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Should a general election be called.
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  Hrolf The Ganger  07 Jul 16 8.04pm |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
Is that it? How is it going to happen? Should the people have a say on who is best to lead Brexit? Cameron said he wasn't going to step down but did. Yawn. I suggest your pathetic party decides on a new leader first.
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| chris123 hove actually 07 Jul 16 8.11pm |
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Originally posted by Percy of Peckham
Let me ask you a question instead? Have you ever worked in a government department? US Treasury.
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| chris123 hove actually 07 Jul 16 8.14pm |
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Originally posted by JohnyBoy
But the elected governments official position was to remain. They only gave leave to mps to have a free vote but the majority of tory mps wanted to remain and 3/4 of the elected mps from both sides wanted to remain. If the government, prime minister and parliament is elected according to representation of the people, then a referendum (especially as it degenerated into some kind of pop idol type reality show based on misinformation) which we understood to be 'advisory' cannot be used to undermine democracy. If it is the democratic will of the people to have May as pm, to have the governments official policy to brexit and more importantly what replaces it then lets have a general election - what is there to be scared of? cos i cant remember voting for/against a norway or canadian style trade/immigration policy...and i definitely didnt vote for against a sterling crisis, a constitutional confusion regarding the status of NI, Scotland & Gibraltar and the prospect of lower prosperity, underfunding of public services and a seemingly inept government and main opposition party. No, the elected Government's position was to hold a referendum, as provided for in their manifesto.
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Percy of Peckham  Eton Mess 07 Jul 16 8.23pm |
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Originally posted by chris123
US Treasury. Thirty five years in HM Treasury. Used to duty Ministers and banks of empty desks throughout the summer. I'd like to think we're on the ball this year but I sincerely doubt it!
Denial is not just a river in Egypt! |
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 07 Jul 16 8.25pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Yawn. I suggest your pathetic party decides on a new leader first. I suggest you go back to the BBS where that sort of drossy comment is more tolerated.
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| JohnyBoy 07 Jul 16 8.26pm |
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Originally posted by chris123
No, the elected Government's position was to hold a referendum, as provided for in their manifesto. Which was 'advisory'.... I dont mind if we brexit infact i'd prefer it sooner than later because the uncertainty is damaging....but if they negotiate a Norway or a Canadian style arrangement or brexit light or brexit hard (because there is no plan), we have no idea if that is acceptable to the people...it probably wouldnt be enough 'control' for ukip voters who would probably want another effin referendum in 5 years time. The only reason neither the torys or labour want a general election (apart from the mess their parties are in) are because the libdems will take a load of tory seats down south and ukip will take labour seats up north. Tbh, i have never known such an absurd political situation where the economy and constitution were seemingly gambled away for personal political gain - and surely no democracy wants that
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| chris123 hove actually 07 Jul 16 8.28pm |
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Originally posted by Percy of Peckham
Thirty five years in HM Treasury. Used to duty Ministers and banks of empty desks throughout the summer. I'd like to think we're on the ball this year but I sincerely doubt it! Sanctions - which if you work in HMT you'll know are 24/7.
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| chris123 hove actually 07 Jul 16 8.31pm |
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Originally posted by JohnyBoy
Which was 'advisory'.... I dont mind if we brexit infact i'd prefer it sooner than later because the uncertainty is damaging....but if they negotiate a Norway or a Canadian style arrangement or brexit light or brexit hard (because there is no plan), we have no idea if that is acceptable to the people...it probably wouldnt be enough 'control' for ukip voters who would probably want another effin referendum in 5 years time. The only reason neither the torys or labour want a general election (apart from the mess their parties are in) are because the libdems will take a load of tory seats down south and ukip will take labour seats up north. Tbh, i have never known such an absurd political situation where the economy and constitution were seemingly gambled away for personal political gain - and surely no democracy wants that In theory yes - but given the level of turnout, no.
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| Percy of Peckham Eton Mess 07 Jul 16 8.40pm |
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Originally posted by chris123
Sanctions - which if you work in HMT you'll know are 24/7. Which of course need the personnel to enforce. Timing is everything and (I feel) the referendum was very badly timed. Much better when the Government machine is fuelled up and able to run at full capacity.
Denial is not just a river in Egypt! |
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| JohnyBoy 07 Jul 16 8.42pm |
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Originally posted by chris123
In theory yes - but given the level of turnout, no. Turnout is turnout....but do you know what you want? Aussie style, Norway style, Canadian style, uk style far right hard brexit (i.e. v.low immigration & no free trade) or brexit light (vice versa)? Would you like to understand the consequences on the nhs and public services, the impact of each on each sector e.g. financial services or manufacturing and maybe the consequences for the 'united' kingdom itself? Would you trust Theresa May to make all these decisions for us given her elected mandate from 200k 68year olds. I am not politically alligned but it doesnt sound like 'taking back control' to me
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| chris123 hove actually 07 Jul 16 8.56pm |
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Originally posted by JohnyBoy
Turnout is turnout....but do you know what you want? Aussie style, Norway style, Canadian style, uk style far right hard brexit (i.e. v.low immigration & no free trade) or brexit light (vice versa)? Would you like to understand the consequences on the nhs and public services, the impact of each on each sector e.g. financial services or manufacturing and maybe the consequences for the 'united' kingdom itself? Would you trust Theresa May to make all these decisions for us given her elected mandate from 200k 68year olds. I am not politically alligned but it doesnt sound like 'taking back control' to me My reasons for leaving were sovereignty based. I believe we are much better off managing our own risks and opportunities without any outside influence. I think the EU model is bust and that we are just the first to leave the party.
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| JohnyBoy 07 Jul 16 9.03pm |
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Originally posted by chris123
My reasons for leaving were sovereignty based. I believe we are much better off managing our own risks and opportunities without any outside influence. I think the EU model is bust and that we are just the first to leave the party.
But with respect, we will have to do some kind of brexit but what do you replace it with? Is the Norway model ok or is it a hard brexit for you? I dont expect you to know the exact answer because no-one has a clue or a plan of any kind, except maybe for some cunning bloke called Baldrick.
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