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General Election 2017

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CambridgeEagle Flag Sydenham 15 Jun 17 5.01pm Send a Private Message to CambridgeEagle Add CambridgeEagle as a friend

Originally posted by Jimenez

No it means that you keep more of what you earn and spend it accordingly on White goods,holidays, food & drink etc where you pay a higher VAT rate.

Indirect taxes are regressive and should not be used as a replacement for income tax. VAT is bloody complicated as well. It would also be a nightmare for stuff which has no VAT on it as it would go up in price as well, which includes stuff like rent, banking and insurance as these are exempt activities and the companies involved in their provision cannot reclaim VAT so their costs would go up and therefore their prices go up.

 

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hedgehog50 Flag Croydon 15 Jun 17 5.10pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

None of that happens H, we are only talking about them making a fair contribution to society.

Paying 3% more on an income of 80,000 is hardly going to bother you.

How is it 'fair'?

 


We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

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CambridgeEagle Flag Sydenham 15 Jun 17 5.13pm Send a Private Message to CambridgeEagle Add CambridgeEagle as a friend

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

God you're hilarious.

From what I read...well yeah it's a main factor.

So what the article ACTUALLY says is that the Treasury estimated that the COST of the cut in rates would be offset by 40-60% in the long run due to increase in take on OTHER taxes as a result of increased spending due to additional retained earnings for companies.

It then says, as I said, that banks are now making money again post GFC and that their utilisation of carried forward losses has been restricted (widened tax base as I said).

It also says that business investment is subdued (bad for the economy) despite the cut in tax rates, which meant that there was lower levels of tax relief for investment (again this is in SPITE of a cut not because of it).

They then mention BEPS, action on anti-avoidance and diverted profits tax which I also mentioned. This has nothing to do with the rate.

The only part of the article that claims increases in tax take are in any part due to the cuts in the rate are by making Britain more attractive as an HQ for multinationals. However companies will make suce decisions on a number of factors, including infrastructure, available talent, Brexit, other taxes and rates payable. It's notable that an effect of incoming BEPS legislation will force companies that locate in the UK have to be doing so in reality for genuine commercial reasons and have trade here to take advantage of the lower tax rates. In order to do this companies will require there to be well trained, healthy and motivated staff and the infrastructure to run a business. How do you provide this? From taxation. Companies cannot have their cake and eat it too.

 

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Lyons550 Flag Shirley 15 Jun 17 5.15pm Send a Private Message to Lyons550 Add Lyons550 as a friend

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

But that's not how taxation works. How tax works is that the rich people who have it, avoid paying as much as they can, and vote for political parties who keep reducing the amount of tax and providing tax shelter options for those who have it, whilst those who don't get f**ked.

This occurs so frequently, that people exist who entirely make their careers out of ensuring people with money pay as little tax as possible. Whilst oddly, at the other end of the scale, we have an entire infrastructure in place to ensure that those with a little of the wealth, have as little control over their taxation as possible.


Perhaps the HMRC should operate a system akin to No Claims Discount...in that the more years a company pays Corporate Tax at the correct rate...it receives a discount the following year?

 


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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 15 Jun 17 5.26pm

Originally posted by Lyons550


Perhaps the HMRC should operate a system akin to No Claims Discount...in that the more years a company pays Corporate Tax at the correct rate...it receives a discount the following year?

Perhaps staffing levels at HMRC should be increased so that there's manpower to chase down evaders / avoiders.
How much would it cost to train and pay a tax person per year. 30-40k? How much tax are they likely to track down, alot more than that I'd chance.

 

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CambridgeEagle Flag Sydenham 15 Jun 17 5.30pm Send a Private Message to CambridgeEagle Add CambridgeEagle as a friend

Originally posted by nickgusset

Perhaps staffing levels at HMRC should be increased so that there's manpower to chase down evaders / avoiders.
How much would it cost to train and pay a tax person per year. 30-40k? How much tax are they likely to track down, alot more than that I'd chance.

Under-staffing and trying to make HMRC do more with less has had mixed results, but it's likely to have been a false economy. I agree that investment is needed to provide HMRC with the appropriate resources and improve techniques to make tax collection more efficient.

 

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 15 Jun 17 5.32pm

Originally posted by Lyons550


Perhaps the HMRC should operate a system akin to No Claims Discount...in that the more years a company pays Corporate Tax at the correct rate...it receives a discount the following year?

I think incentivising corporate tax cuts makes sense. Start at 26% but if your lowest paid worker earns 30k a year pro-rata then you get 25%. But if half your workforce earns more than 30k a year, you pay 15% etc.

If your a Landlord or property business, then your corporation tax is adjusted from 26% additionally based on how you pay your staff, and how your rents compare to the market value.

I'd have no problem with companies paying 0% corporation tax if in doing so they saved themselves some money, their staff got better wages and social function was better served (Health care for all permanent staff -10% corporation tax - benefits the staff and the NHS).

 


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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 15 Jun 17 5.35pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

Perhaps staffing levels at HMRC should be increased so that there's manpower to chase down evaders / avoiders.
How much would it cost to train and pay a tax person per year. 30-40k? How much tax are they likely to track down, alot more than that I'd chance.

HMRC and the IRS before them, when faced with the necessity to pursue evaders and avoiders, go after the small avoiders, because they number highly (and the people in charge of them push that agenda because it looks good in stats, and doesn't cause them to be chasing the people who donate large sums to political parties or their own bosses).

The problem with tax avoidance is like Benefit Fraud, they claim to be clamping down, and then just go after the people who are making a little bit here and there, rather than the people who are taxing the p*ss.

 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 16 Jun 17 5.30pm

I give her till Monday.


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steeleye20 Flag Croydon 16 Jun 17 5.56pm Send a Private Message to steeleye20 Add steeleye20 as a friend

Originally posted by hedgehog50

How is it 'fair'?

Simply because those with the broadest shoulders should carry the most burden.

Apart from that they actually have the money.

Its not socialism its common sense.

 

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pefwin Flag Where you have to have an English ... 16 Jun 17 5.57pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

I give her till Monday.


[Link]

Among Conservative voters, Theresa May had an 85 per cent favourability rating in April, which has now fallen to 57 per cent.

If you tried really hard it would be difficult to get results like that.

 


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hedgehog50 Flag Croydon 16 Jun 17 6.28pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

Simply because those with the broadest shoulders should carry the most burden.

Apart from that they actually have the money.

Its not socialism its common sense.

So if someone mugs you in the street because you have more money than them, that is fair?

 


We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

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