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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 08 May 14 10.57pm
Quote TUX at 08 May 2014 10.44pm TUX. With all due respect, you are having a pop at the wrong posters on here. This is a thread about UKIP, which is why we are attacking them ------------------------ Nick, I again say why on earth are you attacking something with NO POWER and has had NO effect on your life whatsoever! You cannot honestly be that fkn stupid bud? I'm 'having a pop' at the right people mate, you just don't get it/don't see it. You choose to 'attack' something that has no power, will never have any power and completely disregard those that are IN POWER? Being dumb is one thing, but being dumb as well as blind to what is happening is another. That's your stance, not mine. Oh well. My initial post on this thread was to ask why UKIP are getting so much media exposure. Indeed as I type this, Farage is on question time for the 15th time. 15th! Why is this? His party has no mp's. And I'll say agaain, ask anyone who posts on here regularly, I am always attacking the government and am much derided for it. So don't say I'm attacking the wrong people. Edited by nickgusset (08 May 2014 10.59pm)
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 08 May 14 10.57pm

Quote TUX at 08 May 2014 10.44pm

TUX. With all due respect, you are having a pop at the wrong posters on here.
This is a thread about UKIP, which is why we are attacking them
------------------------

Nick, I again say why on earth are you attacking something with NO POWER and has had NO effect on your life whatsoever!
You cannot honestly be that fkn stupid bud?
I'm 'having a pop' at the right people mate, you just don't get it/don't see it.
You choose to 'attack' something that has no power, will never have any power and completely disregard those that are IN POWER?

Being dumb is one thing, but being dumb as well as blind to what is happening is another. That's your stance, not mine. Oh well.

My initial post on this thread was to ask why UKIP are getting so much media exposure. Indeed as I type this, Farage is on question time for the 15th time. 15th! Why is this? His party has no mp's.
And I'll say agaain, ask anyone who posts on here regularly, I am always attacking the government and am much derided for it. So don't say I'm attacking the wrong people.

Edited by nickgusset (08 May 2014 10.59pm)

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Penge Eagle Beckenham 08 May 14 11.19pm
Like UKIP or not, you have to admit that Nigel Farage is impressive in the way he comes across. Unlike the other leaders, he has had a real job and not gone from education into public office. He wants best for the country - I don't think Cameron, Milliband and Clegg give a s***!
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Penge Eagle

Beckenham 08 May 14 11.19pm

Like UKIP or not, you have to admit that Nigel Farage is impressive in the way he comes across. Unlike the other leaders, he has had a real job and not gone from education into public office. He wants best for the country - I don't think Cameron, Milliband and Clegg give a s***!

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 08 May 14 11.20pm
Quote Penge Eagle at 08 May 2014 11.19pm Like UKIP or not, you have to admit that Nigel Farage is impressive in the way he comes across. Unlike the other leaders, he has had a real job and not gone from education into public office. He wants best for the country - I don't think Cameron, Milliband and Clegg give a s***! He is a front for a group that want to reduce taxes for the rich and want to further reduce workers rights. That's just the tip of the iceberg.
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 08 May 14 11.20pm

Quote Penge Eagle at 08 May 2014 11.19pm

He is a front for a group that want to reduce taxes for the rich and want to further reduce workers rights. That's just the tip of the iceberg.

