VAT on school fees

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VAT on school fees

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JRW2 Dulwich 08 Jun 24 3.09pm
Slightly off topic, the fee-charging schools should swallow the extra 20% by cutting their staff to pupil ratio. I attended such a school in the 50s (on a free place I hasten to add), where there were 1400 pupils and 70 teaching staff, i.e., 20:1. There are now almost the same number of pupils and 230 teachers, i.e., 6:1. The pupil to teacher ratio in the state secondary sector is 17:1.
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JRW2

Dulwich 08 Jun 24 3.09pm

Slightly off topic, the fee-charging schools should swallow the extra 20% by cutting their staff to pupil ratio. I attended such a school in the 50s (on a free place I hasten to add), where there were 1400 pupils and 70 teaching staff, i.e., 20:1. There are now almost the same number of pupils and 230 teachers, i.e., 6:1. The pupil to teacher ratio in the state secondary sector is 17:1.

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jonesy surrey 08 Jun 24 4.23pm
Hello all, Long time reader/ (probably) first time poster. Doesn’t each pupil in the Independent sector save the State about £7k? They will need to generate a lot of tax to cover it. It will also be interesting to see if without the need to show charitable work if these schools start charging the State sector the going rate to use their facilities rather than letting them in for free? It would probably put access to facilities beyond the reach of a lot of primary schools. I wonder if they will then add VAT to the Private health care system? Maybe they already do!
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jonesy

surrey 08 Jun 24 4.23pm

Hello all,

Long time reader/ (probably) first time poster.

Doesn’t each pupil in the Independent sector save the State about £7k? They will need to generate a lot of tax to cover it.

It will also be interesting to see if without the need to show charitable work if these schools start charging the State sector the going rate to use their facilities rather than letting them in for free? It would probably put access to facilities beyond the reach of a lot of primary schools.

I wonder if they will then add VAT to the Private health care system? Maybe they already do!

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highbury eagle Islington 12 Jun 24 9.02pm
But Grammar schools operate within the state system. They don't charge fees, they simply have a selective entry system. Originally posted by ASCPFC It's not really a one size fits all situation. A lot of Grammar schools, for example, take in a large percentage of non fee paying kids and give them a better education. They are sometimes ran on a non profit basis with profits (if there are any) being used for more scholarships or investment in facilities that often the wider community can access. However, we also have places like Eton and Gordonstoun which are the elite - however, in those I think many have the total wrong idea about who goes there. It used to be the government and royalty set but it's a lot more diverse these days. I would agree with places like Eton and Gordonstoun being charged more - they often cry poverty which seems unlikely. However, your local grammar school is likely a completely different case. Life is the same as it always will be, Easy as picking foxes from a tree. M Bolan
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highbury eagle

Islington 12 Jun 24 9.02pm

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But Grammar schools operate within the state system. They don't charge fees, they simply have a selective entry system.

Originally posted by ASCPFC

It's not really a one size fits all situation. A lot of Grammar schools, for example, take in a large percentage of non fee paying kids and give them a better education. They are sometimes ran on a non profit basis with profits (if there are any) being used for more scholarships or investment in facilities that often the wider community can access. However, we also have places like Eton and Gordonstoun which are the elite - however, in those I think many have the total wrong idea about who goes there. It used to be the government and royalty set but it's a lot more diverse these days. I would agree with places like Eton and Gordonstoun being charged more - they often cry poverty which seems unlikely. However, your local grammar school is likely a completely different case.

Life is the same as it always will be,
Easy as picking foxes from a tree.
M Bolan

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HKOwen Hong Kong 17 Jun 24 6.21am
The VAT on school fees is ideology driven, financially it makes no sense. Labour have no idea how many students might need to change to the state sector, particularly in areas of special needs. No good having a place available in Devon if you live in Suffolk. Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.
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HKOwen

Hong Kong 17 Jun 24 6.21am

The VAT on school fees is ideology driven, financially it makes no sense. Labour have no idea how many students might need to change to the state sector, particularly in areas of special needs. No good having a place available in Devon if you live in Suffolk.

Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.

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HKOwen Hong Kong 17 Jun 24 6.27am
Originally posted by jonesy Hello all, Long time reader/ (probably) first time poster. Doesn’t each pupil in the Independent sector save the State about £7k? They will need to generate a lot of tax to cover it. It will also be interesting to see if without the need to show charitable work if these schools start charging the State sector the going rate to use their facilities rather than letting them in for free? It would probably put access to facilities beyond the reach of a lot of primary schools. I wonder if they will then add VAT to the Private health care system? Maybe they already do! Insurance premiums are currently not subject to VAT, I would not be surprised if that comes in. Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.
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HKOwen

Hong Kong 17 Jun 24 6.27am

Originally posted by jonesy

Hello all,

Long time reader/ (probably) first time poster.

Doesn’t each pupil in the Independent sector save the State about £7k? They will need to generate a lot of tax to cover it.

I wonder if they will then add VAT to the Private health care system? Maybe they already do!

Insurance premiums are currently not subject to VAT, I would not be surprised if that comes in.

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Eden Eagle Kent 17 Jun 24 6.31am
Originally posted by HKOwen Insurance premiums are currently not subject to VAT, I would not be surprised if that comes in. Insurance premiums are taxed under Insurance Premium Tax which is charged at 12%
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Eden Eagle

Kent 17 Jun 24 6.31am

Originally posted by HKOwen

Insurance premiums are currently not subject to VAT, I would not be surprised if that comes in.

