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Cameron does a Blair
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leggedstruggle  Croydon 08 Sep 15 11.46am |
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Quote jamiemartin721 at 08 Sep 2015 11.25am
Quote leggedstruggle at 08 Sep 2015 10.49am
Quote jamiemartin721 at 08 Sep 2015 10.21am
Quote Lyons550 at 08 Sep 2015 10.19am
Quote legaleagle at 07 Sep 2015 10.18pm
Quote palace_in_frogland at 07 Sep 2015 10.09pm
Quote legaleagle at 07 Sep 2015 10.02pm
Quote Catfish at 07 Sep 2015 7.48pm
Quote legaleagle at 07 Sep 2015 7.36pm
Then take it back to Parliament for a vote before you do it.What's the problem about proceeding that way?
I get it.Lets just ignore parliament and democracy and do whatever we like... An emergency debate could be held and over within a few days. Likely meaningful effect of 1-2 weeks' delay by the UK in "drone" operations on strategic situation in Iraq/Syria: Big fat zero.The extra time could usefully be used for extra training so we don't have the unfortunate accidents leading to deaths of kids and innocent civilians the US has had from using drones elsewhere ,that would probably act as a far greater recruiting tool/catalyst for local support for ISIS than any 2 week delay by us in getting drones "live". Anyway,not widely appreciated that UK companies have been engaged by the US military for drone programmes for some time Edited by legaleagle (07 Sep 2015 10.19pm) How do you know that was the case in this instance and that it wasn't an operational imperative that 1-2 weeks or even days could've hampered or worse resulted in the death of British Citizens (or as being reported Monarchy)? Are you in full receipt of the facts in this matter? I'd suggest that the delay in going to Parliament is the issue here...not the decision to act. I'm in complete agreement that due process (in most cases) should be followed...but where that due process could affect the lives of British Citizens then at times a judgement call has to be made. To suspend due process for convenience is far more of a threat to the british way of life than any terrorist group could be. Nonsense. It is a war - do what is necessary. Except of course we haven't declared war, and its an attack on the territory of a soverign nation, and of course the targeted elimination of british citizens based on intelligence, without parliamentary ascent. I'm inclined to think its the right decision, but when a prime minister specifically goes against the process and will of parliament, then it needs to be addressed, especially when it involved an action that parliament has previously disagreed with. Had parliament agreed to extending missions into Syria, then it would be fine. Except they didn't. Or do you believe that the Prime Minister should be de facto above the law and will of parliament. One minute the left think parliament is just a rubber stamp for Capitalist oppression of the people, next minute it is the stalwart of our freedoms. Of course we are at war with these people regardless or not of a formal declaration. Who cares if they are technically British citizens, they are traitors to the country if they are. The government have acted to protect its citizens who are not Islamic terrorists. Parliament should propose a vote of thanks not censure. If the electorate do not want their government to take actions that are in their interest of the country they can elect another one.
mother-in-law is an anagram of woman hitler |
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| Hoof Hearted 08 Sep 15 11.46am | |
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I have another request....... When are you lefty/liberal/luvvy types going to acknowledge that IS are killing innocent people, destroying priceless artefacts and ancient monuments, then showing off their evil deeds on youtube. Their actions are causing utter turmoil across the globe and need to be stood up to, just as Hitler was in 1939. No......... you lot would prefer to castigate Cameron for being un-parliamentary and offer nothing but wringing hands on behalf of the refugees displaced by this conflict (along with the chancers trying to upgrade their lives who have joined them).
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 dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 08 Sep 15 11.47am |
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Quote Lyons550 at 08 Sep 2015 10.19am
Quote legaleagle at 07 Sep 2015 10.18pm
Quote palace_in_frogland at 07 Sep 2015 10.09pm
Quote legaleagle at 07 Sep 2015 10.02pm
Quote Catfish at 07 Sep 2015 7.48pm
Quote legaleagle at 07 Sep 2015 7.36pm
Then take it back to Parliament for a vote before you do it.What's the problem about proceeding that way?
I get it.Lets just ignore parliament and democracy and do whatever we like... An emergency debate could be held and over within a few days. Likely meaningful effect of 1-2 weeks' delay by the UK in "drone" operations on strategic situation in Iraq/Syria: Big fat zero.The extra time could usefully be used for extra training so we don't have the unfortunate accidents leading to deaths of kids and innocent civilians the US has had from using drones elsewhere ,that would probably act as a far greater recruiting tool/catalyst for local support for ISIS than any 2 week delay by us in getting drones "live". Anyway,not widely appreciated that UK companies have been engaged by the US military for drone programmes for some time Edited by legaleagle (07 Sep 2015 10.19pm) How do you know that was the case in this instance and that it wasn't an operational imperative that 1-2 weeks or even days could've hampered or worse resulted in the death of British Citizens (or as being reported Monarchy)? Are you in full receipt of the facts in this matter? I'd suggest that the delay in going to Parliament is the issue here...not the decision to act. I'm in complete agreement that due process (in most cases) should be followed...but where that due process could affect the lives of British Citizens then at times a judgement call has to be made.
But I'm sure there will be those who put up some theoretical scenario whereby it was wrong blah blah blah.
"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'" |
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Jimenez  SELHURSTPARKCHESTER,DA BRONX 08 Sep 15 11.52am |
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Its nice to see the gloves come off well done Cameron. These scumbags don't play by the 'Rules' so we should have no qualms about playing dirty you fight fire with fire. ISIS is a Terrorist network which carry out medieval beheadings of people, throw homosexuals of roofs, destroy ancient historical buildings and terrorise innocent people trying to go about their daily business.