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serial thriller The Promised Land 09 May 14 1.46am
Quote TUX at 08 May 2014 8.37pm And it's this lack of viewing human beings as actual human beings - living, caring, unfortunate creatures - that winds me up. Instead they are reduced to a sort of caricatured number on a sheet, proof of and intrinsic solution to our social issues, and most of all a threat to YOUR lifestyle. --------------------------------------- Serial Thriller. With all due respect bud, this is how the current protagonists view the poor that are already here. How did you miss that? For example, 'The bedroom tax', brought in by THOSE CURRENTLY IN POWER. They pick on the poor/claimants as that will appease the majority. It's a vote winner yeah? This stance was never going to work due to the intricacies of local Councils, ie a lack of bloody housing! This ridiculous idea has cost 'the majority in favour of picking on those less fortunate than themselves' many millions without them knowing it. Why has it gone 'under the radar', because it would make all the dumb look even dumber for believing what they were told to believe in the first place. So I'll say it again, it's so much easier to attack a minority that has NO POWER AND NO AFFECT ON ANYONE (and never will have) than standing up to a main party who currently HAS POWER! Why bang on about what 'may happen' if you're not prepared to bang on about what IS CURRENTLY HAPPENING under a different banner? With the greatest respect, I have as much contempt for the Tories/Labour/Lib Dems as I do for UKIP. I just see through all this nonsense rhetoric that UKIP are somehow different to the rest. They are exactly the same, as I comfortably predict will be shown should they ever get in to a position of genuine authority. Their deputy leader has claimed he is opposed to the NHS, their leader is a former fcking stock broker FFS! The supposed 'people's party' when one of their 6 MEPs is the Earl of fcking Dartmouth! It's a pretty hilarious joke really, except so many people willingly gulp up the 'we're different to the rest' bollocks. I'll be voting Green at the Euro and local elections, because I agree with them on many key policy issues, mainly the environment and an end to austerity, but also as a protest vote. Because I see the Green's economic and social arguments as at least an alternative from the others. Once you remove the principle withdrawal from the European Union aspect of UKIP (which to be fair is the one major policy they have) they are basically just a bunch of right wing tories, nothing remarkable or revolutionary about them. Oh and finally, think Johnny mentioned something about 1979, which reminded me of this incredible graph I saw today. Not sure of its reliability or not, but if it is accurate it is pretty remarkable! [Link] EDIT just realised that graph is probably based on America. Having said that wouldn't be surprised if the figures weren't incredibly similar for this country in that time period as well. Edited by serial thriller (09 May 2014 1.49am) If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4
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serial thriller

The Promised Land 09 May 14 1.46am

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Quote TUX at 08 May 2014 8.37pm

And it's this lack of viewing human beings as actual human beings - living, caring, unfortunate creatures - that winds me up. Instead they are reduced to a sort of caricatured number on a sheet, proof of and intrinsic solution to our social issues, and most of all a threat to YOUR lifestyle.
---------------------------------------

Serial Thriller.

With all due respect bud, this is how the current protagonists view the poor that are already here. How did you miss that?
For example, 'The bedroom tax', brought in by THOSE CURRENTLY IN POWER. They pick on the poor/claimants as that will appease the majority. It's a vote winner yeah? This stance was never going to work due to the intricacies of local Councils, ie a lack of bloody housing! This ridiculous idea has cost 'the majority in favour of picking on those less fortunate than themselves' many millions without them knowing it. Why has it gone 'under the radar', because it would make all the dumb look even dumber for believing what they were told to believe in the first place.
So I'll say it again, it's so much easier to attack a minority that has NO POWER AND NO AFFECT ON ANYONE (and never will have) than standing up to a main party who currently HAS POWER!

Why bang on about what 'may happen' if you're not prepared to bang on about what IS CURRENTLY HAPPENING under a different banner?

With the greatest respect, I have as much contempt for the Tories/Labour/Lib Dems as I do for UKIP. I just see through all this nonsense rhetoric that UKIP are somehow different to the rest. They are exactly the same, as I comfortably predict will be shown should they ever get in to a position of genuine authority. Their deputy leader has claimed he is opposed to the NHS, their leader is a former f*cking stock broker FFS! The supposed 'people's party' when one of their 6 MEPs is the Earl of f*cking Dartmouth! It's a pretty hilarious joke really, except so many people willingly gulp up the 'we're different to the rest' bollocks.

I'll be voting Green at the Euro and local elections, because I agree with them on many key policy issues, mainly the environment and an end to austerity, but also as a protest vote. Because I see the Green's economic and social arguments as at least an alternative from the others. Once you remove the principle withdrawal from the European Union aspect of UKIP (which to be fair is the one major policy they have) they are basically just a bunch of right wing tories, nothing remarkable or revolutionary about them.

Oh and finally, think Johnny mentioned something about 1979, which reminded me of this incredible graph I saw today. Not sure of its reliability or not, but if it is accurate it is pretty remarkable!

[Link]

EDIT just realised that graph is probably based on America. Having said that wouldn't be surprised if the figures weren't incredibly similar for this country in that time period as well.

