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topcat Holmesdale / Surbiton 25 Apr 18 5.26pm | |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
I tend to agree with Lyman. Unless this policeman could tell the suspect wasn't holding a gun I'm not sure it's a good idea.....Are we going to start hearing from some people that they shouldn't shoot unless shot at? In this situation it would have been highly likely the officer would have been killed. He took a big risk. Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Apr 2018 5.16pm) Didn't the bloke have a phone on his hand, which I assume the policeman could see wasn't a gun? I agree that if there is a danger to anyone then best to shoot first.
It's 106 miles to Chicago, we got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark... and we're wearing sunglasses. |
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Stuk Top half 25 Apr 18 5.27pm | |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
I tend to agree with Lyman. Unless this policeman could tell the suspect wasn't holding a gun I'm not sure it's a good idea.....Are we going to start hearing from some people that they shouldn't shoot unless shot at? In this situation it would have been highly likely the officer would have been killed. He took a big risk. Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Apr 2018 5.16pm) It's his job to make that judgement, and he clearly is very good at it. Whether you think it's a good idea is irrelevant, as is Lyman's opinion. If you're a policeman, in any country, you shouldn't shoot someone unless it's absolutely necessary. It's a last resort not a first resort. In the US they regularly shoot a suspect if they shout "stop" and the suspect runs away. That is not good policing and of course there has been numerous incidents where innocent people have been shot and killed.
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Stirlingsays 25 Apr 18 5.29pm | |
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Originally posted by topcat
Didn't the bloke have a phone on his hand, which I assume the policeman could see wasn't a gun? I agree that if there is a danger to anyone then best to shoot first. Must have great eyesight, also the guy reached to his pocket twice with quick movements. Took a chance.....turned out well. Obviously I have no problem with this guy being taken alive but the Policeman would have been totally justified in shooting.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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Stirlingsays 25 Apr 18 5.37pm | |
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Originally posted by Stuk
It's his job to make that judgement, and he clearly is very good at it. Whether you think it's a good idea is irrelevant, as is Lyman's opinion. Firstly 'great judgement'. It was a binary choice, to shoot or not to shoot. Flipping a coin and being right could be called 'great judgement'. You simply don't know upon what basis this Policeman made the call not to shoot. Secondly, my point and Lyman's implication is that it is dangerous if people start expecting Police to take unrealistic chances with their own lives. Every year Police are murdered because we pay them to put themselves into risky situations. Like Tomcat suggests, if the Policeman was sure then was no danger and this is good policing....otherwise he was taking a chance with his life. We don't know yet. Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Apr 2018 5.39pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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Stuk Top half 25 Apr 18 6.49pm | |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Firstly 'great judgement'. It was a binary choice, to shoot or not to shoot. Flipping a coin and being right could be called 'great judgement'. You simply don't know upon what basis this Policeman made the call not to shoot. Secondly, my point and Lyman's implication is that it is dangerous if people start expecting Police to take unrealistic chances with their own lives. Every year Police are murdered because we pay them to put themselves into risky situations. Like Tomcat suggests, if the Policeman was sure then was no danger and this is good policing....otherwise he was taking a chance with his life. We don't know yet. Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Apr 2018 5.39pm) You say it was a binary judgement and then go on to say we don't know yet, which is rather contradictory. Saying it was a coin toss is being flippant, for want of a better word, about it. Who said they expect the police to take unrealistic chances with their own lives too? The last thing I expect the police to do is shoot someone just because it's easier than bothering to assess the situation and them acting accordingly. Had he shot at the guy while he was still ploughing along in the vehicle nobody would be saying "well that was uncalled for".
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Stirlingsays 25 Apr 18 7.40pm | |
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Originally posted by Stuk
You say it was a binary judgement and then go on to say we don't know yet, which is rather contradictory. Saying it was a coin toss is being flippant, for want of a better word, about it. Who said they expect the police to take unrealistic chances with their own lives too? The last thing I expect the police to do is shoot someone just because it's easier than bothering to assess the situation and them acting accordingly. Had he shot at the guy while he was still ploughing along in the vehicle nobody would be saying "well that was uncalled for". The point I wanted to make was a relatively minor one. I know on these forums that disagreeing on something can seem a bit confrontational but I'm not trying to be. I felt Lyman had a point. Still, the Policeman made a call that turned out well. If he had been wrong and he'd been shot and killed and this nut had gone onto shooting others I guess we would feel differently about it....still, like I said, great eyesight or whatever it was. Now the Canadian tax payer can pay for locking this fruit cake up for the rest of his natural. Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Apr 2018 7.41pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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Stuk Top half 26 Apr 18 12.27pm | |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
The point I wanted to make was a relatively minor one. I know on these forums that disagreeing on something can seem a bit confrontational but I'm not trying to be. I felt Lyman had a point. Still, the Policeman made a call that turned out well. If he had been wrong and he'd been shot and killed and this nut had gone onto shooting others I guess we would feel differently about it....still, like I said, great eyesight or whatever it was. Now the Canadian tax payer can pay for locking this fruit cake up for the rest of his natural. Edited by Stirlingsays (25 Apr 2018 7.41pm) The police do not have a "duty" to kill anyone when it's not required. He is "assuming", while the policeman was using his senses. Eyes, ears, etc.
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