John McDonnell says -Trust Labour with the economy

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John McDonnell says -Trust Labour with the economy

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andyg york 15 Mar 16 7.11pm
Originally posted by Hoof Hearted But they didn't keep it in apple pie order though did they Jamie. For a start Brown sold our Gold reserves at an all time low price - schoolboy error! You have already conceded earlier in the thread the way Brown funded the building of schools and hospitals by PFi wasn't a "great plan" to use your very words. The cost to our economy is still being felt now. How much money did they waste on the Millennium Dome project FFS? Blair/Brown's tax reforms like tax credit and child credit was another lame idea that has grown out of all proportion and should never have been introduced as it has ended up being a millstone around our necks. They might have enjoyed a long period of prosperity, but instead of making hay while the sun shines they made some pretty basic mistakes that have caused long term grief that is difficult to undo. Thank goodness the Tories haven't sold anything off cheap, like Royal Mail for instance
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andyg

york 15 Mar 16 7.11pm

Originally posted by Hoof Hearted

But they didn't keep it in apple pie order though did they Jamie.

For a start Brown sold our Gold reserves at an all time low price - schoolboy error!

You have already conceded earlier in the thread the way Brown funded the building of schools and hospitals by PFi wasn't a "great plan" to use your very words. The cost to our economy is still being felt now.

How much money did they waste on the Millennium Dome project FFS?

Blair/Brown's tax reforms like tax credit and child credit was another lame idea that has grown out of all proportion and should never have been introduced as it has ended up being a millstone around our necks.

They might have enjoyed a long period of prosperity, but instead of making hay while the sun shines they made some pretty basic mistakes that have caused long term grief that is difficult to undo.

Thank goodness the Tories haven't sold anything off cheap, like Royal Mail for instance

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-TUX- Alphabettispaghetti 15 Mar 16 7.40pm
Originally posted by Hoof Hearted [Link] .......mmmmmm..... should we? And in other news - Gary Glitter and Rolf Harris say "Trust us with your children!" Yeah..... right oh lads... we'll overlook the previous bad experiences and give it a whirl again.... LOL Oh dear. Time to move forward together.
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-TUX-

Alphabettispaghetti 15 Mar 16 7.40pm

Originally posted by Hoof Hearted

[Link]

.......mmmmmm..... should we?

And in other news - Gary Glitter and Rolf Harris say "Trust us with your children!"

Yeah..... right oh lads... we'll overlook the previous bad experiences and give it a whirl again.... LOL

Oh dear.

Time to move forward together.

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Hoof Hearted 16 Mar 16 9.33am
Originally posted by andyg Thank goodness the Tories haven't sold anything off cheap, like Royal Mail for instance Yes "The Tories" as you like to call them can make the odd mistakes just like your "Comrades" but overall you are talking about a catalogue of errors with Labour administrations and at the end of any such administration they hand it over in a sh1t state for "The Tories" to sort out again. Give it a few years and the cycle will repeat itself. Royal Mail share offer price was too low, but instead of moaning about it, why didn't you lump in and make a killing like I did? Us pensioners need other ways to supplement or generate income now interest rates are so low. The share price has now found it's level a lot closer to the price it was offered than the inflated hyped up price the initial demand generated anyway. Edited by Hoof Hearted (16 Mar 2016 9.46am)
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Hoof Hearted 16 Mar 16 9.33am

Originally posted by andyg

Thank goodness the Tories haven't sold anything off cheap, like Royal Mail for instance

Yes "The Tories" as you like to call them can make the odd mistakes just like your "Comrades" but overall you are talking about a catalogue of errors with Labour administrations and at the end of any such administration they hand it over in a sh1t state for "The Tories" to sort out again. Give it a few years and the cycle will repeat itself.

Royal Mail share offer price was too low, but instead of moaning about it, why didn't you lump in and make a killing like I did? Us pensioners need other ways to supplement or generate income now interest rates are so low.

The share price has now found it's level a lot closer to the price it was offered than the inflated hyped up price the initial demand generated anyway.