Insurance premiums are taxed under Insurance Premium Tax which is charged at 12%

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YT Oxford 17 Jun 24 7.16am
Originally posted by HKOwen The VAT on school fees is ideology driven, financially it makes no sense. Labour have no idea how many students might need to change to the state sector, particularly in areas of special needs. No good having a place available in Devon if you live in Suffolk. Numerous party policies are ideology-driven. We all have the chance to vote on them. It seems that lots of people are willing to vote for this onr, including many who ideologically have always voted Conservative. That's how democracy works. You could argue that leaving the EU was driven by ideology. I personally didn't vote for it, but I accept that the majority of those who voted DID do so; so be it. Palace since 19 August 1972. Palace 1 (Tony Taylor) Liverpool 1 (Emlyn Hughes)
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Oxford 17 Jun 24 7.16am

Originally posted by HKOwen

The VAT on school fees is ideology driven, financially it makes no sense. Labour have no idea how many students might need to change to the state sector, particularly in areas of special needs. No good having a place available in Devon if you live in Suffolk.

Numerous party policies are ideology-driven. We all have the chance to vote on them. It seems that lots of people are willing to vote for this onr, including many who ideologically have always voted Conservative. That's how democracy works. You could argue that leaving the EU was driven by ideology. I personally didn't vote for it, but I accept that the majority of those who voted DID do so; so be it.

Palace since 19 August 1972. Palace 1 (Tony Taylor) Liverpool 1 (Emlyn Hughes)

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HKOwen Hong Kong 17 Jun 24 8.35am
But, the policy makes no financial or educational sense. I agree that won't stop it's implementation Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.
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HKOwen

Hong Kong 17 Jun 24 8.35am

But, the policy makes no financial or educational sense.

I agree that won't stop it's implementation

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HKOwen Hong Kong 17 Jun 24 8.39am
Originally posted by Eden Eagle Insurance premiums are taxed under Insurance Premium Tax which is charged at 12% Yes, not VAT though yet Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.
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HKOwen

Hong Kong 17 Jun 24 8.39am

Originally posted by Eden Eagle

Insurance premiums are taxed under Insurance Premium Tax which is charged at 12%

Yes, not VAT though yet

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HKOwen Hong Kong 17 Jun 24 8.41am
Originally posted by YT Numerous party policies are ideology-driven. We all have the chance to vote on them. It seems that lots of people are willing to vote for this onr, including many who ideologically have always voted Conservative. That's how democracy works. You could argue that leaving the EU was driven by ideology. I personally didn't vote for it, but I accept that the majority of those who voted DID do so; so be it. What is the source for the claim many who have always supported Conservatives support this particular policy? I have not seen that poll or survey Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.
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HKOwen

Hong Kong 17 Jun 24 8.41am

Originally posted by YT

What is the source for the claim many who have always supported Conservatives support this particular policy? I have not seen that poll or survey

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EverybodyDannsNow SE19 17 Jun 24 10.38am
Originally posted by HKOwen The VAT on school fees is ideology driven, financially it makes no sense. Labour have no idea how many students might need to change to the state sector, particularly in areas of special needs. No good having a place available in Devon if you live in Suffolk. I'm again going to ask what is wrong with policies being 'ideology driven'? As someone else said, Brexit is the ultimate 'ideology driven' policy - should it be discredited on that basis alone? Financially it makes complete sense to charge private schools VAT - it raises tax revenue and addresses a clear and obvious imbalance in society. I asked this previously but don't think it got picked up; Can you make a case as to why the taxpayer should be subsidising the richest in society to go to better schools? Not logistical challenges that a change might produce, but an actual case as to why the current status quo is a good policy for society?
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EverybodyDannsNow

SE19 17 Jun 24 10.38am

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Originally posted by HKOwen

I'm again going to ask what is wrong with policies being 'ideology driven'? As someone else said, Brexit is the ultimate 'ideology driven' policy - should it be discredited on that basis alone?

Financially it makes complete sense to charge private schools VAT - it raises tax revenue and addresses a clear and obvious imbalance in society.

I asked this previously but don't think it got picked up;

Can you make a case as to why the taxpayer should be subsidising the richest in society to go to better schools? Not logistical challenges that a change might produce, but an actual case as to why the current status quo is a good policy for society?

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Hrolf The Ganger 17 Jun 24 10.43am
Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow I'm again going to ask what is wrong with policies being 'ideology driven'? As someone else said, Brexit is the ultimate 'ideology driven' policy - should it be discredited on that basis alone? Financially it makes complete sense to charge private schools VAT - it raises tax revenue and addresses a clear and obvious imbalance in society. I asked this previously but don't think it got picked up; Can you make a case as to why the taxpayer should be subsidising the richest in society to go to better schools? Not logistical challenges that a change might produce, but an actual case as to why the current status quo is a good policy for society? Same old Labour. Taxing the middle class to pay for layabouts. You need to understand that the vast majority of people are not 'rich'. Only a tiny percentage of people are beyond money concerns.
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Hrolf The Ganger

17 Jun 24 10.43am

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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

I'm again going to ask what is wrong with policies being 'ideology driven'? As someone else said, Brexit is the ultimate 'ideology driven' policy - should it be discredited on that basis alone?

Financially it makes complete sense to charge private schools VAT - it raises tax revenue and addresses a clear and obvious imbalance in society.

I asked this previously but don't think it got picked up;

Same old Labour. Taxing the middle class to pay for layabouts.

You need to understand that the vast majority of people are not 'rich'.
Only a tiny percentage of people are beyond money concerns.

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