Edited by serial thriller (09 May 2014 1.49am)

If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4

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matt_himself Matataland 09 May 14 6.32am
Quote nickgusset at 08 May 2014 11.20pm Quote Penge Eagle at 08 May 2014 11.19pm Like UKIP or not, you have to admit that Nigel Farage is impressive in the way he comes across. Unlike the other leaders, he has had a real job and not gone from education into public office. He wants best for the country - I don't think Cameron, Milliband and Clegg give a s***! He is a front for a group that want to reduce taxes for the rich and want to further reduce workers rights. That's just the tip of the iceberg. You have become a left wing Daily Mail. Bleating out random paranoid 'facts' about the danger of UKIP. How long until you assert that 'Farage gives you cancer'? "That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02
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matt_himself

Matataland 09 May 14 6.32am

Quote nickgusset at 08 May 2014 11.20pm

Quote Penge Eagle at 08 May 2014 11.19pm

He is a front for a group that want to reduce taxes for the rich and want to further reduce workers rights. That's just the tip of the iceberg.

You have become a left wing Daily Mail. Bleating out random paranoid 'facts' about the danger of UKIP. How long until you assert that 'Farage gives you cancer'?

"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02

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dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 09 May 14 6.56am
Simply put, he is saying what the other two skid marks refuse point blank to do. His party is becoming more appealing, the more wishy washy and nondescript labour and conservatives get, the more popular someone with clear definitions will be. I think they are going to shock a few come election time. "It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"
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dannyh

wherever I lay my hat....... 09 May 14 6.56am

Simply put, he is saying what the other two skid marks refuse point blank to do.

His party is becoming more appealing, the more wishy washy and nondescript labour and conservatives get, the more popular someone with clear definitions will be.

I think they are going to shock a few come election time.

"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

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Kermit8 Hevon 09 May 14 8.27am
Quote matt_himself at 09 May 2014 6.32am Quote nickgusset at 08 May 2014 11.20pm Quote Penge Eagle at 08 May 2014 11.19pm Like UKIP or not, you have to admit that Nigel Farage is impressive in the way he comes across. Unlike the other leaders, he has had a real job and not gone from education into public office. He wants best for the country - I don't think Cameron, Milliband and Clegg give a s***! He is a front for a group that want to reduce taxes for the rich and want to further reduce workers rights. That's just the tip of the iceberg. You have become a left wing Daily Mail. Bleating out random paranoid 'facts' about the danger of UKIP. How long until you assert that 'Farage gives you cancer'? Genuine chortle. They could well be an unwitting Trojan horse for those with real and dangerous right wing beliefs in the future once they get a small foothold. As it is at the moment Farage is as dangerous as my wife shopping n the sales. It's what comes after him. The snooker analogy: always think five moves ahead. They've set out their initial stall. Not quite sure how it will evolve but purely from an historical perspective better not to take any chances imo with helping a party which could easily swing much further to the right gain some actual power. Having bordering on extreme politicians in the Houses of Commons IF they end up having real power somehow one day will only make the country even more divided and ill at ease with itself. If one genuinely cares for one's country and what is best for it long-term surely avoiding that is the way to go? I don't see how having very right wing politicians making decisions will help. Edited by Kermit8 (09 May 2014 11.37am) Big chest and massive boobs [Link]
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Kermit8

Hevon 09 May 14 8.27am

Quote matt_himself at 09 May 2014 6.32am

Quote nickgusset at 08 May 2014 11.20pm

Quote Penge Eagle at 08 May 2014 11.19pm

He is a front for a group that want to reduce taxes for the rich and want to further reduce workers rights. That's just the tip of the iceberg.

You have become a left wing Daily Mail. Bleating out random paranoid 'facts' about the danger of UKIP. How long until you assert that 'Farage gives you cancer'?

Genuine chortle.

They could well be an unwitting Trojan horse for those with real and dangerous right wing beliefs in the future once they get a small foothold. As it is at the moment Farage is as dangerous as my wife shopping n the sales. It's what comes after him. The snooker analogy: always think five moves ahead.

