Someone should write a memo about sending memos.
Best to annoy people face to face.

Watched this video of an Bloomberg interview with Damore. As far as I'm concerned this interview highlights most of what is wrong with the philosophies that now dominate our media, educational and especially tech industries.

I urge you to watch the video. The last question really hits upon the lack of understanding.

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This guy is a force for good who doesn't push anything that isn't backed by science research. He never and doesn't have an issue with diversity like most sensible people.

Yet his views have been massively misrepresented and demonsised by people with little understanding or who prefer ideology over reality.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Although we should also be wary of people who specifically select their scientific evidence. Linking biological evidence present an argument about social phenomena should be questioned given that biology deals primarily with species, rather than groups and individuals.

But that's what I mean by call him on 'his bulls***' - Its important when your dealing with scientific evidence to counter it with the critical analysis of other scientific evidence. It would be presumptuous beyond belief to just accept that biological differences represent the difference between genders in the tech industry as a means of dismissing sociological evidence.

But it must be considered a factor. When someone presents an argument like that, you have to engage in the discourse, not just shut them down.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
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I pretty much agree with the tenets of most of your reply. I only really significantly differ with two points....Firstly your piece above.

This is the 'some groups are more equal than others' idea. This is the same line that 'black people can't be racist because they have no power' argument. It's harmful nonsense.

For a start I dispute this line that women have less power within society. Lets even ignore the 'hand that rocks the cradle, rules the world' concept. What I do accept is that the realities of gender difference lead to different power balances. Some we can fairly encourage to be more even and others action leads to reverse sexism or racism with race.

What is important is choice. What is important is that we live in a society that doesn't care about your gender in relation to the profession you choose. All it cares about is that you met the standards desired for the profession. This is a view that most of us can stand behind.

But women have no power???

In many ways men do have a better playing field but women are also the beneficiaries of many unequal societal preferences that benefit them in preference to men....divorce, custody of children, sentencing for the same crimes,...we even mentioned circumcision the other day...women dominate plenty of professions and imprint gender attitudes within them...This is just off the top of my head...Now some of these practices I agree with (due to general differences in biology between the sexes) and others are cultural and strictly not fair.

Whatever the case may be in the particular situation the attitude that women can do and say things and men can't because....power....that is actually sexism is it not?

The second point I take a slight issue with is when you replied to my point that I could complain about your complaining.

Well, in the point you were referring to...if I remember correctly....that, 'men are better at management'. Well that's a pretty vague statement. Taken as 'all' men it's just wrong. Taken as 'more men than women' well scientific research could both back that up and dismiss it depending upon what type of management being referred too.....It's also just a percentages argument.

So unless this guy was being a real jerk about it and continually picking on a women or deliberately creating an adversarial atmosphere then it would probably be better to view comments like that as just the usual attitudes that some people hold on gender. It's their view and people shouldn't be offended by casual remarks or opinions.

By being 'offended' some people are looking to use attitudes to demonise and close down others and push their own agendas.....hey, people get sacked for 'wrong-think'.

Offence has its place but in today's environment its weight is disproportionate to its influence.

Edited by Stirlingsays (14 Aug 2017 3.44pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Oddly its rarely the prejudice that offends me, its more the stupidity of the statement. Racists general don't offend me because of their views, its usually because they're ability to rationally present those views is incredibly poor, and fraught with contradictions and a lack of reasonable evidence (usually relying on third hand anectodal evidence).

Sacking someone should be a last resort, where people are generally just jerks. Not this guy here, but the kind of guy who won't temper their attitude, despite constant complaints from different employees.

My experience is that women make different managers than men; but that both women and men can both be s**t managers, and I've worked with excellent male and female managers. Working in IT, my experience is that women generally make better managers - but that's biased because I've only had two female managers and they were both very good.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]