Pro USA & Israel |
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jcreedy  08 Sep 15 12.41pm |
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Do we know if any civilians were killed in the attack?
It was my dream to play for Palace and to make my debut. I've always played for the club so if I'm playing here, I wouldn't want to be anywhere else. - John Bostock (Nov 2007) |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 08 Sep 15 12.44pm |
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Quote leggedstruggle at 08 Sep 2015 11.46am
One minute the left think parliament is just a rubber stamp for Capitalist oppression of the people, next minute it is the stalwart of our freedoms. Of course we are at war with these people regardless or not of a formal declaration. Who cares if they are technically British citizens, they are traitors to the country if they are. The government have acted to protect its citizens who are not Islamic terrorists. Parliament should propose a vote of thanks not censure. If the electorate do not want their government to take actions that are in their interest of the country they can elect another one. What should happen is the evidence should be assessed by an independent body, to determine that 1) they were who the Government said they were Just assuming that everything is hunky dory because the Prime Minister says it is, concerns me. I mean its not like a previous government 'declared it was entirely justified on the intelligence' which then turned out to be as reliable as a child's crayon drawing, and got a metric s**t ton of people killed.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 08 Sep 15 12.47pm |
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Quote Jimenez at 08 Sep 2015 11.52am
Its nice to see the gloves come off well done Cameron. These scumbags don't play by the 'Rules' so we should have no qualms about playing dirty you fight fire with fire. ISIS is a Terrorist network which carry out medieval beheadings of people, throw homosexuals of roofs, destroy ancient historical buildings and terrorise innocent people trying to go about their daily business. I think its quite important that in 'defeating IS' we don't end up killing people on the off chance they're IS, targeting Muslims in general, destroying ancient buildings and terrorizing people going about their daily lives.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| bright&wright 08 Sep 15 12.49pm |
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2 dead terrorists? No longer able to breed and spread their evil, racism, murdering and rape? You're welcome Syria/Iraq.
'We are going to make a little bit of history here’ Mr. J. Ertl. |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 08 Sep 15 12.53pm |
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Quote dannyh at 08 Sep 2015 11.47am
But I'm sure there will be those who put up some theoretical scenario whereby it was wrong blah blah blah. Agreed with that. But the concern is that parliament had voted against extending air strikes into Syria, so the government did have from the 12th of August 2014 to seek permission for 'drone assassinations' in Syria. I can't imagine that no one actually didn't think that 'this could be a possible requirement'. Indeed at the time of the vote on Air Strikes, the government specifically seemed to be aware that they might need to conduct targeted strikes. So why not seek permission or clarification to do so from parliament, between 12th August 2014 and yesterday. Plus after the fact, we should ascertain that the action was justified, and the evidence against the targets was sufficient to warrant the strike.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 08 Sep 15 12.56pm |
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Quote bright&wright at 08 Sep 2015 12.49pm
2 dead terrorists? No longer able to breed and spread their evil, racism, murdering and rape? You're welcome Syria/Iraq. Suspected, and the strike killed four people in the car. The rule of law generally requires that you prove that an act of self defense was reasonable, as invariably the party left standing will always claim that it was 'the only course of action'.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| bright&wright 08 Sep 15 1.01pm |
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Quote jamiemartin721 at 08 Sep 2015 12.56pm
Quote bright&wright at 08 Sep 2015 12.49pm
2 dead terrorists? No longer able to breed and spread their evil, racism, murdering and rape? You're welcome Syria/Iraq. Suspected, and the strike killed four people in the car. The rule of law generally requires that you prove that an act of self defense was reasonable, as invariably the party left standing will always claim that it was 'the only course of action'.
I take you also read about their planned attacks in the UK? I'll sleep easier tonight. And yes, I will always care about British people first (not only, just first and foremost). ISIS made it all fair in love and war - not us. They played dirty. They won't stop if we ask them nicely.
'We are going to make a little bit of history here’ Mr. J. Ertl. |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 08 Sep 15 1.58pm |
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Quote bright&wright at 08 Sep 2015 1.01pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 08 Sep 2015 12.56pm
Quote bright&wright at 08 Sep 2015 12.49pm
2 dead terrorists? No longer able to breed and spread their evil, racism, murdering and rape? You're welcome Syria/Iraq. Suspected, and the strike killed four people in the car. The rule of law generally requires that you prove that an act of self defense was reasonable, as invariably the party left standing will always claim that it was 'the only course of action'.
I take you also read about their planned attacks in the UK? Yes, in the news papers, by way of David Cameron. I also remember a prime minister having absolute irrefutable proof about Iraqs weapons of mass destruction. I'd have the first, but I also want it confirmed that those two people were definitely terrorists and it was reasonable from the evidence that they were plotting an attack. Quote bright&wright at 08 Sep 2015 1.01pm
I'll sleep easier tonight. And yes, I will always care about British people first (not only, just first and foremost). It won't affect my sleep. I don't worry about things over which I have no control Technically of course two of those killed were British citizens and suspected terrorists. Quote bright&wright at 08 Sep 2015 1.01pm
ISIS made it all fair in love and war - not us. They played dirty. They won't stop if we ask them nicely. Not what I'm saying, I'm happy for us to kill ever single last man jack of these b******s. Just lawfully
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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