Dislike the Welsh? Following that silly thread about supposed ‘racism’ at Palace (yeah, right, like I’m gonna take that serious!), I was interested in a lot of the comments made on the subject of ‘racism’. I declined to get involved in the thread coz I think the whole Dave Lee thing is a boring wind up and I don’t wanna lend credence to it.

My point is; why does colour of skin seem to be the only valid criteria in the ‘racism’ row?

Someone mentioned a certain French arsehole in the thread and seemed to advocate that ‘racism’ against the French was OK and in my opinion, it certainly is, I wholeheartedly agree, but nobody pulled him up or got offended in the least… why? Why is that? Is it the same reason the English happily rip into the Welsh or the Scots, and visa-versa, but would be offended with the same treatment of Africans or ****stanis? Put it like this; I heard tons of pretty offensive anti-Welsh songs being sung at the Norwich game that were aimed at a certain toothless Welsh b****** who was at the time playing an integral part in the beating of a poor Palace side and people all around me were laughing away happily at what was being sung, me included, but why is that? How can this kind of ‘racism’ be so easily excused? Why were the offending choir not shown the door in the midst of football’s gallant crusade on ‘racism’? How can this ‘racism’ aimed at a people that were displaced from their homelands by us English be OK? These people who’s mother-tongue was banned for hundreds of years? These people who have fought against us and with us? No? Not too sure? Ok, I’ll tell ya why! It’s because the targets of the abuse are white and that makes it alright! That makes us all feel comfortable. Just fine and dandy! But how can it be ‘racism’ when they’re white I hear you cry? Easily, I reply a little too smugly; I’m from Saxon stock, as are the majority of white English folk, the blood that flows through most of our veins is Germanic, the Welsh and Scots on the other hand, are Celts! A different race entirely! Different culture, different language, different people! So what I heard at Norwich was ‘racism’, pure and simple! ‘Racism’ overlooked by my fellow fans, the Police and anyone else who happened to be in earshot of the excellent ‘Welsh shag each other’ song. And yet, much that I enjoyed the song, I can’t help but wonder why ‘racism’ against people of the same hew is deemed to be ok and yet racism against people of a different shade causes such involuntary frothing at the mouth reactions from a lot of you? Now let me just point out that we’re talking ‘racism’ here, not racial hatred. So, is ‘racism’ the dangerous and evil hot potato they say it is or not? Make yer bleedin’ minds up will ya, coz I’m… confused!

Just a thought.

My Rocksteady band...
[Link]
[Link]
IT'S NOT SKA, IT'S ROCKSTEADY!

My point is; why does colour of skin seem to be the only valid criteria in the ‘racism’ row?

It's a complex question. But a simple answer.

It isn't.

It is racist to discriminate on the basis of colour, racial origin, etc.

But it is based on the premise that these differences make people better/worse than one another.

And they don't. There are so many more valid reasons to hate people other than the arbitary fact of where they or their ancestors came from.

Put a Glide in your Stride, and Dip in your Hip,
Come on over to the Mothership, baby

[Link] Transformation is Happening

Scotland hate the English and the English hate the Scottish.

till I die!

An' I wanna move the town to the clash city rockers

Excellent response slugs, in fact your response IS the answer, well it's the answer I was fishing for because it hits the nail square on the head.
My argument is that we're using the wrong word to describe racial hatred and racial discrimination. The word racism has been redefined in modern terms to describe the above things and I think it generalises the issues, blurs the edges and places basically good people in the firing line.

Example: A neighbourly old lady living in the East End of London, no matter how much she tries, just does not like the Bangladeshi people that have taken over her community. She's lived in the same street for seventy eight years, the very same house she was born in, she's lived through the blitz and the Black shirts, and little by little she's seen her community broken down as her neighbours and friends have moved away or died. Her street is very different now. She's met one or two Bangladeshi people that have seemed quite nice, mostly the younger ones, but on the whole, she doesn't much like their ways, she can't understand what they're saying half the time and the women, with their faces hidden behind those spooky black masks won't talk to her at all. It's not a political stance, she aint about to vote for the BNP, she votes labour, always has, always will, it's just the way she feels, she can't help it, she's not proud of it, it's not very Christian, but what can she do?

So in today’s terms, she's a racist and that places her in the same league as full-on nazi's and society condemns this hard-working clean-living lady as something that must be eradicated. If her truth is ever found out, she'll be the victim of bricks through windows verbal abuse and all manner of blind unfounded hatred.

My point is; the word 'racism' is a sweeping generalisation which is every bit as dangerous as the subject matter it purposes to represent

My Rocksteady band...
[Link]
[Link]
IT'S NOT SKA, IT'S ROCKSTEADY!

At the time of the Matthew Simmons / Cantona incident, MS was branded a racist for his alleged anti french comments to Cantona. If MS IS a racist then there are a high percentage of racists in society as a whole and there were a large number of racists in the main stand that night.

This also raises another question. Was the comment to Mr Cantona 'you french ****' a racist sentiment or simply a statement of fact?

It's an excellent post Pete and one that certainly got me thinking....

In today's society (lad culture)I think it has just become more acceptable to ridicule someone because of their nationality as part of 'jovial banter' amongst all types of people including football supporters. You can get away with saying almost anything at a football match that you wouldn't even dream of saying in everyday life and it's looked upon as a laugh and a joke because it's all part of the banter that goes on between two sets of football supporters. Being German is frowned upon by the English because of the war and vice-versa and 95% of the time it's just laughed off. You see and hear jokes made about Germans / Scottish / French on TV and it's considered perfectly acceptable. The odd person will take acception to it. We stereotype Brighton fans as being homosexual because we all know Brighton has the largest gay population. Football is a masculine game and being gay is looked upon as being feminine which means it's the obvious wind up to all masculine Brighton fans and once again is just laughed off.

But when it comes down to the colour of skin it becomes nastier and more personal and that you're being singled out amongst everyone else around you. If it's at a football match and you're insulting a black person either on the opposing team or in the away fans section it just doesn't make sense because your own fans and team also have black players.

It's hard to sum up in words what you feel about racism but I've tried as clearly as I can.

Edited by Selhurst Stallion (28 Nov 2002 12:27pm)

"Friend first, Boss second..Probably chilled out entertainer third" - David Brent 2002.