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Palace Fan Arrested For 'Inciting Racial Hatred'
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 Mapletree  Croydon 26 Mar 16 1.25pm |
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Originally posted by matt_himself
And in a nutshell you have highlighted what is wrong with this situation - by saying that she was 'almost certainly s***ting herself' you are imagining her reaction and being offended on her behalf. How do you know she was 'almost s***ting herself'? If this did happen, she might have taken, what in my mind is the correct response, that some gobs***e bellend has made a comment that should be swiftly rebutted and him ignored. Then she went about her business with no further fuss. That approach I admire, the 'I will deal with this with calmness and dignity' way. And by taking the view that we are saying this is a 'normal day in Croydon' by opposing your view, you are implying that we are not sympathic to the need for understanding and calm in these difficult times. May I suggest that you get off of your divisive high horse and stopping judging those whose views differ from yours so arbitrarily? Edited by matt_himself (26 Mar 2016 12.41pm) You can suggest what you like. It doesn't change the fact that this bloke was a bully and someone should put him in his place. You would have thought the £200k his parents spent on his education would have resulted in someone with better manners. Maybe all those years he spent in Stockbroking, Investment Management and Fund Management resulted in him becoming slightly self centred. The point about a 'normal day in Croydon' was in response to the comment about this being simply a random nutter like we all get now and then. And yes, I make no excuses that I stand up to bullies on behalf of the bullied. Nor that I put myself in the shoes of others, especially the abused. But I also note that the whole weight of Twitter did the same.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 26 Mar 16 1.29pm |
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Originally posted by matt_himself
How is the Twitter post an offence? This is the nub of what I am trying to get at. It appears to be a knee jerk reaction to something that is probably bollocks. Are Tweets admissible? If I say I have twelve inch cock on Twitter, Halle Berry sees the tweet, comes to Croydon & bangs me and then discovers this is not strictly true, can she have me arrested for fraud as a result? Under Section 29B: (1) A person who uses threatening words or behaviour, or displays any written material which is threatening, is guilty of an offence if they intend thereby to stir up religious hatred. So I would imagine, the police believe that sharing that twitter is intended to stir up racial hatred. If the CPS can show intent and that the material could be reasonably shown to demonstrate hatred or intolerance, then they have their case (arguably it would depend more on other behaviour that can be shown by the defendant).
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 26 Mar 16 1.32pm |
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Originally posted by matt_himself
And how is it proved if a witness or victim doesn't report it? What is the due process? It doesn't make sense. Because he's shared it with x number of people on twitter - which is a permanent recording.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 26 Mar 16 1.36pm |
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Originally posted by matt_himself
How is the Twitter post an offence? This is the nub of what I am trying to get at. It appears to be a knee jerk reaction to something that is probably bollocks. Are Tweets admissible? If I say I have twelve inch cock on Twitter, Halle Berry sees the tweet, comes to Croydon & bangs me and then discovers this is not strictly true, can she have me arrested for fraud as a result? Yes. But its not fraud, as you have obtained nothing. If however her career suffered as a result, she could sue you for libel / slander. If he could show that he didn't send the twitter, he could have a defence.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 26 Mar 16 1.37pm |
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Originally posted by davenotamonkey
Our friendly Immam wrote these messages via WhatsApp, not smoke-signal. These is a digital record of these as well. Then the police should investigate. I don't believe in double standards.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 26 Mar 16 1.40pm |
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Originally posted by becky
but the question still remains - who has he incited|? and to do what? He simply asked a woman to 'explain Brussels' Is it now illegal to 'incite' someone to give you an answer to a random question? The definition of the law only requires an intent to incite, it doesn't have to result in an actual crime by someone else. Obviously they the CPS have to prove that is the case.
