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Uphill Bedford 20 Jan 14 5.37pm | |
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It is quite simple:
Man and boy Palace since my first game in 1948 sitting on my dad's shoulders |
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jamiemartin721 Reading 21 Jan 14 4.46pm | |
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Quote Ian J at 20 Jan 2014 5.28pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 20 Jan 2014 4.53pm
Crowd Psychology, its about the expression of aspects of self along shared identified lines. To an extent this may well be hardwired into us biologically, but Team sports generally tie into our need to belong to a tribe. Its more emphasised in football than other sports because football has much strong emotional highs and lows, because chance dominates the outcome more than other sports, and the difference between a 'win and a loss' are very tight, making individuals tense, and thus the crowd tense, and then feeding back into the crowd. Unsurprisingly, its football not tennis or cricket that are associated with violence (itself tied to the tribalism, the tense atmosphere and the adoption of localised rivalries). I'm afraid that I don't agree with you. Any cricket fan who goes regularly to Test Matches or even One Day Internationals will tell you that they can be equally emotional with the same highs and lows that you get in football. Unlike football though fans of opposing teams happily sit next to each other, talk to each other and congratulate each other and whilst winning in cricket is as important to the fan as it is in football you don't get the same sorts of aggravation and violence that you do in football. Whilst I disagree with you I can't give an alternative reason for the difference as football seems to appeal to peoples' baser instincts but I don't know why The difference I would posit is tension, football's most common score is 1-1 and 2-1, that can change in an instant, even if you're team has been s**te all game. Cricket, you generally know if your going to win after the fourth batsman. Plus you can see a recovery or collapse coming, generally speaking. Where as football is full of situations where you suddenly draw level in a mad five minutes. The rollercoaster effect is much more pronounced. Also cricket doesn't really have the same level of local focus. The sport is a 'gentlemans sport' without the kind of inter-local rivalry you see in Football. Theres a correlation between the idea of rivalry and levels of violence in sport, especially where 'banter' among fans is common. When you look at Cricket on a professional level, its county vs county level or international, football is against the team your c**t of a boss supports, or that loud mouth s**t in the pub. It is personal, local, changeable and very intense. Cricket brings out the best in fans, because identification with a team is along very different group identity concepts than football, and that manifests differently.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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Part Time James 21 Jan 14 4.48pm | |
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Quote jamiemartin721 at 20 Jan 2014 4.55pm
Quote Part Time James at 20 Jan 2014 3.47pm
Maybe it reverts us to a deep seated need to be tribal and face off against others. I was reflecting the other day, if no one I ever encountered liked football, would I feel so up/down after a weekend of football results? I follow the NHL Ice Hockey as well as football and when my chosen team loses I feel slightly miffed but because I know very few people who even know what the NHL is, it doesn't harm my mood so much. Indeed, and in Canada the reverse is probably true. They're quite tribal about their Ice Hockey and trouble between fans occurs. Oh yeah, definitely. During the playoffs last year I developed a hatred for the Senators which I just sort of absorbed from the TV. But that disproves my point a bit and digresses from the thread. Sorry folks!
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Midlands Eagle 22 Jan 14 6.30am | |
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Quote jamiemartin721 at 21 Jan 2014 4.46pm
Also cricket doesn't really have the same level of local focus. The sport is a 'gentlemans sport' without the kind of inter-local rivalry you see in Football. Theres a correlation between the idea of rivalry and levels of violence in sport, especially where 'banter' among fans is common. The TV cameras tend to focus on the old boys in their blazers dozing off in the sunshine at test matches but they are in the minority as the vast majority of cricket spectators are ordinary working class people who probably go to the footie on Winter. You are probably correct about the local rivalries being less intense in County Cricket but not so in certain international games as the rivalry between English and Australian is huge and if you want banter you only have to listen to the Barmy Army who are probably the country's leading banter experts but although some of their songs can be cutting and cruel they are always amusing.
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Pete53 Hassocks 22 Jan 14 12.20pm | |
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Many times I have wondered why I get so worked up about the fortunes of my team (Palace of course) I have no say in the running of the club. I have never met any of the players. In a few years, or less, most will have moved on and there will be a different manager. So it's not down to any direct personal involvement. The outcome of a Palace game will have no effect on my material well-being. It won't mean more or less money in my bank account at the end of the month. So why should their performance on a Saturday affect my mood during the following week? Why should I care and get so worked up at a match, or find the tension almost unbearable when listening to a radio commentary. What is it about the entity we call Crystal Palace( or any other club) that engenders our slavish devotion? Possibly it is some unresolved immaturity amongst us football fanatics whereby we are able to find fulfillment in the activities of a bunch of strangers kicking a ball around? Perhaps it satisfies a need to feel part of something which we don't have satisfied in other realms of our day to day lives. Possibly it allows us emotionally constipated males a rare opportunity to let rip - to scream, shout and cry. In the end I really don't know why the outcome of a football match can mean so much to me . It shouldn't do but by heck it does.
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thommo1 Peckham 22 Jan 14 12.39pm | |
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Great post Pete, we all feel the same I am sure but we cant answer why either, I feel you are probably right on a few of your thoughts.. There must have been studys done as its not your stero typical person ie a 'football hooligan' who is caught in this trap. lol
DJ John Peel once said: "Supporting Palace has a certain cult value, like pretending that some Peruvian rock band is the best in the world." |
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Moose In the sewer pipe... 22 Jan 14 12.47pm | |
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Quote Ian J at 22 Jan 2014 6.30am
Quote jamiemartin721 at 21 Jan 2014 4.46pm
Also cricket doesn't really have the same level of local focus. The sport is a 'gentlemans sport' without the kind of inter-local rivalry you see in Football. Theres a correlation between the idea of rivalry and levels of violence in sport, especially where 'banter' among fans is common. The TV cameras tend to focus on the old boys in their blazers dozing off in the sunshine at test matches but they are in the minority as the vast majority of cricket spectators are ordinary working class people who probably go to the footie on Winter. You are probably correct about the local rivalries being less intense in County Cricket but not so in certain international games as the rivalry between English and Australian is huge and if you want banter you only have to listen to the Barmy Army who are probably the country's leading banter experts but although some of their songs can be cutting and cruel they are always amusing.
Try standing near Bay 13 at the MCG during an Ashes Test Match and then arguing that the rivalry is not intense.
Goodness is what you do. Not who you pray to. |
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hursteagle 22 Jan 14 12.53pm | |
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I've often thought about this... and have never got to the bottom of it! It makes even less sense when you compare football to other 'forms of entertainment'. Take films... if you went to see Harry Potter 1 at your local cinema and it wasn't very good then you might chance Harry Potter 2. But if that also wasn't very good, the offer of doing a 300 mile round trip on a Tuesday night to see Harry Potter 3 wouldn't be very attractive! But Palace could lose 5-0 at home to Yeovil, lose 5-0 at home to Swindon, but that wouldn't stop me heading up to Walsall on a wet Tuesday night in December!!!
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