The sad truth is that factors beyond these shores feed directly into decisions made here. That will happen both in or out of the EU. I can see plus points to leaving, having control of our own borders for instance. I can also see negatives, a 'better the devil you know' take. Alone we will get pushed around just as much if not more.

When corporate coup style deals like Trans-Pacific Partnership come barreling through, if we don't join that we'll get frozen out economically, if we do, then we're beholden to others once again. Whatever we do, the country people are hoping to be part of, will never come to be because it's just not how the world works.

Edited by oldcodger (12 Oct 2015 10.58pm)

Very good article, not sure the "patriots" would take much notice of it, though. They'll just bang on about the "benefits" of being in the EU", and say how happy they are about more of our laws being made in Brussels. It is interesting that Iceland, Norway and Switzerland are all doing very well outside the EU...

Now this I understood,looks like I'm OUT,unless someone puts up a link to show me why I should say IN

The hole thing looks like the "hokey Cokey",maybe we should turn around,cos thats what its all about.

I really don't know yet - I waver daily (which is a bad sign for the EU, because if you'd asked me a year ago, it was a no-brainer we stay in).

If we leave, that will lead the SNP to have another referendum undoubtedly, and hopefully they'll win this time, and we just just rebuild Hadrian's Wall and be done with it (ironically Scotland will use Brexit as a reason to leave, then the EU won't have them anyway)

Paul... I'm OUT because:-

We cannot control our borders whilst a member of EU. We are full to bursting now and our infrastructure is creaking.

I don't buy the so called economic benefits that immigration brings - for me uncontrolled migration brings more unskilled people than skilled and just drives down wages, which hits the poorest most.

We don't need the EU to trade, we import more than we export to most of our EU partners. If they try to play hardball on our exports we just withdraw our trade with them completely and trade with our former colonial comrades including India and also China where the potential is huge... and the new emerging economies that are keen to do business.

We will save billions by not being a member of the EU. It was originally set up as the "Common Market" a loose trading agreement between likeminded countries. Now it is a federal state with countries like Rumania, Bulgaria and Greece etc being subsidised by the richer northern nations and spending/bureaucracy is out of control.

It seems like a step into the unknown by leaving the EU, but we should have done it years ago. Spend all the savings on improving the NHS.