They've set out their initial stall. Not quite sure how it will evolve but purely from an historical perspective better not to take any chances imo with helping a party which could easily swing much further to the right gain some actual power.

Having bordering on extreme politicians in the Houses of Commons IF they end up having real power somehow one day will only make the country even more divided and ill at ease with itself.

If one genuinely cares for one's country and what is best for it long-term surely avoiding that is the way to go? I don't see how having very right wing politicians making decisions will help.

Edited by Kermit8 (09 May 2014 11.37am)

Big chest and massive boobs

[Link]

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 09 May 14 8.28am
Quote matt_himself at 09 May 2014 6.32am Quote nickgusset at 08 May 2014 11.20pm Quote Penge Eagle at 08 May 2014 11.19pm Like UKIP or not, you have to admit that Nigel Farage is impressive in the way he comes across. Unlike the other leaders, he has had a real job and not gone from education into public office. He wants best for the country - I don't think Cameron, Milliband and Clegg give a s***! He is a front for a group that want to reduce taxes for the rich and want to further reduce workers rights. That's just the tip of the iceberg. You have become a left wing Daily Mail. Bleating out random paranoid 'facts' about the danger of UKIP. How long until you assert that 'Farage gives you cancer'? Why have you put facts in inverted commas. They are facts. Look at their policies.
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 09 May 14 8.28am

Quote matt_himself at 09 May 2014 6.32am

Quote nickgusset at 08 May 2014 11.20pm

Quote Penge Eagle at 08 May 2014 11.19pm

He is a front for a group that want to reduce taxes for the rich and want to further reduce workers rights. That's just the tip of the iceberg.

You have become a left wing Daily Mail. Bleating out random paranoid 'facts' about the danger of UKIP. How long until you assert that 'Farage gives you cancer'?

Why have you put facts in inverted commas. They are facts. Look at their policies.

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matt_himself Matataland 09 May 14 9.36am
Quote nickgusset at 09 May 2014 8.28am Quote matt_himself at 09 May 2014 6.32am Quote nickgusset at 08 May 2014 11.20pm Quote Penge Eagle at 08 May 2014 11.19pm Like UKIP or not, you have to admit that Nigel Farage is impressive in the way he comes across. Unlike the other leaders, he has had a real job and not gone from education into public office. He wants best for the country - I don't think Cameron, Milliband and Clegg give a s***! He is a front for a group that want to reduce taxes for the rich and want to further reduce workers rights. That's just the tip of the iceberg. You have become a left wing Daily Mail. Bleating out random paranoid 'facts' about the danger of UKIP. How long until you assert that 'Farage gives you cancer'? Why have you put facts in inverted commas. They are facts. Look at their policies. I have looked through their Local and European Manifesto and also the overview document of policies on their website. No mention of anything you state above, in fact, policies that point to the contrary. For example, removing tax on minimum wage. For example, making it easier for small businesses to trade. However, I have found what I believe to be the true source of your prejudice - they want to make it easier for schools to sack bad teachers. Turkeys won't vote for Christmas. please do point out where I should look on their website, on their published manifestos for the notions you are pushing. Thank you. "That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02
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matt_himself

Matataland 09 May 14 9.36am

Quote nickgusset at 09 May 2014 8.28am

Quote matt_himself at 09 May 2014 6.32am

Quote nickgusset at 08 May 2014 11.20pm

Quote Penge Eagle at 08 May 2014 11.19pm

He is a front for a group that want to reduce taxes for the rich and want to further reduce workers rights. That's just the tip of the iceberg.

You have become a left wing Daily Mail. Bleating out random paranoid 'facts' about the danger of UKIP. How long until you assert that 'Farage gives you cancer'?

Why have you put facts in inverted commas. They are facts. Look at their policies.

I have looked through their Local and European Manifesto and also the overview document of policies on their website. No mention of anything you state above, in fact, policies that point to the contrary. For example, removing tax on minimum wage. For example, making it easier for small businesses to trade.

However, I have found what I believe to be the true source of your prejudice - they want to make it easier for schools to sack bad teachers. Turkeys won't vote for Christmas.

please do point out where I should look on their website, on their published manifestos for the notions you are pushing. Thank you.