Edited by Hoof Hearted (16 Mar 2016 9.46am)

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 16 Mar 16 9.36am
Originally posted by andyg Thank goodness the Tories haven't sold anything off cheap, like Royal Mail for instance Or given away the education system to their mates.
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 16 Mar 16 9.36am

Originally posted by andyg

Thank goodness the Tories haven't sold anything off cheap, like Royal Mail for instance

Or given away the education system to their mates.

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chris123 hove actually 16 Mar 16 9.40am
Originally posted by nickgusset Or given away the education system to their mates. Expecting all schools to leave local authorities and become academies it seems.
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chris123

hove actually 16 Mar 16 9.40am

Originally posted by nickgusset

Or given away the education system to their mates.

Expecting all schools to leave local authorities and become academies it seems.

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Hoof Hearted 16 Mar 16 9.42am
Originally posted by leifandersonshair Sounds like you've bought into the Tory line then. The NHS is being purposely underfunded to aid eventual privatization. We spend less on health (as a % of GDP) than most leading European countries. The NHS is not perfect. It does have to change to meet the needs of an ageing population. However, if you asked people whether they'd pay an extra penny per pound in tax to keep the NHS funded, they'd be happy to. It is not a 'socialist pipe dream' (showing your bias there!). Privatization would be disastrous, as it always is. If that was the case, then Labour would be more guilty of it than the Conservatives! Blair was the first PM to privatise any of the NHS with the introduction of new private hospitals being able to compete with traditional NHS hospitals for knee/hip operations - I had a new knee replaced at one here in Bristol. Also the Conservatives have increased spending on the NHS compared to Labour in % terms, amounts and ensured this goes towards employing actual doctors and nurses, not middle management number crunchers like Blair sanctioned to fiddle waiting lists and other statistics. This is the sort of deadwood that Conservative ministers have to cut out when they return to office along with Qangos and other such needless Labour indulgences with our money. Labour waste money. Edited by Hoof Hearted (16 Mar 2016 9.43am)
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Hoof Hearted 16 Mar 16 9.42am

Originally posted by leifandersonshair

Sounds like you've bought into the Tory line then. The NHS is being purposely underfunded to aid eventual privatization. We spend less on health (as a % of GDP) than most leading European countries.

The NHS is not perfect. It does have to change to meet the needs of an ageing population. However, if you asked people whether they'd pay an extra penny per pound in tax to keep the NHS funded, they'd be happy to. It is not a 'socialist pipe dream' (showing your bias there!).

Privatization would be disastrous, as it always is.

If that was the case, then Labour would be more guilty of it than the Conservatives!

Blair was the first PM to privatise any of the NHS with the introduction of new private hospitals being able to compete with traditional NHS hospitals for knee/hip operations - I had a new knee replaced at one here in Bristol.

Also the Conservatives have increased spending on the NHS compared to Labour in % terms, amounts and ensured this goes towards employing actual doctors and nurses, not middle management number crunchers like Blair sanctioned to fiddle waiting lists and other statistics.

This is the sort of deadwood that Conservative ministers have to cut out when they return to office along with Qangos and other such needless Labour indulgences with our money.

Labour waste money.

Edited by Hoof Hearted (16 Mar 2016 9.43am)

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jamiemartin721 Reading 16 Mar 16 9.45am
Originally posted by nickgusset Or given away the education system to their mates. Or sell off British utilities on the cheap, council housing on the cheap, run down the UK's mental health system, Black Wednesday, undermine UK education, sell of BT on the cheap, introduce the council tax, cover up vCJD, franchise out parts of the NHS, removal dental and opticians from the NHS, ravage british industry into a virtual oblivion, boom and bust economy, failure to control the housing market, sell off hospital property to fund the NHS whilst cutting taxes. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
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jamiemartin721

Reading 16 Mar 16 9.45am

Originally posted by nickgusset

Or given away the education system to their mates.

