace may be a contradiction but so is an army that refuses to defend itself or civilians....as per Srebenica where Dutch UN soldiers basically stood aside when 700 muslim men and boys were massacred. My fathers UN force were told that they could not fire unless fired upon......and then they were fired on. So they fought back to prevent the civilian population they were serving from being wiped out. It ended up in a 5 day continuous siege (no sleep) and was only ended by a brokered ceasefire when Dag Hammerskjold's plane got shot down. My father was then a POW for 5.5 weeks. During that time they were informed by amnesty international that a suspected 'war crime' had been committed against the Kantanganese army by a group of Indian UN personnel where they allegedly captured three of the soldiers (all boy soldiers) that had 'allegedly' killed one of their brothers' breaking their limbs then throwing them off the 4-storey PO building in Elizabethville....leaving them 3 days to die. My father (who was 17 cos he forged his birth certificate) and the 200 or so others that were imprisoned at the time realised that this put them in incredible danger as an atrocity committed by one side is equally likely to be committed by the other - which in the case of the Congo included male rape and cannibalism - THAT'S WHY THE GENEVA CONVENTION WAS SET UP. In my fathers case they were told they would be shot dead by firing squad. The leaders of the UN and Amnesty pleaded with the Katangan secession leaders (Moise Tshombie) that it was a rogue element that allegedly committed the war crime and would be dealt with by military tribunal - Tshombie eventually backed down as he wanted future international recognition for his Katangan state. I have researched this conflict and indeed WW1 extensively and have indeed written a book about it, interviewing many of those who were caught up in the active service for the UN, also questioning them about the alleged war crime by the Indian UN personnel...nb.its actually quite difficult to find soldiers who have genuinely been involved in active service as it is estimated that only one in 28 sent off to theatres of war actually engages in combat (it was 1 in 23 in the Korean war)
The answers I received and my point is that a war crime or atrocity puts the soldiers at risk and that is why I question Thatcher's rationale and reason for an alleged atrocity as she put British soldiers lives at more risk and arguably extended the war.
When Thatcher was alive it was impossible to bring her to an international court, the UK would just never have allowed it but now that she is dead I think it appropriate that there is an independent judicial review. I am reasonably convinced (85% which is about as sure as you can be in law) that she would be found guilty....and that compensation should be paid to the victims families. Lastly can I just re-iterate that I supported the Falklands war, and was as relieved as anyone when the Falklands were reclaimed, but I will never support a war crime or an atrocity....and although some Holmesdale front or armchair generals may support them I can assure you that any sane soldier sent on active service prays that both sides upholds the Geneva convention

 

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gambler Flag Kent 16 Apr 13 8.56am Send a Private Message to gambler Add gambler as a friend

Quote Penge Eagle at 16 Apr 2013 12.02am

So Nick, are you "profiteering" out of this then???

I'm sorry Nick, but how can anyone take you seriously if you don't practice what you preach. Your views are utterly irrelevant.

Plus you cannot back up in your own words the countless links to left wing propaganda when challenged. It's all becoming a bit of a joke now.

Absolute rubbish.
So cos he didnt agree with thatchers/tory policy, he shouldn't buy his own home, or at the very least an ex council house?
What nonsense.
His views are "irrelevant"?! Why cos they're not the same as yours?!
You can disagree with policies but you still have to live your life after they are implemented.

 

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Stirlingsays Flag 16 Apr 13 9.11am Send a Private Message to Stirlingsays Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add Stirlingsays as a friend

Quote JohnyBoy at 16 Apr 2013 8.51am

And Mr Stirlings point that no-one fights for the UN HMMM! My father represented the UN during the Congo crisis of 1961, one of a hotch-potch of soldiers from non aligned countries that were sent to establish a peace in central Africa.


Well, maybe your father saw himself as 'fighting' for the UN but he's more the exception than the rule.

My family is closely connected to the military since WW2, specifically the 17/21 Lancers before they became apart of the Royal Armoured core. It's been the norm for males down two of our family lines to join up... usually since the seventies choosing that regiment, which one of my uncles was in during WW2. My eyesight was the only thing that kept me out of it.

My older brother has been on several peace keeping missions and I can ensure you.....It's the same as it ever was. He and his unit regard themselves as very much British soldiers not UN soldiers as such...It's a role they are performing. What they are doing is fulfilling a commitment made by their government....Their paymasters.

The structure is the same, your commanders at unit level are the same....The UN are a political/human rights institution....I know those lefties who hate nationalism or flag waving don't like it but the reality is that no one 'fights' for the UN.....Your frigging 'peacekeeping soldiers' are paid by their own Governments...Well, the western ones are.

Edited by Stirlingsays (16 Apr 2013 9.21am)

 


'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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DanH Flag SW2 16 Apr 13 9.17am Send a Private Message to DanH Add DanH as a friend

Quote gambler at 16 Apr 2013 8.56am

Quote Penge Eagle at 16 Apr 2013 12.02am

So Nick, are you "profiteering" out of this then???

I'm sorry Nick, but how can anyone take you seriously if you don't practice what you preach. Your views are utterly irrelevant.

Plus you cannot back up in your own words the countless links to left wing propaganda when challenged. It's all becoming a bit of a joke now.

Absolute rubbish.
So cos he didnt agree with thatchers/tory policy, he shouldn't buy his own home, or at the very least an ex council house?
What nonsense.
His views are "irrelevant"?! Why cos they're not the same as yours?!
You can disagree with policies but you still have to live your life after they are implemented.


Penge has a weird thing about "practicing what you preach" in that he believes if you are remotely left wing you should give anything above the median wage you earn away, not profit from anything in the slightest and live life like a communist.

 

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