"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02

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Johnny Eagles berlin 09 May 14 10.27am
Quote serial thriller at 09 May 2014 1.46am EDIT just realised that graph is probably based on America. Having said that wouldn't be surprised if the figures weren't incredibly similar for this country in that time period as well. The loony left on here just doesn't have the rigour it used to. Where's the White Horse when you need a graph which actually supports the point you're attempting to make? ...we must expand...get more pupils...so that the knowledge will spread...
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Johnny Eagles

berlin 09 May 14 10.27am

Quote serial thriller at 09 May 2014 1.46am

EDIT just realised that graph is probably based on America. Having said that wouldn't be surprised if the figures weren't incredibly similar for this country in that time period as well.

The loony left on here just doesn't have the rigour it used to.

Where's the White Horse when you need a graph which actually supports the point you're attempting to make?

...we must expand...get more pupils...so that the knowledge will spread...

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Johnny Eagles berlin 09 May 14 10.41am
Quote Kermit8 at 09 May 2014 8.27am They could well be an unwitting Trojan horse for those with real and dangerous right wing beliefs in the future once they get a small foothold. Not quite sure how it will evolve but purely from an historical perspective better not to take any chances imo with helping a party which could easily swing much further to the right gain some actual power. Having bordering on extreme politicians I'm a bit puzzled, Kermit. On the one hand you say they are extremists, on the other hand that they are an unwitting Trojan Horse. A lot of your opposition to UKIP seems based on the premise that they are extremist, dangerous, right-wing, etc. Yet you and Nick and Serial and Willo haven't actually offered much substance to back up this assertion. It smacks of fear-mongering to be honest. ...we must expand...get more pupils...so that the knowledge will spread...
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Johnny Eagles

berlin 09 May 14 10.41am

Quote Kermit8 at 09 May 2014 8.27am

They could well be an unwitting Trojan horse for those with real and dangerous right wing beliefs in the future once they get a small foothold.

Not quite sure how it will evolve but purely from an historical perspective better not to take any chances imo with helping a party which could easily swing much further to the right gain some actual power.

Having bordering on extreme politicians

I'm a bit puzzled, Kermit. On the one hand you say they are extremists, on the other hand that they are an unwitting Trojan Horse.

A lot of your opposition to UKIP seems based on the premise that they are extremist, dangerous, right-wing, etc. Yet you and Nick and Serial and Willo haven't actually offered much substance to back up this assertion.

It smacks of fear-mongering to be honest.

...we must expand...get more pupils...so that the knowledge will spread...

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 09 May 14 10.54am
Quote Johnny Eagles at 09 May 2014 10.41am Quote Kermit8 at 09 May 2014 8.27am They could well be an unwitting Trojan horse for those with real and dangerous right wing beliefs in the future once they get a small foothold. Not quite sure how it will evolve but purely from an historical perspective better not to take any chances imo with helping a party which could easily swing much further to the right gain some actual power. Having bordering on extreme politicians I'm a bit puzzled, Kermit. On the one hand you say they are extremists, on the other hand that they are an unwitting Trojan Horse. A lot of your opposition to UKIP seems based on the premise that they are extremist, dangerous, right-wing, etc. Yet you and Nick and Serial and Willo haven't actually offered much substance to back up this assertion. It smacks of fear-mongering to be honest. Well funnily enough, I can't find anywhere on the ukip site that they want to scrap the right to paid holiday, maternity pay and want to introduce a flat rate of tax which benefits high earners but penalises the low paid. However I have seen these assertions on many other sites.
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 09 May 14 10.54am

Quote Johnny Eagles at 09 May 2014 10.41am

Quote Kermit8 at 09 May 2014 8.27am

They could well be an unwitting Trojan horse for those with real and dangerous right wing beliefs in the future once they get a small foothold.

Having bordering on extreme politicians

I'm a bit puzzled, Kermit. On the one hand you say they are extremists, on the other hand that they are an unwitting Trojan Horse.

It smacks of fear-mongering to be honest.

Well funnily enough, I can't find anywhere on the ukip site that they want to scrap the right to paid holiday, maternity pay and want to introduce a flat rate of tax which benefits high earners but penalises the low paid.
However I have seen these assertions on many other sites.

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