Or sell off British utilities on the cheap, council housing on the cheap, run down the UK's mental health system, Black Wednesday, undermine UK education, sell of BT on the cheap, introduce the council tax, cover up vCJD, franchise out parts of the NHS, removal dental and opticians from the NHS, ravage british industry into a virtual oblivion, boom and bust economy, failure to control the housing market, sell off hospital property to fund the NHS whilst cutting taxes.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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Hoof Hearted 16 Mar 16 9.51am
Originally posted by jamiemartin721 Or sell off British utilities on the cheap, council housing on the cheap, run down the UK's mental health system, Black Wednesday, undermine UK education, sell of BT on the cheap, introduce the council tax, cover up vCJD, franchise out parts of the NHS, removal dental and opticians from the NHS, ravage british industry into a virtual oblivion, boom and bust economy, failure to control the housing market, sell off hospital property to fund the NHS whilst cutting taxes. ... and yet despite this (if you believe it to be true)... the voting public STILL trust the Conservatives more than Labour with the economy? What does that say about Labour's reputation which is going further south every single day Corbyn remains as leader! I wish that Nescafe Shake smiley icon was still available.
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Hoof Hearted 16 Mar 16 9.51am

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

... and yet despite this (if you believe it to be true)... the voting public STILL trust the Conservatives more than Labour with the economy?

What does that say about Labour's reputation which is going further south every single day Corbyn remains as leader!

I wish that Nescafe Shake smiley icon was still available.

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Hoof Hearted 16 Mar 16 9.54am
I say I say I say....... Did you hear about the Labour Chancellor that balanced the books? No? Neither did I....
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Hoof Hearted 16 Mar 16 9.54am

I say I say I say.......

Did you hear about the Labour Chancellor that balanced the books?

No?

Neither did I....

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jamiemartin721 Reading 16 Mar 16 10.44am
Originally posted by Hoof Hearted If that was the case, then Labour would be more guilty of it than the Conservatives! Blair was the first PM to privatise any of the NHS with the introduction of new private hospitals being able to compete with traditional NHS hospitals for knee/hip operations - I had a new knee replaced at one here in Bristol. Also the Conservatives have increased spending on the NHS compared to Labour in % terms, amounts and ensured this goes towards employing actual doctors and nurses, not middle management number crunchers like Blair sanctioned to fiddle waiting lists and other statistics. This is the sort of deadwood that Conservative ministers have to cut out when they return to office along with Qangos and other such needless Labour indulgences with our money. Labour waste money. Edited by Hoof Hearted (16 Mar 2016 9.43am) Technically it would have been the conservatives, as Dental and Opticians were quasi-privitised long ago, but definitely fk New Labour cts as well. The assumption that cuts only ever target the deadwood is untrue, simply because the people who apply the cuts tend to be management, and the mid management. Having worked in the civil service, its not the senior level that bear the brunt of public spending cuts, its the public and the front line staff. So you wouldn't trust Labour with the economy, I don't trust the conservatives with public services (interestingly I don't trust New Labour with them either). "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
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jamiemartin721

Reading 16 Mar 16 10.44am

Originally posted by Hoof Hearted

If that was the case, then Labour would be more guilty of it than the Conservatives!

This is the sort of deadwood that Conservative ministers have to cut out when they return to office along with Qangos and other such needless Labour indulgences with our money.

Labour waste money.

Edited by Hoof Hearted (16 Mar 2016 9.43am)

Technically it would have been the conservatives, as Dental and Opticians were quasi-privitised long ago, but definitely f**k New Labour c**ts as well.

The assumption that cuts only ever target the deadwood is untrue, simply because the people who apply the cuts tend to be management, and the mid management. Having worked in the civil service, its not the senior level that bear the brunt of public spending cuts, its the public and the front line staff.

So you wouldn't trust Labour with the economy, I don't trust the conservatives with public services (interestingly I don't trust New Labour with them either).