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| matt_himself Matataland 26 Mar 16 1.47pm |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
You can suggest what you like. It doesn't change the fact that this bloke was a bully and someone should put him in his place. You would have thought the £200k his parents spent on his education would have resulted in someone with better manners. Maybe all those years he spent in Stockbroking, Investment Management and Fund Management resulted in him becoming slightly self centred. The point about a 'normal day in Croydon' was in response to the comment about this being simply a random nutter like we all get now and then. And yes, I make no excuses that I stand up to bullies on behalf of the bullied. Nor that I put myself in the shoes of others, especially the abused. But I also note that the whole weight of Twitter did the same. Two things stroke me from your response: 1. The root of your willingness to be judge and jury of this instance is a class hatred. It permeates your first paragraph in every word. You obviously have a hatred for those who are privileged, or, are privileged in your eyes. 2. Standing up against bullying. Again, where did the victim claim she was bullied? Once again, you are proving that you love getting offended on behalf of others regardless of whether they were offended.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| matt_himself Matataland 26 Mar 16 1.48pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Under Section 29B: (1) A person who uses threatening words or behaviour, or displays any written material which is threatening, is guilty of an offence if they intend thereby to stir up religious hatred. So I would imagine, the police believe that sharing that twitter is intended to stir up racial hatred. If the CPS can show intent and that the material could be reasonably shown to demonstrate hatred or intolerance, then they have their case (arguably it would depend more on other behaviour that can be shown by the defendant). Good old Wikipedia.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| Mapletree Croydon 26 Mar 16 1.57pm |
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Originally posted by matt_himself
Two things stroke me from your response: 1. The root of your willingness to be judge and jury of this instance is a class hatred. It permeates your first paragraph in every word. You obviously have a hatred for those who are privileged, or, are privileged in your eyes. 2. Standing up against bullying. Again, where did the victim claim she was bullied? Once again, you are proving that you love getting offended on behalf of others regardless of whether they were offended. You are so correct, I hate the type of people who have it all laid on a plate and then Lord it over others. I rather like people who have it laid on a plate and appreciate how advantaged they are though. The victim made no claim, she is unknown. I am able to imagine that this situation was in all probability not one she enjoyed and not one that she invited. I guess I just have an active imagination. In fact, I have been known to tut loudly when someone tries to engage me in a conversation on the 7.51 to Victoria.
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| Stirlingsays 26 Mar 16 2.16pm |
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Originally posted by coulsdoneagle
Not liking a group of people, what exactly do you mean? What I said. It may be unfortunate but the law should stick to those who threaten and the support of those who make threats. Thought policing is surely the wrong direction.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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Jimenez  SELHURSTPARKCHESTER,DA BRONX 26 Mar 16 2.16pm |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
You are so correct, I hate the type of people who have it all laid on a plate and then Lord it over others. I rather like people who have it laid on a plate and appreciate how advantaged they are though. The victim made no claim, she is unknown. I am able to imagine that this situation was in all probability not one she enjoyed and not one that she invited. I guess I just have an active imagination. In fact, I have been known to tut loudly when someone tries to engage me in a conversation on the 7.51 to Victoria. After reading through all of this the only person who seems seriously pissed is yourself Maple? Its a nothing story. Sure the guy made a stupid remark, but the problem nowadays is that people tend to get offended on the behalf of others.
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 becky over the moon 26 Mar 16 2.38pm |
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Originally posted by Mapletree
The HOL is a bizarre place. So what we know is that - according to him - a young man walked up to a woman passer by, choosing her because she appeared to be a Muslim. He then asked said unknown person to explain Brussels and tweeted that she was mealy mouthed for not choosing to engage with him. The Police, as they are prone to do, then made a huge mess of their reaction. This is the organisation that can't attract external candidates for their most senior positions by the way and suffers from all manner of institutional problems. This site then focuses entirely on the flawed reaction of the Police. Meanwhile there is someone out there, apparently, that was targeted because she was a Muslim. And that almost certainly was sh*ting herself given she was a lone woman and Muslims generally are probably feeling pretty scared of a backlash. People on this site say that is nothing special, just a normal day in Croydon. And in his own words he wasn't threatening - I am sure he is a good judge of that given how good a light he has shown himself in with his other tweets. There has been little real opprobrium for this moron. Even though effectively he did it in your and my name. It's all over the papers that he is from Croydon and a Palace fan. Yet more negative PR that we just don't need. In my view it's a shame nobody showed him the error of his ways, he clearly is unable to put himself in the shoes of others (at least at the pleb level) and presumably spends his life being seriously annoying.
I understood the topic to be a discussion about the merits or otherwise of the arrest for this offence. I doubt that anyone who has posted on here actually condones what he purports to have done but, like me, have simply responded to the discussion of whether this merits arrest for incitement.
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