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 16 Mar 16 10.49am
Originally posted by Hoof Hearted I say I say I say....... Did you hear about the Labour Chancellor that balanced the books? No? Neither did I.... Check this data... [Link] Worth noting that we have had a national debt since 1692. A quick look at the economic evidence reveals that only two Labour governments have ever left office leaving the national debt higher as a percentage of GDP than it was when they came to power, and all of the others have lowered it as a percentage of GDP. On the two occasions that Labour oversaw increases in the national debt as a percentage of GDP there were the mitigating circumstances of huge global financial crises. The Ramsay MacDonald government of 1929-31 coincided with global fallout from the Wall Street Crash (they left a 12% increase in the debt to GDP ratio), and the last few years of the Blair-Brown government of 1997-2010 coincided with the 2008 financial sector insolvency crisis (they left an 11% increase). The other Labour governments all reduced the scale of the national debt, Clement Attlee's government of 1945-51 reduced the national debt by 40% of GDP despite having to rebuild the UK economy from the ruins of the Second World War; Harold Wilson's 1964-70 government reduced the national debt by 27% of GDP; and even the Wilson-Callaghan government of 1974-79 managed to reduce the debt by 4% of GDP. The majority of Labour governments have ended up reducing the national debt, and the two that didn't happened to coincide with the biggest global financial crisis of the 20th Century and the biggest global financial crisis so far in the 21st Century. Also worth noting is that Osborne has created more debt than every Labour government in history!
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 16 Mar 16 10.49am

Originally posted by Hoof Hearted

I say I say I say.......

Did you hear about the Labour Chancellor that balanced the books?

No?

Neither did I....

Check this data... [Link]

Worth noting that we have had a national debt since 1692.

A quick look at the economic evidence reveals that only two Labour governments have ever left office leaving the national debt higher as a percentage of GDP than it was when they came to power, and all of the others have lowered it as a percentage of GDP.

On the two occasions that Labour oversaw increases in the national debt as a percentage of GDP there were the mitigating circumstances of huge global financial crises. The Ramsay MacDonald government of 1929-31 coincided with global fallout from the Wall Street Crash (they left a 12% increase in the debt to GDP ratio), and the last few years of the Blair-Brown government of 1997-2010 coincided with the 2008 financial sector insolvency crisis (they left an 11% increase). The other Labour governments all reduced the scale of the national debt, Clement Attlee's government of 1945-51 reduced the national debt by 40% of GDP despite having to rebuild the UK economy from the ruins of the Second World War; Harold Wilson's 1964-70 government reduced the national debt by 27% of GDP; and even the Wilson-Callaghan government of 1974-79 managed to reduce the debt by 4% of GDP.

The majority of Labour governments have ended up reducing the national debt, and the two that didn't happened to coincide with the biggest global financial crisis of the 20th Century and the biggest global financial crisis so far in the 21st Century.

Also worth noting is that Osborne has created more debt than every Labour government in history!

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jamiemartin721 Reading 16 Mar 16 10.55am
Originally posted by Hoof Hearted ... and yet despite this (if you believe it to be true)... the voting public STILL trust the Conservatives more than Labour with the economy? What does that say about Labour's reputation which is going further south every single day Corbyn remains as leader! I wish that Nescafe Shake smiley icon was still available. At the last election, at the election before no one seemed to be definitively trusted, and the election before that back to 1997 Labour seemed to be trusted. I don't distrust politicians though. In my entire life of 44.5 years, I've never really seen a government that I would actually trust to do what is necessary and right, over what is popular and would get them re-elected. Democracy seems to be about giving people what they think they want, as opposed to what the country actually needs or works. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
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jamiemartin721

Reading 16 Mar 16 10.55am

Originally posted by Hoof Hearted

... and yet despite this (if you believe it to be true)... the voting public STILL trust the Conservatives more than Labour with the economy?

What does that say about Labour's reputation which is going further south every single day Corbyn remains as leader!

I wish that Nescafe Shake smiley icon was still available.

At the last election, at the election before no one seemed to be definitively trusted, and the election before that back to 1997 Labour seemed to be trusted.

I don't distrust politicians though. In my entire life of 44.5 years, I've never really seen a government that I would actually trust to do what is necessary and right, over what is popular and would get them re-elected.

Democracy seems to be about giving people what they think they want, as opposed to what the country actually needs or works.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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